Page 4 | Cummings evidence today

palacegirl77 · 26/05/2021 11:09

Looks like Matt Hancock is being framed as the lying little tyke he is.

Monkeytennis97 · 26/05/2021 11:09

@Horehound

I want to know why, of Dominic was thinking things were going crazy and worse than expected and government still not listening, why didn't he whistleblow?he's fucking complicit.

Agree

sashagabadon · 26/05/2021 11:09

It’s fascinating listening and it is more or less what I thought was happening in number 10 in March. Bit shocked about no plans for anything at all. I think it’s probably an accurate reflection from his POV anyway. Patrick Vallance coming out well. No smoking gun as far as I can see.
I do think he wrong in his thinking on some points but he’s right that the scientists thought the peak would be in June. They did say that.
I

TruelyStruttingHotpants · 26/05/2021 11:10

Is he not just saying what everyone knows or has always suspected? I can't see anything he says about Hancock or Boris coming as a surprise or changing a thing. People know what they are like already.

the80sweregreat · 26/05/2021 11:10

He is throwing them all under the bus.
Referring to Matt Hancock as ' Hancock' ( also being incompetent) an earlier story about Carrie and her dog being more important than trying to establish if the country should lock down, various admissions of failings ( which are well documented anyway )
He is admitting he did things wrong , but he making sure that everyone else is being slated as well. He is on a mission and it's clear he hates the PM. There a few things he also ' doesn't remember' which is handy.

strangeshapedpotato · 26/05/2021 11:11

@FATEdestiny

I'm finding his narrative very believable.

I was familiar with the government pandemic planning strategy prior to covid and cross referencing that with the SAGE minutes from Jan/Feb/early Mar, it was clear that these plans were being followed to the letter. That's the main thrust of Cummings' testimony - it was the wrong plan, but who wants to oppose SAGE?

SpindleWhorl · 26/05/2021 11:11

@Horehound

I want to know why, of Dominic was thinking things were going crazy and worse than expected and government still not listening, why didn't he whistleblow?he's fucking complicit.

I think, if I have understood him rightly, he says he was outnumbered, the PM wasn't listening to him, he wasn't that powerful on his own, and he didn't have the scientific knowledge to be sure. Or something.

OnTheBoardwalk · 26/05/2021 11:11

He's winding me up now with the 'not smart' comments

The 'like a movie' quotes are also completely unacceptable

SapphosRock · 26/05/2021 11:12

Explosive stuff.

Sounds like Government was in absolute chaos, as many people suspected.

FATEdestiny · 26/05/2021 11:12

"What is it about Whitehall that promotes people to positions completely out of tgeir depth"

He specifically said he includes himself in that.

StyleAndLasers · 26/05/2021 11:12

@SpindleWhorl

If he's got records to back any of this up, it's bloody terrifying.

He isn't beyond going back and altering records though, so they fit with his current narrative, is he? I would want to scrutinise any records he has very carefully. I have to keep all my notes for my job in case of trouble further down the line, but I always wonder why such notes are considered evidence when I could always go back and change them - or write out a whole new notebook with the altered bit in it. Not that I would!

wintertravel1980 · 26/05/2021 11:12

Several of us on here, and I include myself with this, were preparing mid Jan and late Jan for covid. And warning others of what was likely to come.

But it was not the mainstream view. The only reason why the lockdown "worked" is because people bought into it. And the majority only realised the seriousness of the situation when they saw scenes from Italy. Even NZ that is getting a lot of praise for "acting early" locked down one day later than the UK.

I am almost convinced DC now believes in what he is saying but it is his version of the world highly skewed by the benefit of hindsight and the desire for "revenge".

sashagabadon · 26/05/2021 11:12

Lol! Nice dig at corbyn and Johnson and even at Rebecca long Bailey herself. Why was 2019 election choice between two incompetents!

the80sweregreat · 26/05/2021 11:14

They did say at first that the peak would be June but this was changed to Easter time once it become obvious they didn't lock us down earlier.
I also remember Boris Johnson saying it would be over in 12 weeks back in April. Hmm.
It was all a mess and absolutely zero planning ( when he was of the opinion that planning would be in place for all this)

BeastfromtheNorthEast · 26/05/2021 11:15

He's right that Corbyn v Johnson offered the public no credible or competent choice.

Proporotional representation please.

Susie477 · 26/05/2021 11:16

@FATEdestiny

I'm finding his narrative very believable.

I agree.

The fact that he is publishing documents, transcripts, WhatsApps etc as evidence to support his account of events gives him credibility.

Obviously, other people who were in the rooms at the time will have their own views.

SpindleWhorl · 26/05/2021 11:16

'The PM is already 1000 times too obsessed with the media' - said very casually.

the80sweregreat · 26/05/2021 11:16

Yeah, let's have a dig at Jeremy Corbyn.
Unbelievable really.
I hope everyone else has kept things too.

TomatoesAreFruit · 26/05/2021 11:17

I had quite an emotional response when he apologised, that he said people had died unnecessarily. No one has said that before.

Things I found interesting:

February - all key figures were skiing
Jan and Feb - government was not all focused on virus
Hancock and PPE

Did he say something about Whitty or vallance injecting someone with coronavirus on TV? I only half heard.

quiteathome · 26/05/2021 11:17

He is complicit in what happened
The government are also complicit. An enquiry is needed.
We need to learn from this.

strangeshapedpotato · 26/05/2021 11:20

@wintertravel1980

Several of us on here, and I include myself with this, were preparing mid Jan and late Jan for covid. And warning others of what was likely to come.

But it was not the mainstream view. The only reason why the lockdown "worked" is because people bought into it. And the majority only realised the seriousness of the situation when they saw scenes from Italy. Even NZ that is getting a lot of praise for "acting early" locked down one day later than the UK.

I am almost convinced DC now believes in what he is saying but it is his version of the world highly skewed by the benefit of hindsight and the desire for "revenge".

Mainstream view?

You think that things like this should be determined by popularity instead of expert leadership?! The key point is that SAGE got it totally wrong back then, and had their advice been public knowledge at the time, a lot of INFORMED EXPERTS would have been shouting from the rooftops about it. We all kept quiet assuming that everything was in hand....why wouldn't you? You don't expect that degree of incompetence from SAGE.

And NZ locked down when they needed to. We didn't. THAT's the difference between the two.

the80sweregreat · 26/05/2021 11:20

The PM offered to be injected with covid on tv. I am hoping that Chris Whitty just laughed at that one!
He caught it anyway and was very ill.
My dads care home locked down a week before the rest of the country. 12th March. Makes me wonder what they knew? ( he was 98 and died of covid , so I am very interested in today's briefings)
I wonder what the cabinet are making of all this.

strangeshapedpotato · 26/05/2021 11:22

@BeastfromtheNorthEast

He's right that Corbyn v Johnson offered the public no credible or competent choice.

Proporotional representation please.

Indeed - it was the ideologically obsessed idiot vs the narcissistic idiot

GoldenOmber · 26/05/2021 11:24

And NZ locked down when they needed to. We didn't. THAT's the difference between the two.

We ‘needed’ to lock down in late Jan/early Feb to get that kind of control over it, though, and that would have been an incredibly tough sell to the public.

I do wish we’d locked down earlier than we did and it would have saved a lot of lives to lock down in eg early March, but I doubt we could ever feasibly have been New Zealand.

strangeshapedpotato · 26/05/2021 11:24

@the80sweregreat

The PM offered to be injected with covid on tv. I am hoping that Chris Whitty just laughed at that one! He caught it anyway and was very ill. My dads care home locked down a week before the rest of the country. 12th March. Makes me wonder what they knew? ( he was 98 and died of covid , so I am very interested in today's briefings) I wonder what the cabinet are making of all this.

There was an interview with one of the SAGE group - can't remember which, last year regarding this.

The long-held official epidemic strategy involved "protecting the vulnerable", but although this was minuted back in February, the implementation got "forgotten".