Other countries offering choice of vaccine

[doireallyneedaname]

I have relatives in Cyprus who are able to choose with vaccine they’d like - AZ or Pfizer.

They have been given an appointment for next week and told that they will be told beforehand which vaccine they are having, and if they want the other they can reschedule for that one.

I just read a news article which seems to confirm this.

Appreciate the population is minuscule compared to the UK and many other countries but given the recent news re AZ efficacy against the SA strain (which I believe will likely be the same against further mutations) - I can’t help but wish we’d order more Pfizer and give people the choice.

@Baileysforchristmas I actually saw a virologist refer to the AZ vaccine stating “I will lovingly call it the problem child vaccine” - and that sums it up for me.

Wow so EMA and WHO should also not have given it the seal of approval? Well I hope you can book Pfizer. I’m still happy with 100% reduction in hospitalisation and death.

I think we have to vaccinate as many people as we can with what we have. If we combined this with keeping borders closed to anyone who has been to SA and rigourous testing/quarantine of all people coming to the UK, perhaps we could contain the SA variant until we either get more Pfizer supplies or Oxford can make a suitable booster against the variant.
I would probably keep the Pfizer for the elderly/most vulnerable since they could do without even 'mild' Covid.
I'd rather have even a less effective jab than no jab at all.

@Baileysforchristmas but it’s only 100% reduction in hospital and death for the current dominant strain - not SA

[quote doireallyneedaname]@Baileysforchristmas I think we need a vaccine that is more effective at providing protection against a variety of strains. My understanding is that the SA variant is of a significant difference yet Pfizer still protects against it. Perhaps it’s the vaccine type, I have no idea.

I don’t have the answers, all I know is that I won’t feel safe with AZ as it stands and I can’t really believe that people would.[/quote]
It’s not about individuals though. It’s about society as a whole. If the vast majority of people in the uk get immunised by either Pfizer, AZ or another approved vaccine then the virus (regardless of strains) WILL find it harder to spread and mutate.

I don’t understand your comment about not feeling safe. Nobody is suggesting that once you have a vaccine you can pretend that social distancing and the horrendous rules don’t apply to you anymore. The rules depend on what the the virus is doing to the wider population, not you. And the more people that refuse to have it the longer it will take to get to that point

We know it is safe in that the vaccine will not give you anything more than minor side effects. It is also overwhelmingly likely to protect you from hospitalisation and death from covid.

@doireallyneedaname where is there evidence of this?

The evidence is everywhere showing it offers minimal protection against mild - moderate disease, whereas there is evidence showing Pfizer and Moderna still offers significant protection against it. We don’t know yet whether it provides any protection against severe disease (SA strain) but it seems very unlikely given it’s efficacy of 10-20% against mild - moderate, don’t you think?

Do you not think the world and his dog are trying to source more Pfizer vaccine. There is only a small supply. It's really not so easy as 'just get more' we need to use whatever we have. The trial results were not predictable in advance which one would be 'best' so we bought up a bit of everything which is common sense. You cannot buy more now to be instantly available as all the ore order will be satisfied first. You are very naive if you think such a choice is even possible.

For most younger people it barely matters the efficacy. The aim is not to stop you personally from getting COVID (I've had it. So have loads of people I know as I work in healthcare. It wasn't all that bad for any of the 50 or so people I know) it is to stop people being hospitalised which any of the vaccines will do and to create herd immunity which means we just need more people vaccinated.

We do not need to be fannying about offering people a 'choice'.
We just need to get as many vaccinated in as short a period of time as we can. This reduces the amount of serious illness and reduces the numbers of possible hosts for the virus which actually makes everyone safer vaccinated or not.

@doireallyneedaname

That’s not really a valid comparison as they are not the same product and one is significantly more effective.

Where did you get that from? Take A Break's weekly immunology column? This week, Coleen Nolan discusses the history of variolation.

Please supply a link with evidence that show AZ doesn’t protect from death or severe illness from SA variant?

@Baileysforchristmas I would suggest you re-read what I said instead of trying to use the old anti vax challenge tactic of “prove yourself with peer reviewed data” - I’ve clearly said we do not know yet but it’s not looking likely given how poorly it performed against mild - moderate disease.

@TheLaughingGenome AZ is less effective than Pfizer. That’s factual information. Sorry if you don’t like it!

I can’t go on ifs and buts, good luck, I hope you Pfizer so you will be less worried in the future.

Grow up.

@TheLaughingGenome based on the response here I’m starting to see I’m one of few “grown ups” educating myself on what is available and what would be best.

@doireallyneedaname so you know better than EMA and WHO?

@Baileysforchristmas you’re missing the point

I understand if you are worried and want Pfizer, fine not a problem but telling everyone else not to use it, is going against advise from WHO and EMA, why would you want discredit a vaccine that has been recommended by top medical authoritisations?

@Baileysforchristmas please show me where I said nobody should have the AZ vaccine

this thread is laughable! a few weeks ago everyone was freaking out about the Pfizer vaccine being an mRNA vaccine, new technology, never been used before, it's been rushed! It enters our cells! It might integrate with our DNA and kill us! Now everyone wants it because it has slightly better stats out of non-comparable trial regimes.

You do realise they both will contain the same RNA sequence of the version spike protein that was dominant at the time and therefore are likely to produce exactly the same "shape" antibodies to the covid spike protein? And that both can and will be tweaked to address slightly different sequence?

I personally would prefer the AZ one and it will be easier to manufacture, distribute and store the modified version so will be easier to get this autumns booster shot I imagine.

Completely ridiculous idea for a policy @doireallyneedaname

You trust clinicians and other experts to decide the most appropriate strategy for a public health crisis. Members of the general public don’t have access to all the information, nor do they have the years of training. I’m an epidemiologist (cardiovascular health) and fully happy for those more qualified than me to decide the best course of action.

Beyond anything else it’s completely unethical as allows those from a higher SES (eg, more educated, contacts in fields, access to jounrnals/internet) potentially better treatment, widening the gap between rich and poor. You’re happy for those with dementia, learning disabilities etc to be worse off because they aren’t as capable of advocating for themselves?

Had my vaccine. I guess if there had been two sat there, Pfizer or AZ and I was given the choice I would go for Pfizer, I wasn't , and it was Az. I'm thankful for that.

I had my vaccine yesterday I had the Astra Zeneca jab. I am happy to have been vaccinated it was much earlier than I expected. I have my next appointment booked for my next jab well within the time frame the manufacturer recommends. My mother had the Pfizer jab yesterday she hasn't been given her second appointment. It states in the literature that the second jab should be given within 21 days but she was told she will be sent for in around 12 weeks. That worries me tbh why are we not following the Recommendation of the manufacturer? What will that mean for the people who are not getting the second jab in time? What will that do to the level of protection and will it preform as well as in trials?

@riveted1 I hope you’re joking. We are in a mess because of the decisions our “professionals” made.

@riveted1 perhaps you haven’t actually read what I’ve said. I said it could be better to reserve Pfizer for those most at risk.