Anti-lockdowners pretending to care about kids again

[noblegiraffe]

So it's all over the news about how nearly 400,000 kids are having to isolate because of covid cases in schools. Complaints about how disruptive to education it is and to the mental health of the children involved. This disruptive isolation must end as soon as possible.

Contrast to last November when nearly a million kids were self-isolating in a week. Do you remember the headlines, discussions and outrage about that?

No, of course you don't. Because back then, the solution to so many kids isolating was to put more mitigation measures in schools and attempt to stop so many kids catching it.

Now they can argue that it doesn't matter if all kids catch it, they're all over the 'terrible' isolation figures which are less than half of those last year.

I'm SO done with people only caring about kids and education when they think that they can use them for their own benefit.

If these loud voices could be used to talk about things like the cuts to pupil premium, the pitiful covid catch-up funding, the critical shortage of teachers, the unsafe state of schools, the massive waiting lists for CAMHS and SEN services, then maybe I'd believe them when they claim to care about children.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jun/29/the-guardian-view-on-schools-and-covid-falling-down

Guardian editorial today about this problem that correctly identifies the government's failure to start vaccinating the over-12s with a vaccine that has already been approved for them as an underlying cause and ongoing issue that will be too late to address in September. It needs addressing now. Just because some parents don't want to vaccinate their children, doesn't mean all parents should be prevented. CV and CEV children deserve vaccine protection, teachers would be better protected by over-12s being fully vaccinated in September, and education would be improved.

The government is promoting anti-vaxx ideology by saying they are waiting for data to assess the benefits and risks. The MHRA has already done this - it is their job to do this and they are far more qualified than the cabinet to do this. MHRA has approved the vaccine for all over-12s.

Oh, so now we’re on the “vaccinate all children?!”

Not the point.

Also, why on earth would we?

@grabajab

Oh my, is that the next narrative? Teachers will feel unsafe come September because despite themselves being fully vaccinated, they will not feel “fully safe” until all the children have been vaccinated.

Goodness me I’ve heard it all now.

I would want the vaccine for my child. She has the flu vaccine, and I don’t believe that it’s purely for her own benefit - I’ve always thought of it as more to protect those who might be vulnerable to flu and to control the rate of infection.

My niece had a PIMS reaction. I’m also reading about links being investigated between type 1 diabetes and pancreatitis.

That’s fine to make that decision for your child hornbill. I had the vaccine myself for similar reasons. Not happy with my child taking a risk for a vaccine of no benefit to him though, and it’s also extremely dubious morally.

I agree @cornflowersandpoppies.

Paediatrician Alistair Munro (sp?) on Twitter is good on this, as are other paediatricians on the risk benefit and moral dubiety

I’m also reading about links being investigated between type 1 diabetes and pancreatitis.

Where are you reading this @Hornbill123456789?

I thought the claims of childhood vaccination being linked to T1D had been thoroughly disproved, haven't heard of research suggesting association with pancreatitis though

@borntobequiet

I meant teachers weren't t hit worse than anyone else.

Who has said teachers were worse hit than anyone else? They weren’t.
However they were the only part of the workforce actually required to work in unsafe conditions without effective mitigations.

This is just so untrue! Do you really think that teachers are the only ones in unsafe working conditions?!

@speckledostrichegg a trusted source I hope!

www.diabetes.co.uk/news/2021/mar/study-launched-to-explore-potential-type-1-and-covid-19-link.html

I’ll definitely listen if you say otherwise, you’ve been a great source of info.

And here:

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/m.timesofindia.com/city/ahmedabad/recovered-covid-19-patients-now-plagued-by-pancreatitis/amp_articleshow/83792013.cms

ahh thanks for linking @Hornbill123456789 I misread your post - I thought you were referring to COVID vaccinations being linked to pancreatitis and T1 diabetes!

Yes childhood infection is definitely a risk factor for T1D in kids, as for COVID patients developing pancreatitis, that's not good if found to be causal as given more evidence for long term systemic effects (so not just lungs/heart/CNS complications). Will follow with interest...

@speckledostrichegg - do you have much info on PIMS - or if it’s related to Mesenteric Adentis?

I don't think I'd vaccinate my 15 year old actually. I'd rather wait a year or so first.

Goodness me I’ve heard it all now
@Chillychangchoo yes, but you’ll hear it again and again and again…
The same thread will be constantly re-posted under a slightly different strapline all about last November/mitigations/faux-concern —-great for MN trope-Bingo!

@Bryonyshcmyony

I don't think I'd vaccinate my 15 year old actually. I'd rather wait a year or so first.

While I'm sure they would discuss it with you, I don't think it would be up to a parent if it involves a 15 year old, would it?

@TeddingtonTrashbag

Please can you add U4T/trolling/astroturfing/personal attack/anti-lockdowner to the bingo list?

It might also be wise to chuck a few and into the game.

While I'm sure they would discuss it with you, I don't think it would be up to a parent if it involves a 15 year old, would it?

No idea. I would have thought so as my gp treats a 15 year old as a child. Obviously if dd was desperate to be vaccinated I'd respect her wishes.

[quote Chillychangchoo]@TeddingtonTrashbag

Please can you add U4T/trolling/astroturfing/personal attack/anti-lockdowner to the bingo list?

It might also be wise to chuck a few and into the game.[/quote]

@Getyourarseofffthequattro

In what way cynical and what do you mean by when it suits? Noble has been consistent in her message all along. Her OP castigates others, rightly, for changing their tune

Let's face it, nobles priority is herself, her own health, and that's fine, but then just say that rather than pretending it's about welfare of children.

It's not really about let's have mitigations so kids don't have to isolate, it's let's have mitigations so I don't catch covid off your germy kids. It's so obvious.

Yep.

Feel free to wait to vaccinate your DC, it is your choice. No-one ever said it had to be compulsory - it is not even compulsory for healthcare workers.
Just don't work to try to stop other people getting access to a vaccine they want for their DC that has already been deemed safe and effective by the highest medical regulatory authority in the country, MHRA.
And if you don't vaccinate your DC, you will at least benefit from an increased herd immunity effect, so your DC won't be missing out entirely.

@grabajab

Feel free to wait to vaccinate your DC, it is your choice. No-one ever said it had to be compulsory - it is not even compulsory for healthcare workers. Just don't work to try to stop other people getting access to a vaccine they want for their DC that has already been deemed safe and effective by the highest medical regulatory authority in the country, MHRA. And if you don't vaccinate your DC, you will at least benefit from an increased herd immunity effect, so your DC won't be missing out entirely.

Of course I wouldn't stand in the way of others doing it. I'd probably end up doing it tbh but I would rather wait. Dd18 didn't want her second dose of AZ, but was told mixing vaccines could be dangerous. Turns out it's not only fine, it may offer even better protection. So we are clearly discovering stuff all the time. No harm in waiting a bit.

@Bryonyshcmyony

Agreed. No harm in waiting a bit. I had the AZ back in March (age 32). If I had just waited a little while longer, I would have discovered that it wasn’t in fact the recommended vaccine for my age group. So it pays to wait a bit.

Anyway, it’s parental choice and nothing to do with teachers

It's nice to see that yet again when noble tries to have a discussion about covid and schools, the usual personal attacks show up.

Most teachers and parents have wanted schools open with as little disruption as possible throughout this pandemic. Most reasonable people wanted mitigation measures in place to reduce disruption to children's education and to keep everyone safe.

It's been abundantly clear throughout this pandemic that there is a group of people who want nothing more than an end to all restrictions and zero mitigation measures in place. They don't care about children, or families, or making schools safer, or disruption to education, because if they did then they'd have been in favour of a coherent strategy from government and appropriate health and safety measures months ago.