MHRA may change advice for young people receiving AZ vaccine

[IloveSooty424]

I just saw this news story on Channel 4 news tonight.

www.channel4.com/news/uk-medicines-regulator-considers-issuing-new-advice-over-oxford-astrazeneca-jab

It seems the MHRA may follow other European countries and Canada and advise that younger people should not receive the AZ vaccine. It seems the decision will be made imminently in the coming days.

I’m due to book my vaccine this week and don’t know whether to wait and see how this plays out. I’m 42. I’m also concerned that if younger people will only be offered the Pfizer vaccine it will slow down the vaccine programme substantially.

Any thoughts?

Seems like EMA has not concluded anything, someone from EMA has told Italian media but this its not confirmed by the organiisation

#BREAKING European Medicines Agency (#EMA) has 'not yet reached a conclusion' on AstraZeneca Covid vaccine/blood clot link, review 'currently ongoing': statement

twitter.com/AFP/status/1379417650305118213

Seems like EMA has not concluded anything, someone from EMA has told Italian media but this its not confirmed by the organiisation.

The EMA are meeting today, their official conclusions are expected tomorrow afternoon or Thursday at a press conference.

I would not accept the AZ vaccine if I was under 50. It’s just a matter of time before this vaccine will be paused for all under 50s and about time in my view.

I was listening to that earlier.

It's so poorly reported.it bears little resemblance to what is actually happening.

MHRA is doing what it always does, is keeping a close eye on new data. It is always considering changing guidance, constantly, on every medicine under it's purview. Always.

If it does change it's guidance it won't be because of any pressure group, a single expert having doubts or social media screaming blue murder. It will do so based on global data available.

This usual process is what sceptics use to claim the vaccine is still undergoing testing. It isn't but each new understanding adds weight to that claim.

If Moderna, or any other vaccine, has better outcomes for any age group they'll recommend it. That too would be normal practice.

Sadly so too are the deliberately worded headlines!

I have my own personal reasons for really not wanting covid. I know quite a few who've had it, no one got off lightly. Also, I can't go on living like this. So all these reasons outweigh the risk tiny risk for me.

Due to have my second vaccine next week and looking forward to it - I know I'm being selfish but I really hope they don't suspend it to everyone - there are many desperate for any vaccine, others coming up for their second vaccines. I guess if they believe say the under 30s are really at risk, then the Moderna will be here in about three weeks time so those that are younger in the top groups will hopefully get that.

@PandoraP

I would not accept the AZ vaccine if I was under 50. It’s just a matter of time before this vaccine will be paused for all under 50s and about time in my view.

Ring and tell Boris. He could save so much time and money!

Science... pshaw!

@PandoraP

I would not accept the AZ vaccine if I was under 50. It’s just a matter of time before this vaccine will be paused for all under 50s and about time in my view.

Where did you get your Doctorate in immunology? Could you share your evidence for these claims?

I think she’s basing her opinion on the decisions made in other countries to not give the AZ vaccine to under 50/55/60s. She thinks the U.K. will eventually come to that decision too.

Under 65, 60, 50, 30 who the hell wants a stroke?
I’m 63, healthy as can be. Not wanting a clot anywhere. I’m saying no to AZ at this point.
Ideally I’d like to wait for the J&J one dose option.

@bumbleymummy, exactly right. Countries who are also basing their decisions on science. Its possible and probably that the issue is also under reported.

Did you do a personal RR assessment on that? Not using the weird online risk calculator, which is so flawed it's dangerous?

What confounding factors did you identify? What weighting did you give them? What were your overall RRa for contracting covid; for getting long covid; for dying of covid; for any adverse reactions; for clotting of any kind; for death from clots?

I'd love to know, I could use your data to make my own RR assessment.

In the EU not all countries have banned it below 60, I'm Spanish, young female doctors are currently being vaccinated with it, I think all these differences are making the people doubt much More. what should have been an easy vaccine rollout it's become crazy with people refusing it

I recall there were several posters saying that Euro states had suspended AZ/taken steps to investigate the clotting issue because they were jealous of the UK and wanted to trash "our" vaccine.

There was a whole thread calling the EU fuckwits for temporarily suspending AZ out of caution. Apparently it was all political because the EU are jealous of the UK's success in vaccination rates.

The women who died (the overwhelming majority were/are young and female) were apparently going to have had those clots anyway so their family should not expect or deserve any closure. There were actually users (and the term fuckwit would be apt here) who were joking that AZ should be marketed as an anti-thrombosis therapy because the rate of clotting incidents were allegedly lower than a control group. Not sure which study this was from but clearly not true now.

MHRA is doing what it always does, is keeping a close eye on new data. It is always considering changing guidance, constantly, on every medicine under it's purview. Always

Does it? Always? until very recently, the EMA did the role of the UK regulator and as far as i can see, the MHRA is behind the curve on this emerging story.
Relying on the yellow card system... i mean i have a blood clot 2 weeks after a vaccination, who would link that to a vaccine? what do other countries rely on? this is a vaccine with zero long term data, so you d like to think someone is doing a little more than monitoring yellow cards.... maybe not.

Considering how many we have vaccinated with AZ (far more than any other country) why didn't we spot this issue first?

Yes jasjas they used to be very closely connected, 'lived' next door to each other and shared expertise until the EMA moved due to Brexit.

Behind the curve? That's an opinion I don't agree with. Especially as, when you drill down through all the politicking a and journalistic bollocks, the two organisations are saying pretty much the same thing.

Not spotting the issue can only be guesswork until the MHRA publish the latest data.

As usual I am waiting to read the publicly available data before I decide. Anything else would.be conjecture and wouldn't do me any good. I don't want to be part of the misinformation flood.

The MHRA did a huge amount of the regulatory work for the EMA. They do know what they are doing. And I don’t think they are behind. As far as I can see the EMA haven’t said anything other than it’s still fine for use in all age groups.

The issue is from a number of bodies in different countries. Some of which are regulatory bodies, some of which are the equivalent of DoH or JCVI. And nobody has actually banned anything yet.

@fallfallfall

Under 65, 60, 50, 30 who the hell wants a stroke? I’m 63, healthy as can be. Not wanting a clot anywhere. I’m saying no to AZ at this point. Ideally I’d like to wait for the J&J one dose option.

The World Health Organization’s expert group Wednesday said the Johnson & Johnson coronavirus vaccine is safe for use on people aged above 18, and that investigation showed a tiny number of people who had the jab showed signs of blood-clotting

Good luck !

P.s. I have had the AZ, and will have the second dose. IMHO the risks of harm are smaller than those from Covid.

During trials for the Janssen vaccine involving nearly 44,000 people, 10 of the 22,000 people who received the blank dose developed a blood clot – or thrombo-embolic events - while 14 of the remaining 22,000 who were inoculated, developed a clot

This is very interesting summary of background incidence of blood clots.

@RafaIsTheKingOfClay

The MHRA did a huge amount of the regulatory work for the EMA. They do know what they are doing. And I don’t think they are behind. As far as I can see the EMA haven’t said anything other than it’s still fine for use in all age groups.

The issue is from a number of bodies in different countries. Some of which are regulatory bodies, some of which are the equivalent of DoH or JCVI. And nobody has actually banned anything yet.

EU drug agency denies already finding causal link between AstraZeneca vaccine and blood clots

www.theguardian.com/world/2021/apr/06/ema-denies-already-finding-causal-link-astrazeneca-vaccine-blood-clots

“Considering how many we have vaccinated with AZ (far more than any other country) why didn't we spot this issue first?”

This is an excellent point. I thought we were data ninjas?

@LacyEdge

“Considering how many we have vaccinated with AZ (far more than any other country) why didn't we spot this issue first?”

This is an excellent point. I thought we were data ninjas?

There are a few possibilities including an uneven spread of incidences, there are so few; different batches, procedures; perceptions - remember the UK is far more vaccine compliant and has decades of data. It may not have been seen to be an issue here yet at the low incidence rates; it could be correlation not causation and not an issue.

We won't know until the EMA, MHRA and others produce their reports on it.

I suspect it has something to do with the earlier decision not to give AZ to the over 55s until there was more data. Possibly our age profile AZ recipients was older which hid it slightly better. But given the number they found scince they were made aware of it, it does seem like we’ve missed it because the yellow card system isn’t perfect.

@fallfallfall

Under 65, 60, 50, 30 who the hell wants a stroke? I’m 63, healthy as can be. Not wanting a clot anywhere. I’m saying no to AZ at this point. Ideally I’d like to wait for the J&J one dose option.

That's one of the reasons why I got the vaccine. I don't want a stroke or a blood clot. Covid is known to cause both. The risk is higher from covid itself than an extremely rare vaccine side effect. J&J, btw, is a similar vaccine to AZ.

It’s not “just” a blood clot. It’s a pretty catastrophic event in the body of otherwise youngish and healthy people as opposed to the people usually at highest risk of Covid. The question is if the benefit outweighs the risk in all age groups and for all countries. A country where very few under 50s have died with a relatively low death rate from Covid might take a different view too.