What’s the point of vaccinations when still nothing is deemed ‘safe’?

[katieloves]

Just really struggling with this. We’re doing an amazing job and have so far vaccinated the people most likely to succumb to coronavirus and are cracking on with the people less vulnerable. But still it seems all news is bad and no end in sight. Looks likely that we’ll be lucky if only the youngest get back to school from the 8th and not much chance of secondary schools back until after Easter. It just doesn’t make sense to me at all. Most DC are struggling now - their lives are on hold (I appreciate some dc are thriving with home learning but this is not true for any of the dc I know). Motivation for is on a fine line and who can blame them? But apparently school’s not ‘safe’ even though the most vulnerable are vaccinated. People saying we’ll be back to where we were before lockdown if schools go back in full and hospitals will be overwhelmed. Why??? We’ve vaccinated the most vulnerable. I’m honestly loosing the will.

I've been super careful all year, etc etc. But I really don't understand why once groups 1-6 are all vaccinated we can't get on with things. I kind of assumed that 2 weeks after my vaccine I'd feel safe to go in shops/walk with a friend etc at the least...

It's bloody ridiculous. I hate this life.

Because 'variants' are the new Long Covid.

I think they are sending this cautious message to try and stop those who have been vaccinated from carrying on ‘as normal’. They are trying to get the numbers right down before they open the floodgates and let people out.

well safe isnt a binary thing and we may never go back to the old ways but (as I see it) the point of vaccines is to try and limit the consequences of covid?

They will say variants and long covid, which will be around forever .

From what I can see, we are never getting out of this until we stop waiting for things to be 'safe'. If the vaccines arent the solution, there is no solution, and we all need to accept that, or accept that we sit in 4 walls forever. I for one am NOT willing to do the latter.

I agree, OP. The news of a furlough extension until Summer suggests we aren't expecting to be open by then? Having vaccinated the vulnerable I just don't understand what the goal is at this point.

Vaccinations stop people dying. If that's not point enough, I don't know what is.

However, I take your point that we all want vaccinations to mean freedom. For that to happen, we also need low numbers to (a) Keep our vaccine operative as high numbers in combination with the selection pressures of a partly vaccinated community are inviting a mutation that would have us back to square one and (b) allow us to cope with outbreaks when they occur. That takes time.

The vaccine isn't 100 percent effective so we still need low numbers to ensure its not a big deal though forward, freeing up resources for other things. Even if the most vulnerable are vaccinated, a surge of the new variants (and other variants to come) could still cause havoc and obviously potentially affect the vaccinated too, especially as the vaccine doesn't knock transmission on the head.

So it does bring freedom without a price tag much much closer but we still have to patient because it doesn't mean what it would have meant pre variants.

Is that helpful.

I can’t understand why people are saying we’ll have a 3rd peak if we start to open up when 99% of the people who die from coronavirus have been vaccinated (elderly and ECV) and now vaccinations are available to the clinically vulnerable too. I still can’t see my mum who was vaccinated 4 weeks ago. Why does it matter if cases rise if these groups are vaccinated?

Firstly we were told anyone can get it and you may die

However not everyone will get the vaccine so, now there are vulnerable groups, so why have half the population stayed in all this time?

Why did all those that have the vaccine shield, those (less vulnerable and do not qualify for vaccine) get on with life

Shielded would be safe and

We would have an economy that functions?

Instead the narrative keeps changing along with those considered at risk

We have fucked the economy
Fucked the kids futures
And most of us are still in as much risk as we were at the beginning 🤷‍♀️

Or am I missing something?

However not everyone will get the vaccine so, now there are vulnerable groups, so why have half the population stayed in all this time?

Every adult who can be persuaded to have it will be offered it. Children will be offered it too

In 2022! Not staying in until then are we?

The groups that make up most of the hospitalisations still haven’t been vaccinated. Hospital numbers are still only just below what they where at the peak in April.

Having the vaccine doesn’t lead to automatic immunity, it takes about 2 weeks after the vaccine for the immunity to be at its best and only after the second will we have the highest level of possible immunity.

We can’t rush out of this the end is very much in sight but we need to keep it under control.

You are missing quite a few somethings

It is impossible to fully shield the vulnerable as they tend to need things like food or doctors appointments

The proportion of the population who would have to shield to allow others to live unhindered is about half which would impact on the availability of teachers , bin men ...

Vaccination is a key step that will make it much easier to get to normal life

It takes time and you still need low cases

The story hasn't changed you just didn't read it well

I am in the clinically extremely vulnerable group and I am so sick of all of this now. We were led to believe that vaccines stop death and serious illness from coronavirus so the pressure on the NHS. If this is the case - and I believe it is - then we need to just get everyone vaccinated ASAP and get back to normal.

I actually believe we should just all stop testing as more and more people are vaccinated. It’s the only way out of this entire mess. The government can’t use the infection rate as a way to keep everyone locked down then.

If the new variants mean the vaccines aren’t working that’s an issue we need to tackle with boosters etc. They are still saying the vaccines work though so what are we doing?!

If the vaccines arent the solution, there is no solution, and we all need to accept that

Well they're a solution in that we're fucked without them so we'd better hang onto them hadn't we. They'll be more of a solution if you'll give people a chance to get them into arms and allow numbers to fall to properly low levels that test and trace could handle.

Is this the same group of people who didn't want to wait for a vaccine because it could take years who now don't want to wait for the vaccine to be rolled out in optimum conditions, I wonder. The alternative is staggeringly awful for the NHS and suffering generally, especially as new variants unfortunately improved both transmission and virulence. It may not be a Hollywood happy ending but it is our way to protect the vulnerable, end the haemorrhaging of resources that are needed for other things, and get on top of this thing. Really important not to fuck it up.

@TwirpingBird

They will say variants and long covid, which will be around forever .

From what I can see, we are never getting out of this until we stop waiting for things to be 'safe'. If the vaccines arent the solution, there is no solution, and we all need to accept that, or accept that we sit in 4 walls forever. I for one am NOT willing to do the latter.

Everything you said .Once the majority are vacinated we need to get on with living. Properly.

I think it's only right that the many suffer for the few. at the moment,
but there comes a point where it's just plain wrong.

We're waiting for them to cure death. Just hang on a few more decades, the end is in sight.

Bagelsandbrie

I'm perplexed. You must know you're not the only person at risk from Covid. Just because you've had the vaccine doesn't mean everyone shouldn't have a chance of getting it before we open up. That seems quite selfish. Also, you could still transmit it to anyone who isn't vulnerable.

@chickadeeeeeeeee

In 2022! Not staying in until then are we?

The fuck I am.

Once the majority are vacinated we need to get on with living.

And I'm sure we will. But it will take until the summer to vaccinate everyone. Then I'd imagine a booster in the winter to cover new variants.

Also, you could still transmit it to anyone who isn't vulnerable.

Yes. Who isn't vulnerable.

Hiding away, afraid of a virus which will now kill and maim vanishingly few people is mental illness personified.

From what I can see, we are never getting out of this until we stop waiting for things to be 'safe

Quite the opposite. Things will be much safer in countries with highly vaccinated populations and low community transmission. That takes time to achieve. This is a straw man argument.

@itallworkedouthorribly

Bagelsandbrie

I'm perplexed. You must know you're not the only person at risk from Covid. Just because you've had the vaccine doesn't mean everyone shouldn't have a chance of getting it before we open up. That seems quite selfish. Also, you could still transmit it to anyone who isn't vulnerable.

The most vulnerable groups - groups 1-4 - are the ones most likely to suffer seriously with Covid. I’m not being selfish, if anything I’m being the opposite - I’m saying now they’ve done most of the most vulnerable people they need to allow people to crack on with things. It’s very unusual for someone young, fit and healthy to have serious issues with Covid. We all know that, that’s why the vaccine groups have been done as they have.

The more cases there are, the more it can mutate. If it mutates to become more dangerous or in a way that stops the vaccine being effective we're back to square one. It's all about keeping cases low.