Will this level of cases now just be acceptable?

[Tuba437]

Just having a think to myself. We're now at around 30k cases a day in general. The 7 day average daily deaths is about 89 (this was for around 45-50k cases a day). We can assume that I a month or so deaths will be at around 60 a day.

Over a year that works out at about 21k worth of deaths. Will this just be the acceptable number. We know the vaccine doesn't stop the spread so I highly doubt were ever just going to get down to sub 5k cases a day again.

21k is considered a very mild flu death rate for the year. We have a new virus around now so more deaths a year are going to be a thing whether we like it or not.

I also think red list countries should only be for countries with worrying variants. If I don't have to isolate if my wife tests positive (just daily testing) then why on earth would I have to spend 1500 on a government hotel to quarantine as I've been to a country with a lower covid rate than us?

Sorry about the rant.

These posters are probably the type that I have encountered on the street. Rather throw themselves into the road nearly getting run over just because I may need to pass them on to the pavement. Logical thinking has gone out of the window.

Or violently launch themselves into a fridge in a supermarket. Whilst shopping with family I must add.

Doesn't it depend what you mean by social distancing?

So on holiday, we wouldn't want to go into a crowded restaurant, but are much more comfortable sitting outside having a drink in a sort of extended gazebo by the riverside on a fine evening, with saved out tables

Funny enough our preferences seem to be shared by a number of other people.

Clearly the restaurant sensibly has made the provision to cater for people's preferences in the pandemic.

That is common sense and good business sense.

(Not sure for the need for a snarky tome @MarshaBradyo)

*Of course we shouldn't be keeping distance from other people- if we weren't in a pandemic.

Since we are in one, it remains a good idea -if we don't want to be infected ourselves and don't want to infect other people.*

How do you define 'being in a pandemic'?

The virus is here to stay. Happily we have a very effective vaccination programme which has done a lot to minimise severe illness and worse.

Social distancing makes thousands of businesses completely unviable, and massively complicates normal human activities like education, socialising, family life and much more. Nothing stopping you from 'distancing' as much as you like, but we've gone past the point where it has to be imposed on everyone.

But your post neatly illustrates the phenonemon I was dicussing above. Those who casually say 'we should just keep masks' never actually mean we should 'just' do that.

Alot of people I know work with children and what do you think they do when a tiny five year old is crying because they are hurt or upset? Would these posters ignore that child and let them cry?

Honestly, I'm so sorry to spell this out but seriously. This cannot continue.

that should be spaced out tables and snarky tone.

So on holiday, we wouldn't want to go into a crowded restaurant, but are much more comfortable sitting outside having a drink in a sort of extended gazebo by the riverside on a fine evening, with saved out tables

In which case you're free to feel comfortalbe in the extended gazebo. It just shouldn't be imposed on businesses, many of which won't be fortunate enough to have extended gazebos by riversides, much less 'fine' weather in which to use them.

Herecomesthesun, but you actively went out to a public place. I find it ironic that you want to social distance but only if everyone abides by your rules. That's not fair is it?

People can choose what they are comfortable with - of course they can

But yes when posters say we all should do the same it’s not welcomed

Are you going to support local businesses in winter in a gazebo? In the depths of December?

@IcedPurple

*Of course we shouldn't be keeping distance from other people- if we weren't in a pandemic.

Since we are in one, it remains a good idea -if we don't want to be infected ourselves and don't want to infect other people.*

How do you define 'being in a pandemic'?

The virus is here to stay. Happily we have a very effective vaccination programme which has done a lot to minimise severe illness and worse.

Social distancing makes thousands of businesses completely unviable, and massively complicates normal human activities like education, socialising, family life and much more. Nothing stopping you from 'distancing' as much as you like, but we've gone past the point where it has to be imposed on everyone.

But your post neatly illustrates the phenonemon I was dicussing above. Those who casually say 'we should just keep masks' never actually mean we should 'just' do that.

Well I think masks are quite practical, especially in a crowded situation,

And it would be quite difficult to go on holiday and keep 2 m from everyone else.

But a bit of space, where it is practical, is a good idea.

Presumably businesses like the chain I mentioned, are doing their best to keep their customers safe and take their reasonable preferences into account?

Because I am going to shop at ones that make me feel comfortable.

Notice I am not saying this should be an edict imposed by law, just saying this is something that sensible people will be considering for a while.

Especially over the coming winter, which Whitty & Van Tam expect to be a difficult one for covid and other infectious respiratory illnesses.

@Peteycat

Are you going to support local businesses in winter in a gazebo? In the depths of December?

I will support those local businesses that I can.

I might conceivably have a coffee (or a gluhwein ) while out shopping in a heated, ventilated outdoor area. The gazebo thing we were in yesterday was the most substantial and solid looking thing of it's kind I have ever seen, it was very well set up and we were speculating that it could be heated and kept going in colder weather.

Not going inside for any length of time, non.

In which case you're free to feel comfortalbe in the extended gazebo. It just shouldn't be imposed on businesses

Exactly

We need to shift the thinking here. This is not some brief emergency period anymore, it’s the rest of our lives.

Giving people more choices is great, but dictating what others do so that you feel more ‘comfortable’ isn’t acceptable anymore.

I don’t think about SD anymore.

If other people want to of course it’s up to them.

But I don’t find it sensible particularly- it has to be a choice people make without being urged

Presumably businesses like the chain I mentioned, are doing their best to keep their customers safe and take their reasonable preferences into account?

People have always enjoyed dining outdoors in summer. It may or may not have anyting to do with being 'safe'. But not all businesses have riverside gazebos they can use, especially coming into winter. Those thousands of businesses should be allowed to operate - if anyone doesn't feel 'comfortable' using them, nobody is forcing them to do so.

Because I am going to shop at ones that make me feel comfortable.

And absolutely nobody is going to stop you from doing that. So long as you don't impose your personal ideas of being 'sensible' on anyone else, that's fine.

Masks are definitely not practical. Especially if you wear glasses or a hearing aid.

@MarshaBradyo

People can choose what they are comfortable with - of course they can

But yes when posters say we all should do the same it’s not welcomed

Only people who are worried about getting infected or infecting other people of course.

No edict.

People who aren't bothered much either way will do as they please of course?

I don’t need my behaviour to be over later with any interpretation from someone else - so no I don’t agree with how you put it

In the same way you don’t like being told your behaviour isn’t right for you.

Time for us to stop commenting on other people’s decisions

@Peteycat

Masks are definitely not practical. Especially if you wear glasses or a hearing aid.

I can't speak about a hearing aid.

I wear glasses though, blind as a bat without.

I wear a mask which pinches in at the nose & I have taken it off if someone can't hear me.

& I don't wear one most of the time, only in a crowd, indoors etc. Which isn't that often as I don't spend that much time in those situations,

Lated - layed

@TheKeatingFive

In which case you're free to feel comfortalbe in the extended gazebo. It just shouldn't be imposed on businesses

Exactly

We need to shift the thinking here. This is not some brief emergency period anymore, it’s the rest of our lives.

Giving people more choices is great, but dictating what others do so that you feel more ‘comfortable’ isn’t acceptable anymore.

Not dictating anything.

Just a point of view, like yours.

@Peteycat

Are you going to support local businesses in winter in a gazebo? In the depths of December?

Quite.

I'm at the point where if it's genuinely pleasant to eat outside I will as I probably would have anyway, otherwise it's indoors as usual. Extra outdoors provision is no bad thing as an option but the reality was that until indoor venues could properly reopen in mid-May, many were running shortened, short notice hours around the weather forecast and daylight based on the likelihood of having enough turnover to be worth opening.

Capacities are still being managed and pre-booking most indoor activities instead of being able to turn up casually is still inhibiting.
While I'm happy to give a bit of personal space in something like a queue, places like pubs can't afford to function on a fraction of capacity.
We're at a stage where people are free to make their choices and consider their own risk:benefit.

The people I know in RL who think that there should be enforced restrictions such as WFH, closure of non-essential indoor facilities, mandatory masking etc happen to be very insular and like nothing better than a quiet life at home, punctuated by a few walks or a trip to the allotment. Nothing wrong in itself, but in this context they are expecting everyone else to make the sacrifices while making very little themselves.

@Peteycat

Herecomesthesun, but you actively went out to a public place. I find it ironic that you want to social distance but only if everyone abides by your rules. That's not fair is it?

Don't you want people to shop and go to restaurants?

what about all the ... businesses?

or could there be a middle, sensible ground where people do what they can to spend time with their family and enjoy life, largely avoiding crowded indoor spaces, and choosing safer options where they can enjoy food etc?

I have largely not said that anyone else has to abide by what I do, just that being ... sensible is a good idea in a ... pandemic.

sensible is a good idea in a ... pandemic.

And people can say it’s not what they’d call sensible nor a good idea any longer.

or could there be a middle, sensible ground where people do what they can to spend time with their family and enjoy life, largely avoiding crowded indoor spaces, and choosing safer options where they can enjoy food etc?

Has a single person here said you shouldn't do that, if you wish?

I have largely not said that anyone else has to abide by what I do, just that being ... sensible is a good idea in a ... pandemic.

Who made you the 'sensible' police?