Servers at pub not wearing masks - is this ok?

[Catyness]

I've been to 2 pubs now since they've re-opened outside. I was surprised last night that the servers/waiters weren't wearing any type of face covering. They stood around 1m away to take the order then would be right at the table when delivering the drinks.

Is this allowed? Is this safe?

I did feel uncomfortable and won't be rushing back there I'm afraid.

@Againstmachine That is a news article, not an official WHO statement. Very important not to confuse the two.

@TheVampiresWife Nope, I’m not overly anxious. I’m just pointing out factual information regarding transmission.

[quote Canyouexplainhowthatis]@Againstmachine That is a news article, not an official WHO statement. Very important not to confuse the two.

@TheVampiresWife Nope, I’m not overly anxious. I’m just pointing out factual information regarding transmission.[/quote]
That factual information may have been relevant when covid was rife, there were no vaccines and the majority of adults didn't have antibodies. As things stand, you're pretty unlikely to come into contact with an infected person much less catch covid from an infected person outdoors. The fact that infections haven't risen since hospitality reopened would bear this out.

If people are catching covid as you say they are - from maskless hospitality staff - why haven't infections spiked since venues reopened? Why have infections continued to fall?

We aren't here to look into your concerns,you seem to act like everyone owes you something , eithier go out or don't but stop behaving like everyone has to go by your roles.

I mean, seriously, with so much going wrong in the world it sounds incredibly entitled to moan about wearing a mask.

You know what's really entitled? Expecting other people, especially servers who are already under paid and work incredibly long shifts constantly on their feet, to unnecessarily wear a mask and inconvenient themselves to account for your personal anxieties and what you think people 'should' be doing based on nothing but your own fears and delicate sensibilities. If you don't like being served by certain people, stay home and serve yourself.

Personally I couldn't get too worked up about it but I am surprised they're not being asked to wear them, if only for appearances sake

@boredbuttercup You’ve repeatedly commented on how hard done you feel in the industry. Have you looked for another job? I think you might be happier.

Also, you clearly haven’t followed the science at all if you think this is about my “personal anxieties” - if you read through this thread you’ll see that it’s not just my city enforcing masks.

Hilarious though. Wear a mask when you’re on your feet all day & underpaid!? The audacity! I suppose nurses shouldn’t wear them either then... or doctors... or surgeons.

[quote Canyouexplainhowthatis]@boredbuttercup You’ve repeatedly commented on how hard done you feel in the industry. Have you looked for another job? I think you might be happier.

Also, you clearly haven’t followed the science at all if you think this is about my “personal anxieties” - if you read through this thread you’ll see that it’s not just my city enforcing masks.

Hilarious though. Wear a mask when you’re on your feet all day & underpaid!? The audacity! I suppose nurses shouldn’t wear them either then... or doctors... or surgeons.[/quote]
@Canyouexplainhowthatis

Thank you for your condescension 

I'm a student, I need this job to make ends meet. It's not a career, I don't need to look at transferring industries, I need money to pay rent in the short term.

And 99% of the time I'm happy with my job. 99% of customers are lovely.

But the entitled arseholes stick with you. And you act just like them. It's not a legal requirement, my company doesn't require it, I won't be doing it to suit your delicate sensibilities.

And as for your ridiculous comment about doctors and nurses. They need to wear masks. I needed to wear a mask when we were open in September/October/December because of the risk at the time, and did so happily because I understood the risk. What I won't abide by is being forced to do so for no need other than a small minority of peoples personal anxieties.

And as for 'following the science' you've repeatedly ignored sound science on this thread, including complete denial that covid is no longer pandemic in the U.K., and refused to engage with posters starring facts about how safe it really is now.

Also, you clearly haven’t followed the science at all if you think this is about my “personal anxieties” - if you read through this thread you’ll see that it’s not just my city enforcing masks.

Where is "the science" saying we have to wear masks outdoors?

Hilarious though. Wear a mask when you’re on your feet all day & underpaid!? The audacity! I suppose nurses shouldn’t wear them either then... or doctors... or surgeons.

Let's not belittle people for finding a fairly unnatural thing difficult.

@BonnieDundee People on this thread keep saying “outdoors is safe” because science has shown us that walking past someone outdoors is safe, very low chance of transmission. Sitting in a park away from others, again, very low risk of transmission. In these examples of course, being outdoors is very safe and much safer than indoors. However, track & trace doesn’t discount all outside encounters, why is that?

A pub setting is not the same and I really am surprised that I am having to repeatedly point out the difference. Science has made it very clear - if you can’t socially distance, wear a mask. Are servers socially distanced when taking your order? I caught a horrendous virus last year and I hadn’t been inside anywhere in a good month or so at that point. I could have only caught it outside. I have no idea why people on here seem to think outdoor transmission is impossible. If someone is standing directly next to you and you are talking, you could very easily become infected. This is why many councils are enforcing masks. They haven’t just plucked the idea out of thin air.

In an ideal world, punters should wear a mask when being served too.

@boredbuttercup I think you are relying too heavily on what the UK government has stated rather than the actual science behind covid transmission. Now that I have realised that is the case, I can see why you’re frustrated.

When you’ve got some free time, do a bit of reading on the actual science from experts and you’ll soon get it, I’m sure.

[quote Canyouexplainhowthatis]@boredbuttercup I think you are relying too heavily on what the UK government has stated rather than the actual science behind covid transmission. Now that I have realised that is the case, I can see why you’re frustrated.

When you’ve got some free time, do a bit of reading on the actual science from experts and you’ll soon get it, I’m sure.[/quote]
You're no accepting 'the actual science from experts' though, are you?

The science which says that the majority of people are vaccinated/have antibodies, that covid is suppressed in many areas, that there have been no spike in infections since hospitality reopened, that infections continue to fall, that the risk of outdoor transmission is very low even when covid is more prevalent but now that around 1 in 1000 people have the virus, and the majority of adults are vaccinated and vaccination cuts transmission further still, the risk is much lower still?

Why are you choosing not only to ignore that science, but also me when I point it out to you?

Science has made it very clear - if you can’t socially distance, wear a mask.

Actually, the latest evidence on masks is very weak.

There were myriads of observational studies from last summer that seemed to indicate that masks are highly protective. However, as time passed by, the case for masks kept weakening. Based on the latest analysis performed by ECDC:

• Medical (surgical) masks produce small to moderate effect on community transmission based on low to moderate evidence
• Non-medical (cloth) masks may produce small to moderate effect on community transmission based on very low evidence

www.ecdc.europa.eu/sites/default/files/documents/covid-19-face-masks-community-first-update.pdf

@wintertravel1980 you are completely correct! The evidence for them is very weak and the only slight benefit was shown in a controlled area, another test in the same setting showed none and another negative benefit so I suppose it depends on the leaning of the publishers? It also isn't law to wear them anywhere as exemptions are wide and I believe even if taking one on or off causes you distress you are exempt? I don't think that exemption would work well with the seat belt argument!! The only time you are likely to be fined for not wearing one is if you get aggressive towards someone challenging you don't say the magic words and the police are called! More towards giving people a safety blanket in my mind!

Canyouexplain the scientists have said that even with all the outdoors protests and crowding at beaches last year, transmission was negligible.

You wear a mask outside if you want to, but don't tell other people they should.

@BonnieDundee This might help you understand.

“Use the 2-out-of-3 Rule:

If you’re not vaccinated, make sure your activity meets two out of the following three conditions: outdoors, distanced and masked.”

Yes that's all very well but I've sat in a non-socially distanced office indoors since March last year, so I really can't get too excited about it. Its the wonderful NHS that's made me do this btw. If the NHS can't be arsed to follow the rules when things.were really bad,why would anyone else need to follow them now?

Oh and BTW loving the passive aggressive assuming that I must be thick and dont understand the rules. Quite the tactic to use.on people who don't agree with you

@BonnieDundee Not at all. But it is clear you don’t understand what I’m saying. Scientific facts arent really something to agree or disagree with unless you’re a conspiracy theorist which you don’t strike me as. So, it has to be the case that there is miscommunication between us.

(This is easy enough given the governments shoddy guidelines, like you say, telling people to work from home where possible but not enforcing it, allowing office workers to be forced in by their employers for no good reason)

So the fact i don't agree with you means I don't understand?

I won't be engaging with you any more. I don't like people trying to mess with my head

The time is coming when those who are not comfortable interacting with other people, on the other people’s terms, are going to have to stay at home.

This might help you understand.

If I remember correctly, this is the picture put together by US CDC. CDC recommendations on masks are hugely skewed by political opinions on their leadership team and, unfortunately, are not entirely based on science. I prefer listening to European scientists (or Jonathan Van Tam) who are more impartial.

It is always useful to read the actual research and underlying data. I previously linked the latest ECDC paper that analysed all the available research on masks. It suggests:

• Masks are effective in healthcare settings,
• Masks are also effective when conducting experiments on hamsters (this particular research from last summer turned out to be correct),
• Masks are only marginally effective in community settings.

@BonnieDundee No that’s not what I meant and I’m not trying to mess with you either. Sorry!

[quote Canyouexplainhowthatis]@BonnieDundee Not at all. But it is clear you don’t understand what I’m saying. Scientific facts arent really something to agree or disagree with unless you’re a conspiracy theorist which you don’t strike me as. So, it has to be the case that there is miscommunication between us.[/quote]
Yet you're continually disagreeing with the scientific facts I've mentioned several times on this thread.

@Temp023

The time is coming when those who are not comfortable interacting with other people, on the other people’s terms, are going to have to stay at home.

This.

What will people do in just a few weeks' time when restrictions end and people can go to nightclubs, weddings/funerals in unlimited numbers, gigs and so on unmasked and with no SD? The froth on this board come the end of June will be of epic proportions. And we'll still have armchair virologists telling us it's too soon/millions will die/those who participate in normal life are murdering savages.

Life will go back to normal. It's already beginning to. Get over it.