Holidays abroad are illegal from Monday

[Dugee]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9389921/Ban-leaving-UK-amid-new-coronavirus-laws-force-week.html

Along with any other unnecessary travel abroad.

@Sugarandteaandmum

Why would anyone book a foreign holiday? My family are mostly abroad too including my dad. But he just has to stay put, as do we.

We need to vaccinate the world. The WORLD. and we don't need foreign holidays til it's done.

Wonderful. So in 2024 when the world is vaccinated and flying is allowed again, which airline do you think will take you to see your dad abroad?

You cannot and should not bunch the 2 together.

But, they both can have the same outcome. Both can result in bringing back cases of Covid or even a new variant. You can't separate the two as independent as they both carry the same risk.

Some of you are upset because you have not seen your relatives for a year. Well, my 85-year-old dad has been alone for the past 11 months because his partner of 30 years caught covid and died. I'm sure he would happily swap with you.

Some of you clearly have not had anyone get sick or die from Covid. If you did you wouldn't be here commenting on how hard it is for you, you'd be doing everything to get rid of this horrible virus.

@bumbleymummy

New variants can just as easily arise within the U.K. Isn’t the current thinking that the B.1.1.7 variant arose in a single, chronically infected person. It’s silly to think that we are doing to be able to prevent variants or somehow ‘keep them out’. It’s a virus, it mutates. We need to just accept that and get on with life.

Exactly

I can see why Boris is leaking this news slowly.

And how do you know that we are not doing everything we can to stop the virus?
i was laughed off this forum last year when I said we were wearing masks all the time , in shops and outside!
Now that The Uk is doing a fantastic rollout of the vaccine , I am for one cheering the Uk on , they came in late to the game but they are doing better than many other places .
However Yes i do have people that I know of who have died and a very dear 53 year old friend currently in hospital.
And trust me dear I also have an 84 year old living alone who is so damm lonely that it breaks my heart . So being told that my needs are the same as someone who can't swan off to a beach in wherever is quite frankly insulting.

I have no issue with this if it is necessary and proportionate to protect public health and it is a rule which is applied consistently.

However I don't think it is being applied consistently because of the exemptions particularly to second home owners and business travel.

It would also be fairer if the penalty was proportionate to income, a £5K fine is hardly going to deter the super rich.

It also seems odd to ban people from leaving but not to prevent them from entering. If closing borders is really in the interests of the public health of the nation then you would think we'd stop people from coming in.

I feel truly sorry for people who are prevented from seeing family abroad for the foreseeable.

If we are forbidden from foreign travel then hopefully the trade off will be more normality here.

It's been a year of lockdown measures now. Half the adult population is vaccinated surely there must be a benefit to the vaccination programme?

@lifeturnsonadime

I have no issue with this if it is necessary and proportionate to protect public health and it is a rule which is applied consistently.

However I don't think it is being applied consistently because of the exemptions particularly to second home owners and business travel.

It would also be fairer if the penalty was proportionate to income, a £5K fine is hardly going to deter the super rich.

It also seems odd to ban people from leaving but not to prevent them from entering. If closing borders is really in the interests of the public health of the nation then you would think we'd stop people from coming in.

I feel truly sorry for people who are prevented from seeing family abroad for the foreseeable.

If we are forbidden from foreign travel then hopefully the trade off will be more normality here.

It's been a year of lockdown measures now. Half the adult population is vaccinated surely there must be a benefit to the vaccination programme?

Very good points.

Second, if you have family abroad - it would be nice but it's not a right to see them or for them to visit you. You made the decision to move to another country so if rules change for whatever reason you have to abide by them.
This is a strange position. I am a very big fan of Britain, and a massive anglophile - I have consciously chosen it as my new adopted home - but no, I do not want to automatically forfeit any right to criticise or challenge decisions made by the British government "for whatever reason". I think your example with your DGF not being able to go to a Nazi Germany illustrates exactly this point very well, no?

I made the decision to move away from my family in a completely different set of circumstances, a global pandemic wasn't high on the list of factors to consider.

@Rosa

As Nith says if you choose to live in a different country then you limit your own right to family life and that should not trump the right to life of everyone else.

Well I hope that Nith and Clever Catty don't ever have anyone they they care about or love in another country and you will never know if you will see them again :... There is one thing popping over the channel to drink wine and lie on a beach .
.Another is visiting family who you have been denied of seeing as you and they have been respecting the rules, waiting and hoping for this to end.
You cannot and should not bunch the 2 together .

I just told you in my previous posts - my GGF didn't see his son - my GF, as GGF was interned for hard labour in Germany (WW1) and my GF was then working abroad (not UK).

In fact lots of my family members were/are in Germany and didn't see each other for years - so yes, my family has first hand experience of this.

I agree with this - if you chose to live and work abroad then generally you may have limits on being able to see family members.

I am in the UK and my family are also in the UK.

Working in NHS means I haven't seen my parents since last February either.

Now they are vaccinated and cases are lower, this might be possible soon hopefully, but it won't be if we import a load of SA variant that the AZ vaccine is ineffective against.

it is not just families separated by borders that have been affected by the pandemic.

Plenty of UK-based families have been separated by the pandemic, high virus numbers, having to work in the NHS, being several hours away, repeated lockdowns etc etc etc

It might be nice if people with family who live in the same country would get a chance to ever meet up also...

@forinborin

Second, if you have family abroad - it would be nice but it's not a right to see them or for them to visit you. You made the decision to move to another country so if rules change for whatever reason you have to abide by them. This is a strange position. I am a very big fan of Britain, and a massive anglophile - I have consciously chosen it as my new adopted home - but no, I do not want to automatically forfeit any right to criticise or challenge decisions made by the British government "for whatever reason". I think your example with your DGF not being able to go to a Nazi Germany illustrates exactly this point very well, no?

I made the decision to move away from my family in a completely different set of circumstances, a global pandemic wasn't high on the list of factors to consider.

So you would like to challenge decisions made by the British government because you can, or because you'd like to see your family?

My DGF left Germany for socio-economic reasons and partly because his DF was dual national English/French, so he came to UK.

Omg, it seems to be leaving only - can that be right? ,( Plus the exemption if you spawned the prime minister) . We need mandatory quarantine for all arrivals, wherever they come from.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/mar/23/covid-travel-rules-will-include-stanley-johnson-loophole-for-second-homes?utm_term=Autofeed&CMP=twt_gu&utm_medium&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1616480244

@murbblurb

Omg, it seems to be leaving only - can that be right? ,( Plus the exemption if you spawned the prime minister) . We need mandatory quarantine for all arrivals, wherever they come from.

that is the primary reason that I don't buy the fact that this is being done as a public health measure.

Not all arrivals must face a hotel quarantine, unless and until this is instigated there can be no argument in my mind that this is necessary or proportionate for the good of the public health.

You cannot compare the situation with Australia and NZ when the restriction here will only work one way and will not apply (to the extent that the £5K is not a deterrent) to the rich or second home owners.

My parents, sister and my daughter live and work in Belgium. DH’s parents are in Canada and his sister in the US. Our DS will be moving to Singapore when he starts his post grad job this year.

Just because family circumstances mean we all live in different countries doesn’t mean we forfeit the rights to see them. In non Covid times we would visit the US and Canada at least once at year and Belgium every couple of months. Our families would also visit the U.K. each year.
It’s not a world war. It’s a pandemic for which I support the lockdown regulations. We’re doing well at reducing the numbers of cases and deaths through the vaccination programme in the U.K.. We need to give other countries time to catch up with their vaccinations. It’s not worth the risk of going backwards for the short term benefits of a summer holiday.

Yes you can travel for work including second homes just as I could travel 30 minutes about 20 times for the day from home to prepare my sons' rental properties (although I suspect the hours of carrying heavy paving slabs and clearing 2 lots and appointments at the council tip might not be as much fun as going off to a Spanish holiday let to check the cleaner has done her work, whilst sneaking a few days in the son.

So dual (or more) nationals who want to leave here forever as they're done with this nonsense and have been vaccinated twice can't leave?

I'm with Xenia on this one.

.. (sun not son.... )...

So you would like to challenge decisions made by the British government because you can, or because you'd like to see your family?
I just find the logic of "this situation is of your own making, you gave up your rights yourself, so just shut up" quite strange. The right to family life is not some sort of a niche woke middle-class concept, it is well recognised in both international and domestic law - that's why you allow family reunification for refugees, for example, even when the family members are in different countries and there's war in between.

@GeorgeandHarold66

But it's replacing a rule that you couldn't leave your house without good reason?

Now you can leave your house without good reason, but not the country?

That sounds like progress to me

Yes of course . This makes sense . The stay home ruling finishes as of 29th March doesn't it. We can travel within UK although advice is stay home/local as much as possible.

@forinborin

So you would like to challenge decisions made by the British government because you can, or because you'd like to see your family? I just find the logic of "this situation is of your own making, you gave up your rights yourself, so just shut up" quite strange. The right to family life is not some sort of a niche woke middle-class concept, it is well recognised in both international and domestic law - that's why you allow family reunification for refugees, for example, even when the family members are in different countries and there's war in between.

Did I actually say what you quoted at me, re gave up your rights?! No, I didn't. I agree that family life is important but it has to be put into context. I also understand that it's recognised in international and domestic law, but again context is key.

I've already said that my own family, and I admit this was a few years back, could not visit each other for a few years either - technically GF was a refugee too as came from Germany. My GGM had to comfort a close relative whose son (I think it was GGM's nephew) was killed in WW2, driving a tank (he was German) - she could only do it by letter and we saw a copy of the letter recently.

But basically nowadays it seems as if you just complain a bit, because you're not allowed to see anyone etc for 1-2 years etc and then it's justified.

My close friend who's French - she would LOVE to see her DP's and DB, her DF has Alzheimers and is in a care home, but she has realised that for now, she can't do this, and she's making the most of her life in England.

I did feel really sorry for another friend of my DB's, also French - his DF died suddenly in France when there were bans on travel there so he could only return, I think, for the funeral, and naturally he was very upset.

@Wellbythebloodyhell

It will be illegal to fart soon 🙄

Where did you get wind of that?

(Sorry..........

I just don't understand how incredibly mean some people on here are being about others wanting to visit family abroad!! When people made the decision to live in another country to there family it was done in a time where you could hop on a plane & go where you liked when you liked. Most people have not seen them for a year now & it is understandable that they want to. I just think there is a group on here that just want to remain in this none life for ever, probably the same ones that never wanted the children to go back to school.

I just don't understand how incredibly mean some people on here are being about others wanting to visit family abroad

Doesn't affect them so they don't give a shit. Yet call everyone else selfish.

But basically nowadays it seems as if you just complain a bit, because you're not allowed to see anyone etc for 1-2 years etc and then it's justified.

WW2 was almost a century ago, in the times when international travel was privilege of a very few. Everyone who made a decision to move abroad during the last couple of years, made that decision under a completely different frame of reference - it was easier (as in, cheaper and faster) for me to go and see my family abroad compared to if they lived, say, somewhere in Midlands away from big airports.

I can relate to the immigration stories from the old days- many of family branches on my own family tree relocated to the States / Canada in the early 20th century. Their goodbyes were last goodbyes, and their farewell parties were indeed a bit like funerals - it was accepted by both sides that any future contact will be through infrequent letters only, no one will see grandchildren born, no one will come and bury grandparents.

In the modern world though, I don't think that not being allowed to see anyone for 1-2 years is nothing worth mentioning. But I guess we are different here.