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Original poster

9 out of 20 students in my class are apparently exempt from mask wearing

515 replies

Workyticket · 10/03/2021 00:05

Taught them in a small room with a slit of a window for 1.5 hours

6 of those 9 had chosen not to take a lateral flow test because their Mum said they didn't have to

Schools and colleges are safe though. Apparently

OP posts:
Belladonna12 · 10/03/2021 11:28

@AaronPurr

They aren't really "better than nothing" if a positive is more likely to be false than a true positive

Happy to be corrected but i'm pretty sure it's false negatives that are the worry, not false positives. It's statistically very unlikely to be a false positive.

No false positives are a problem too. www.theguardian.com/education/2021/mar/06/school-covid-tests-pupils-in-england-very-likely-to-get-false-positives

I think it is three or four in a thousand but that's less than the true positives and if you are doing a couple a week there will be quite a few in some schools . The result isn't overwritten by negative PCR, and so family and fellow pupils will have to isolate for two weeks for nothing.

chloworm · 10/03/2021 11:29

[quote Vintagevixen]@toolatetofixate its almost a religious fervour sometimes IMO.

I just want academic proof, really definitive proof. I don't take medical interventions that are unproven, I read the research then make my decision as I have done with vaccines and I am happy to take them.

Its the assumption that if you don't believe in masks you also don't believe in vaccines, or are a Covid denier as well that is irritating.[/quote]
I feel like this too. Happy to hear other opinions but I can't wade through them and make informed decisions. I wish the Government had a list of accredited studies we could refer to. It's like guess work. I can't really in my heart of hearts see how scraps of badly worn fabric make that much difference. But I would like to see the evidence and keep an open mind.

toolatetofixate · 10/03/2021 11:31

@noblegiraffe

It is possible. You do not need to have children sitting in your lap and whispering in your ear.

WTAF are you on about. It is not possible, in my classrooms, to maintain 2m social distancing from the kids, which is what is recommended to be able to remove a mask.

The fact that you seem to work in the mosh pit of a rave is something you should have raised with your line-manager pre-COVID.

In reality your classroom is absolutely fine and you most likely will be too. Wear a mask if you want to as you seem to be arguing that they help. Then you won't have to stay two metres apart. But don't worry, one metre will do. Sometimes you might walk past people or even bump shoulders. You'll still be fine in all likelihood.

Take care.

MiddlesexGirl · 10/03/2021 11:31

@Vintagevixen
Couple of initial takeaways - its not an RCT, the gold standard of scientific research.

The other article I linked discussed why it isn't possible to do RCTs for this.

We all know there are variable degrees of effectiveness of masks but the overall conclusion is they are a good thing and work better with greater compliance.
Alongside distancing, handwashing.

The more people who choose to ignore the guidance the more difficult it is to get the majority to comply. At that point mask wearing has little to no effect.

LolaSmiles · 10/03/2021 11:32

WTAF are you on about. It is not possible, in my classrooms, to maintain 2m social distancing from the kids, which is what is recommended to be able to remove a mask.
That poster has now shifted to keeping distance 'as best you can' and claiming that the risk is low at 1m.
In other words, they aren't keeping the required distances but want to make a big deal about how they're such a great teacher because they don't want appropriate measures in class.

It feels like the Mean Girls "I'm not like other mums, I'm a cool Mum".

That's probably why they are ignoring the fact that in many secondary classrooms 2m actually covers 1/3 of the class.

noblegiraffe · 10/03/2021 11:33

The fact that you seem to work in the mosh pit of a rave is something you should have raised with your line-manager pre-COVID.

No, it's a normal secondary classroom. Have you never been in one?

In reality your classroom is absolutely fine

Please do not lie to me. It's pretty patronising to assume that you know my working conditions better than I do.

Why are you doing that? How arrogant.

palacegirl77 · 10/03/2021 11:35

@noblegiraffe

Are there that many false negatives?

Yes.

You cannot assume that a negative result on an LFT means you don't have covid and should continue to observe all restrictions and mitigation measures.

I think thats why, when your child is masked, you may be less likely to want the LFT.
redswinger · 10/03/2021 11:35

My 18 year olds are wearing a mask but they are quite surprised by how unpleasant they are finding it, teachers don't wear one and they are feeling a bit chippy about that.

Belladonna12 · 10/03/2021 11:37

@redswinger

My 18 year olds are wearing a mask but they are quite surprised by how unpleasant they are finding it, teachers don't wear one and they are feeling a bit chippy about that.
Yes, my DD has complained about that. If the teacher of a particular class isn't wearing one it's going to be hard to make the students wear them.
andyoldlabour · 10/03/2021 11:39

"Are there that many false negatives?"

In the Liverpool test pool, around 60% of the lateral flow tests were false negatives, and missed 3 in 10 cases with highset viral loads - those most likely to pass the virus on.

www.bmj.com/content/371/bmj.m4848

LolaSmiles · 10/03/2021 11:41

Why are you doing that? How arrogant.
Quite.
Surely anyone who has spent more than 5 minutes teaching in state education would know that many buildings have small, poorly ventilated classrooms with far more students in than they were designed for?
🤷‍♀️

Whyarewehardofthinking · 10/03/2021 11:41

I'd like to point out something about this magical 2 metres; my DP, 3 other staff and a group of children caught this after being in the same room as a child who tested positive. DP was never 2 metres close as only 12 keyworker students were in the room. They all still got it. I caught it from him.

To those how are asking about being low risk; DP and I had very little risk. Both fit and well, mid 40s. I can't climb the stairs back at school now as I get dizzy. I'm sleeping for at least 10 hours a day. DP hadn't returned yet and won't for some time. On a good day I find him asleep downstairs when I get home; that means he could get up at least. Stop staring there is a low risk, this has devastated my DP physically and now mentally.

toolatetofixate · 10/03/2021 11:46

@noblegiraffe

The fact that you seem to work in the mosh pit of a rave is something you should have raised with your line-manager pre-COVID.

No, it's a normal secondary classroom. Have you never been in one?

In reality your classroom is absolutely fine

Please do not lie to me. It's pretty patronising to assume that you know my working conditions better than I do.

Why are you doing that? How arrogant.

You can panic if you like. But statistically, you will be fine.

toolatetofixate · 10/03/2021 11:48

@LolaSmiles

WTAF are you on about. It is not possible, in my classrooms, to maintain 2m social distancing from the kids, which is what is recommended to be able to remove a mask. That poster has now shifted to keeping distance 'as best you can' and claiming that the risk is low at 1m. In other words, they aren't keeping the required distances but want to make a big deal about how they're such a great teacher because they don't want appropriate measures in class.

It feels like the Mean Girls "I'm not like other mums, I'm a cool Mum".

That's probably why they are ignoring the fact that in many secondary classrooms 2m actually covers 1/3 of the class.

I do keep my distance. I do it as best I can. They can't redesign the classrooms. The risk remains low.

noblegiraffe · 10/03/2021 11:50

You can panic if you like

There you go again, toolate, painting a reasonable concern as 'panic'.

Why are you doing that?

You are the one who said that teachers should distance from pupils to protect themselves. Why would you suggest that if actually, statistically you will be fine anyway?

MarieFromStTropez · 10/03/2021 11:51

Non-mask wearers remind me of guys I used to meet years ago when I was still dating, who refused to wear a condom. The difference was, I didn’t have to have sex with them. Unfortunately I have no choice about breathing the (possibly) infected air of non-mask wearers.

noblegiraffe · 10/03/2021 11:52

I do keep my distance. I do it as best I can.

Why? Why are you not surrounded by kids in a group hug as statistically you'll be fine?

Why are you trying to minimise your risk at all? While saying that others who can't minimise theirs in the same way are 'panicking'?

LolaSmiles · 10/03/2021 11:53

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

andyoldlabour · 10/03/2021 11:53

Whyarewehardofthinking

So sorry to hear about your experience, particularly your DP. My NDN is in his late forties, very fit (or used to be), got Covid in early December, went out for his first walk last week.
I feel really sorry for the teachers, because they are the most vulnerable now. Parents not wanting their children tested, exempting them from mask wearing, they are so selfish.

chloworm · 10/03/2021 11:54

[quote andyoldlabour]"Are there that many false negatives?"

In the Liverpool test pool, around 60% of the lateral flow tests were false negatives, and missed 3 in 10 cases with highset viral loads - those most likely to pass the virus on.

www.bmj.com/content/371/bmj.m4848[/quote]
Thanks. Seems like a huge waste of money, resources and teacher time.

herecomesthsun · 10/03/2021 12:00

The testing is a medical procedure and it is difficult to insist that people do this (but 90% of our school have signed up for it anyway).

Regarding the masks, this is a disciplinary issue. So, you can't tell children that they are required to wear one.

You can however say that if they repeatedly do not keep 2m away from their teacher when not wearing a mask, this is a disciplinary issue and there will be consequences. You can also decide what those consequences will be.

noblegiraffe · 10/03/2021 12:00

Lola, I didn't know. Really sorry to hear that. Flowers I hope it's manageable.

toolatetofixate · 10/03/2021 12:05

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

toolatetofixate · 10/03/2021 12:07

@noblegiraffe

I do keep my distance. I do it as best I can.

Why? Why are you not surrounded by kids in a group hug as statistically you'll be fine?

Why are you trying to minimise your risk at all? While saying that others who can't minimise theirs in the same way are 'panicking'?

I'm not trying to minimise anything. I know that statistically most people will be fine.

I'd give them a hug quite happily but that's a bit inappropriate.

Vintagevixen · 10/03/2021 12:08

@MarieFromStTropez

Non-mask wearers remind me of guys I used to meet years ago when I was still dating, who refused to wear a condom. The difference was, I didn’t have to have sex with them. Unfortunately I have no choice about breathing the (possibly) infected air of non-mask wearers.
No comparison. There is bundles of research on condoms and sexual health that shows a positive effect.

There is limited and weak evidence for face masks.