Alternatives to AstraZeneca vaccine for under 40s “could be considered” amid rise in blood clots

[Whichjab]

www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/astrazeneca-vaccine-side-effects-blood-clots-under-40-b931498.html

This is concerning, especially as there is limited research into combining vaccinations. I feel that the trust in vaccination is being eroded. I have always been pro vacc but feeling much less so atm.
I'm not sure I will get my second jab now.

What do you mean?

I could be cynical and say that the JCVI decision (if any) is being kept under wraps until the Bank Holiday Weekend is over... recent announcement for 40+s means more first jabs will be done over the next 3 days I think....seem to recall something similar happening over the Easter weekend...

@Carefulvulvadriver thanks for crunching some numbers. If you are correct, those figures for under 50s are getting towards what Germany etc were seeing - and they vaccinated a younger cohort than us in the beginning.

And for those younger - being vaccinated with Az - the boosters will have to be AZ too - so the risk of clotting is with every shot so numerous booster shots means taking a risk every six months.

Excellent number crunching, @Carefulvulvadriver I’d been looking for the data on jabs given per age group and couldn’t find it. Thank you.

What irks me is that the discussion seems to be about restricting it for the under 40s only. I think they need to go higher (based on the EMA relative risk graphs, amongst other things) but of course that creates issues as lots of people in their forties have had the AZ jab or are having it in the next few days.

It’s a mess really.

@pinkmagnolias

And for those younger - being vaccinated with Az - the boosters will have to be AZ too - so the risk of clotting is with every shot so numerous booster shots means taking a risk every six months.

You can't use AZ as a booster for those who already had two doses originally as antibodies against the adenovirus vector will reduce the efficacy too much.

You can't use AZ as a booster for those who already had two doses originally as antibodies against the adenovirus vector will reduce the efficacy too much

What will happen,
The trials are ongoing as to the mixing two vaccines together? It isn’t recommended by the EMA.

@pinkmagnolias

You can't use AZ as a booster for those who already had two doses originally as antibodies against the adenovirus vector will reduce the efficacy too much

What will happen,
The trials are ongoing as to the mixing two vaccines together? It isn’t recommended by the EMA.

It sounds like they're planning to give everyone Pfizer.

It is a mess. They could still press ahead with AZ for the over 30s. But yes it should have been restricted for the 40+ too.

Thank you for the numbers @Carefulvulvadriver. Very concerning!

Why does the AZ affect younger women?

It sounds like they're planning to give everyone Pfizer

But they can’t be mixed. What a mess!!!

@Fieldofmemes

I could be cynical and say that the JCVI decision (if any) is being kept under wraps until the Bank Holiday Weekend is over... recent announcement for 40+s means more first jabs will be done over the next 3 days I think....seem to recall something similar happening over the Easter weekend...

My gut says you are correct. Been thinking the same.

@Rainbowsandstorms I agree I am mid 40's and have had my first vaccination (AZ) and looking at the data very closely over the next few weeks as due second in june
People were saying if it didn't happen with first , unlikely with the second, but have seen some cases now according to yellow card , although we don't have all the details I suppose , but I am watching very carefully.
What i wonder is of we have bothe jabs and then need top ups will we have to have same top up ?

@worriedatthemoment the regular contributors to this thread have been described as odd on another thread so... welcome to the Odd Group 

As for your question, @QueenStromba's post below I think answers it with:

You can't use AZ as a booster for those who already had two doses originally as antibodies against the adenovirus vector will reduce the efficacy too much.

It sounds like they're planning to give everyone Pfizer

You can't use AZ as a booster for those who already had two doses originally as antibodies against the adenovirus vector will reduce the efficacy too much.

And this has been kept very quiet. I do believe the trust in the medical regulators will be damaged for a long time once more information comes out.

@AppleJane love that we are being called odd! Clearly the people calling us that think the governments of Norway, Sweden, Finland, Denmark, Germany, France, Iceland, Switzerland etc. are also "odd" hahahaha. Those weird Scandinavians, eh? Nothing good about the way they run their countries

I should imagine there’s a difference between mixing and matching during the initial vaccination process - ie 2 jabs to be fully vaccinated - and doing boosters for variants in future. If you mix and match in the first stage, they don’t know how that affects levels of immunity, or side effects. Once you have the immunity expected from the jabs you were given in order to be fully immunised first off, boosters are a different matter. Scientists have already been saying that it will be impossible to ensure you get the same company’s jab for the booster as for the initial vaccination, anyway.

It’s not as if anyone ever insists on the same company’s flu vaccine every year (or I certainly don’t!) - what you are given depends on availability, your age, allergies, and possibly other conditions too. To insist on not completing your course of treatment for something, but instead having half of another course of treatment, instead, is highly unorthodox and certainly shouldn’t be opted for by people not willing to take the risk of doing what has been prescribed for them in the first place, as these are clearly not people happy with risking the unknown.

@pinkmagnolias

And for those younger - being vaccinated with Az - the boosters will have to be AZ too - so the risk of clotting is with every shot so numerous booster shots means taking a risk every six months.

No not necessarily. This is one of the things Snape and his colleagues are looking at with their current research (oxford university Snape not the Hogwarts one)

Exactly @Fieldofmemes I wouldn't call our government nor it's decisions 'normal'

I absolutely love that there's a real Professor Snape

@Whichjab

You can't use AZ as a booster for those who already had two doses originally as antibodies against the adenovirus vector will reduce the efficacy too much.

And this has been kept very quiet. I do believe the trust in the medical regulators will be damaged for a long time once more information comes out.

They are have been planning to use Norovax as the booster. I can't see that changing with so long as the trial data continues to look good. The manufacturer has said they will have supply waiting as soon as approved. Making it already. I think the Pfizer new order is so we don't all are eggs in one basket. Some countries do and with possible new variants that would be risky.

@Whichjab yes, quite bizarre...
Although I have to admit I am quite relieved that, if true, it means the AZ vaccine will have to be phased out.

@Tealightsandd

I absolutely love that there's a real Professor Snape

I know right. Had to get that in there when I saw a chance

[quote Fieldofmemes]@Whichjab yes, quite bizarre...
Although I have to admit I am quite relieved that, if true, it means the AZ vaccine will have to be phased out.[/quote]
I'm slightly worried they'll try to foist it on people who had Pfizer or Moderna first time but I think they'll just decide it's too much hassle to deal with.