Anti-lockdowners pretending to care about kids again

[noblegiraffe]

So it's all over the news about how nearly 400,000 kids are having to isolate because of covid cases in schools. Complaints about how disruptive to education it is and to the mental health of the children involved. This disruptive isolation must end as soon as possible.

Contrast to last November when nearly a million kids were self-isolating in a week. Do you remember the headlines, discussions and outrage about that?

No, of course you don't. Because back then, the solution to so many kids isolating was to put more mitigation measures in schools and attempt to stop so many kids catching it.

Now they can argue that it doesn't matter if all kids catch it, they're all over the 'terrible' isolation figures which are less than half of those last year.

I'm SO done with people only caring about kids and education when they think that they can use them for their own benefit.

If these loud voices could be used to talk about things like the cuts to pupil premium, the pitiful covid catch-up funding, the critical shortage of teachers, the unsafe state of schools, the massive waiting lists for CAMHS and SEN services, then maybe I'd believe them when they claim to care about children.

Vaccination and masks I agree with although I think a) kids don't wear them properly and b) once vaccinated masks should become less essential

@herecomesthsun I don’t think I asked a question but in reply to your post our schools were still wearing masks. Doesn’t appear to have made much difference as we are recording high numbers of infections per day.

My daughters teacher chose not to wear hers in class, right enough.

@TeddingtonTrashbag

Chillychangchoo

@christinarossetti19

I think maybe your own critical thinking skills are lacking if all you can do is blindly follow what one individual has to say. It’s sycophantic and slightly embarrassing.
Especially when epithets such as ‘prophetic’ are used!
Like girl crush on the 6th former who spouts similar tosh.

But noble's letter was prophetic.

She foresaw that people would have to quarantine over xmas and that schools would be closed completely (aside from keyworker children) if action wasn't taken.

That's actually what happened.

Paediatrician shares on Twitter that even professor Semple of Sage says risks of Covid to children are very low and wouldn’t justify vaccinating them. This includes the risk of the much vaunted long Covid.

So who made the decisions to vaccinate teenagers in other counties then? Presumably someone equally qualified.

It doesn’t matter what is said, I know some people won’t be happy until even newborns are vaccinated.

But who does it protect if children aren’t at risk and the vulnerable are vaccinated?

Um, the headline doesn't really convey Prof Semple's argument.

He says, “I’m not convinced that the evidence base there is strong enough to support vaccination of children because we don’t have complete safety data for the vaccines that we would want to use.”

So it's the lack of safety data, not that covid vaccine isn't desirable for children, that is informing his cautious stance (fair enough).

And there's no link to this 'rock solid data' or what it actually shows about the impact on children.

From what I understand, there are trials going on about which vaccine is best for children, at what age etc. All more complicated than adult trials for ethical reasons and the wish have more safety data to base decisions is shared amongst scientists.

edition.cnn.com/2021/06/13/health/myocarditis-covid-vaccine-questions-answers/index.html Padiatricians share on CNN that they think the risk of complications like myocarditis from covid far outweigh the risks from the vaccine.

"How do young people do when they get Covid-19?

....When young people developed myocarditis following vaccination, the numbers were small, and they weren't very sick.

While most young people who develop Covid-19 are fine, some do develop complications and even die from the infection.

As of June 9, 2,637 people under age 30 have had deaths that involved Covid-19, according to the CDC. As of June 5, preliminary data shows 3,110 people under the age of 18 have been hospitalized, a number the CDC says is likely an underestimate.

Berger and Hall [senior American paediatricians] have each taken care of dozens of Covid patients.

"Some of them spent weeks in the intensive care unit. They had poor heart function. They had acute infections that were completely preventable by the vaccine," Berger said.

Even if they recovered, some have had long-term illnesses.
"We do remain concerned about these children in the long term," Hall said. "We have seen some with persistent changes in their cardiac testing. This is a very serious disease.""

That’s not the view of respected paediatricians here.

But, hey, best not stop until even new burn babies are vaccinated 🤷🏻‍♀️

(And I’m not anti vaxx, far from it. Double jagged and my dcs have had all their shots)

1. this isn't about newborns, this is primarily about 12-15s.

1. there are also respected doctors over here who think vaccination for children is a good idea. It is a debate., with very good arguments in favour of vaccination.

Personally, I think we should be offering vaccinations to children and families that want it because the alternative of getting covid is most likely more risky, especially for the "oh but they had medical conditions" kids. You know, the ones that people think don't count in the stats because "oh but they had medical conditions".

@herecomesthsun

1. this isn't about newborns, this is primarily about 12-15s.

1. there are also respected doctors over here who think vaccination for children is a good idea. It is a debate., with very good arguments in favour of vaccination.

Personally, I think we should be offering vaccinations to children and families that want it because the alternative of getting covid is most likely more risky, especially for the "oh but they had medical conditions" kids. You know, the ones that people think don't count in the stats because "oh but they had medical conditions".

Theres also very good arguments against it too!

Agreed i think if some children want it it should be available, but I fear it'll go the same way as the adults vaccines have with the us and them divide. You'll get hysterical parents wanting to alienate some of their dc friends who haven't been vaccinated just the same as others say they won't converse with those dirty unvaccinated adults now. Every one has a right to choose if they want to be vaccinated or not without having to justify their decision either way. The social pressure on vaccines has been horrendous.

The balance of risk is entirely different in clinically vulnerable children. Vaccinating them is a different decision.

@mog27

The "anti lockdown" people I know who've been to every protest have been against these measures from the start. Maybe people are jumping on the bandwagon or starting to realise that isolating is a farce when footballers don't have to do it but children do?

My thoughts exactly.

I've been against the measures from the start of this. More and more people now, 18 months in, are starting to see for what it really is.

The more that people do, for whatever reason, it can only be a positive outcome and to stop all this shower of shite once and for all.

According to The Telegraph 'Prof Robert Dingwall, a member of the JCVI, said that allowing children to catch Covid may be better than exposing them to the "risk" of vaccination.'

Meanwhile 'Prof John Edmunds, a scientist on the SAGE, said he thought that Britain should not fully reopen until all secondary school pupils had been vaccinated.'

As a professor of nothing at all, I wonder if we shouldn't cautiously approve vaccines for 12+ and leave it up to the individuals and their carers.

YY to watching the crowds at the football while children are being sent home left, right and centre.

Absolute madness.

But who does it protect if children aren’t at risk and the vulnerable are vaccinated?

Well at a guess, CEV and CV children?

I think they should prioritise approving the vaccines for over 12s for the CEV children. Then it could maybe be optional and you make your own assessment.

Some children, although not CEV may have asthma, or had pneumonia in the past. They may pick up every bug going. Everyone’s situation is different.

I would not choose it for my 12 year old DS, who for whatever reason has not had a single day off school sick ever. I’ve had flu, norovirus, other random viruses and he never picks them up. All children are different and therefore the risk/benefit is different.

This is probably why I also wanted mine to stay in school even when cases were high. We all want what’s best for our children. I know it would be a different story altogether if I have a CEV child.

I think they should prioritise approving the vaccines for over 12s for the CEV children

Definitely yes. And CV children too.

We haven't enough supply to do every child in the UK, but we should surely manage to get vulnerable children jabbed. Obviously that's only over 12s for now, until vaccines are approved for younger ones.

[quote Chillychangchoo]@ichundich

It will be …. “But not all the children have been vaccinated”. We must close the bubble. We must enforce some mitigations. (That are on the whole not effective, but we do like to use this word an awful lot).

You’re right, for some people it will never be enough. For lots of other normal folk who like to get on with their lives and try and regain a sense of normality, it will be enough.

Apparently the second type of person is “pretending to care about children”. Come off it!!

Never heard so much nonsense on here to be honest.[/quote]
Hear hear

Mitigation is the buzz word.
Now it's developing into 'pretending to care', obviously only the teachers that want extra mitigation care.

But who does it protect if children aren’t at risk and the vulnerable are vaccinated?

Their parents. (And wider family, teachers, etc).

Oh, and there's Long Covid. Clearly some children are at risk. Otherwise we wouldn't need the 15 paediatric Long Covid clinics being set up.

The real problem here in the UK is that we don't have enough supply of mRNA vaccines to do children and give boosters for the vulnerable. Both are needed really so until we get hold of additional supplies, it's a difficult choice.

www.theguardian.com/society/2021/may/03/its-terrifying-parents-struggle-to-get-help-for-children-with-long-covid

Delatron my DD is like this.
She shared a bed and water bottle with Simone with Covid (obviously she didn’t know at the time ). Two PCR tests - negative.

*someone - poor Simone is innocent

Parents and teachers are or will be vaccinated.

And it’s just not a serious illness in people who are not very old.

@HelloMissus it’s strange isn’t it? (But good!) I think he gets it from my DH. He’s never sick.

That’s amazing about your DD. You couldn’t get much closer than sharing a water bottle!

I guess some children have very good immune systems. I’m jealous!

@Bryonyshcmyony

Mitigations are masks, bubbles, cancelled clubs/Leavers dos/exams/sports days aren't they? All of which we've done

Not enough by far for some on here, apparently. If we don't agree we are only pretending to care to suit ourselves. According to some teachers, only they really care 🙄