Alternatives to AstraZeneca vaccine for under 40s “could be considered” amid rise in blood clots

[Whichjab]

www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/astrazeneca-vaccine-side-effects-blood-clots-under-40-b931498.html

This is concerning, especially as there is limited research into combining vaccinations. I feel that the trust in vaccination is being eroded. I have always been pro vacc but feeling much less so atm.
I'm not sure I will get my second jab now.

@CuriousaboutSamphire - geography wasn’t my point either, so I presume you are talking to someone else.

@CuriousaboutSamphire
https://www.ema.europa.eu/en/documents/chmp-annex/annex-vaxzevria-art53-visual-risk-contextualisation_en.pdf
Charts on here (very similar presentation to the UK ones
Taken from this statement-
https://www.ema.europa.eu/en/news/astrazenecas-covid-19-vaccine-benefits-risks-context

Literally 400,000 of these threads. Just comment on one of them.

You comment on one of them. Stop trying to shut down important conversations just because you don’t agree with them.

I actually believed Europe were using AZ to punish us for Brexit. Especially when no cases were being reported here.

I did a bit too. That’s the rhetoric we were sold @AppleJane and tbh it’s the rhetoric that huge groups of society still seem to believe, despite it now being embarrassingly obvious that’s it’s not true.

I don’t find the ‘hospitalisations prevented’ vs ‘blood clots’ table v compelling because hospitalisations very much do not equal deaths in my age group but catastrophic blood clots very often do.

@ConstantlyChanging

Literally 400,000 of these threads. Just comment on one of them.

You comment on one of them. Stop trying to shut down important conversations just because you don’t agree with them.

I actually believed Europe were using AZ to punish us for Brexit. Especially when no cases were being reported here.

I did a bit too. That’s the rhetoric we were sold @AppleJane and tbh it’s the rhetoric that huge groups of society still seem to believe, despite it now being embarrassingly obvious that’s it’s not true.

Thanks, the desire for censorship on here is outstanding, one is given to the feeling that powers beyond MN control are behind it.

[quote YoshimisMum]@CuriousaboutSamphire
https://www.ema.europa.eu/en/documents/chmp-annex/annex-vaxzevria-art53-visual-risk-contextualisation_en.pdf
Charts on here (very similar presentation to the UK ones
Taken from this statement-
https://www.ema.europa.eu/en/news/astrazenecas-covid-19-vaccine-benefits-risks-context[/quote]
I have those, thanks. The only reference to 1 in 50000 I can see is in the explanation of low, medium and high risk categories.

What am I not seeing?

@YoshimisMum - the statement you linked refers to a risk of 1 in 100,000 not 1 in 50,000?

That's what I am reading too!

@CuriousaboutSamphire
These are presented in very much the same format as the UK charts - so the risks of the rare form of blood clotting with low platelets per 100,000 in each age group jabbed with AstraZeneca (Vaxzevria) would be what the EMA have found in their equivalent of the yellow card reporting I would presume?

That was why I was querying the original 1 in 50000 comment.

It didn't match what I read!

@Walkaround
Example chart attached showing age groups
20-29 1.9 per 100,000
30-39 1.8 per 100,000
40-49 2.1 per 100,000
etc

Norway banned the AZ vaccine and as very few people die from Covid in Norway, an under 50 healthy woman is of higher risk of dying from AZ than Covid.

@CuriousaboutSamphire
@Walkaround
Apologies - re read that - see what you mean now!

Oh, I see. But I'm still not sure that's not apples and oranges.

I'm on my phone, it's all very, very small. I'll check it out on the PC later.

Seems we are all misreading something 😁

@YoshimisMum, this is one of 3 charts in the report.

I believe the one you’ve posted is applicable when there is a Low infection rate in the country

There’s also one for medium and high.

That’s how I understand it anyway.

@User657849
I was using that as an example for the jab risk - the jab side effects rate for blood clots with low platelets does not change whether infection risk is low, medium or high. What does change is the risk of hospitalisations/ICU/death rate when infections are low, medium or high

@HolmeH

Bore off & refuse your jab. These threads are exhausting. I’ve taken the contraceptive pill for 20 years which also carries a risk of clots & death at a far higher rate. Me & millions of others. I’ll continue to take my pill & I’ll get my jab. Life is a risk, I also enjoy sky diving, deffo risk of death 😅

You are a shining example of proudly taking it for the team - full burden of birth control side effects and now also the vaccine.

People are all different in that respect- I personally refused to ever take hormonal birth control once I got some blood clot related symptoms on some type of pill at age 20. It dawned on me that actually these side effects they mention in a leaflet might be a real thing for some and not just for litigation purposes.

The government has messed this up & a lot of people I know don't trust them re this issue now. When other countries were pausing & here it was no risk doesn't look great where we are now. I had it as i'm in group 6 & in my 30s however I'm not sure I would have it if I was offered it now. I've already had covid.

The yellow card data is not being broken down into age, sex, health and date of vaccine for those experiencing blood clots. This makes it impossible for us to calculate true risk.

I have seen some online trying to crunch the numbers by using the data released from 5th April to 14th April when there were ten additional deaths recorded and assuming they were mainly from the 45-49 age group receiving a vaccine the week previous they have taken the number of first vaccines administered within the same time frame and come up with a risk of 1 in 10k to 1 in 20k. The yellow card data does state that the average age is 47.

We cannot know if those stats are accurate but as it’s obvious now that we are a long way from a one in a million risk it’s time for transparency from the government else the public will make their own calculations, right or wrong. Releasing the data would quickly put an end to this speculation.

Yes I would like to see the data broken down by age, gender & ethnicity, that would help restore trust I think. I doubt we will see that data though.

@applejane
Yes the yellow card information is interesting and can be found here
www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-vaccine-adverse-reactions/coronavirus-vaccine-summary-of-yellow-card-reporting

@rarat

Yes I would like to see the data broken down by age, gender & ethnicity, that would help restore trust I think. I doubt we will see that data though.

IMO they have an ethical duty to give us all the available information so we can make an informed choice.

All of us in the 30-60 age bracket who have not yet received a vaccine are being put in an impossible situation.

@YoshimisMum, yes. I understand the deaths are the same.

But since some people might trying to decide whether it’s worth the risk of the blood clot comparing it to the risk of hospitalisation, etc, it should be pointed out that it varies depending on the country’s infection rate.

I think we agree, I’m just not sure people looking at the chart might realise that this one is for a low infection rate, which I guess would be for the Uk at the moment, whereas obviously an Indian chart would look totally different.

I wasn’t trying to contradict you, sorry if it came across that way.

I do wonder if the extra 40m Pfizer being bought in may mean that more people could be offered a choice. I know many of those are for boosters so we'll have to wait and see.