Other countries offering choice of vaccine

[doireallyneedaname]

I have relatives in Cyprus who are able to choose with vaccine they’d like - AZ or Pfizer.

They have been given an appointment for next week and told that they will be told beforehand which vaccine they are having, and if they want the other they can reschedule for that one.

I just read a news article which seems to confirm this.

Appreciate the population is minuscule compared to the UK and many other countries but given the recent news re AZ efficacy against the SA strain (which I believe will likely be the same against further mutations) - I can’t help but wish we’d order more Pfizer and give people the choice.

I really, really hope not @minchinfin. DH hope he'd get Pfizer due to less side effects being reported. He got AZ but I'd have gone mad if he'd refused it!

@minchinfin I can see why some shielders would do it. Right now we don’t know if you can have a different vaccine after another and what the timeframes would be etc. If someone is CEV and has been shielding, I can understand why they’d hold out for the best they could get.

I personally wouldn’t, but I’d still be disappointed.

Exactly what I said!

So well before the OP and anyone who is not in cat 5/6 will ever get the chance to pick and choose.

Because I have seen the scheduled numbers and the dates;

CoffeeandCroissant, where have you seen these - is it through your work? I'm quite curious when my local GP hub will get more vaccines (of either sort) and which one, and how much notice they get about it.

[quote doireallyneedaname]@poppycat10 Pfizer has also been shown to reduce transmission.[/quote]
Well, not quite!

First results suggests that there may be a reduction in transmission.

That data is as early and unsupported as the AZ/10% data was!

When the word suggests is used it does not mean the same as has been shown

HTH

You could also look at it the other way @doireallyneedaname, if someone is shielding wouldn't they want to have a vaccine now rather than holding out indefinitely? My friend was shielding and would have had anything! I'm not shielding so don't know, but I think I'd just want a vaccine!

We aren’t getting any apart from 2nd doses for the next 3 weeks.

Happy to be corrected if that's the case, but then there must be a significant fall in the previously scheduled Pfizer numbers (due to the factory reorganisation) with a catch up next month (as Pfizer have said total quarter 1 figures for the UK will still match the schedule). (Because scheduled second doses at the moment and over the next 3 weeks are very low numbers proportionally. )

(By 'we' I assume you mean the UK rather than a specific area or hub?)

If someone is CEV and has been shielding, I can understand why they’d hold out for the best they could get.

I don't understand that at all. In fact I think it's fucking bonkers and I'd have been furious if my mother or CEV partner had done that after shiellding since April. Why on earth would you continue to leave yourself as vulnerable as you were when you walked in when you could make yourself less vulnerable with the AZ vaccine and leave with some immunity to Covid 19 building up as opposed to none?

In fact you'd make yourself more vulnerable, as more and more people around you were getting vaccinated and developing immunity around you, where is the virus going to go? Nobody wants to be at the back of that queue!

@Thimbleberries No, just from the (now withdrawn) vaccine deployment plan the Scottish government published, but that was from a month ago, so some aspects may now be out of date (for example exact Pfizer numbers due to their factory reorganisation in Belgium).

It only gives weekly numbers for the 3 vaccines anyway (Moderna from April) for the whole country, so no more detail than that and certainly no breakdown of who gets what when etc...just scheduled weekly totals by manufacturer. So it won't tell you anything about what any particular hub or area is (or was) due to get.

ah, ok, thanks. It's probably rightly not available to the public. At first they weren't even advertising the locations in advance due to security, let alone the deliveries. But I do wonder.

I thought I read that the fall in Pfizer numbers due to the factory upgrades was finished now - that it happened the last two weeks of January, and the first two weeks of Feb were the increased production being packaged and distributed. So it might mean increases again shortly, especially if they are to keep their first quarter total the same.

The European Commission set up mechanisms to monitor vaccine exports and considered vaccine export bans at the end of January. It looks like they have approved the latest Pfizer export amount to the UK a few days ago, but unclear how much is coming: www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-vaccine-export-idUSKBN2AB29N. I would think saving it for second doses is a likely strategy given the uncertainty over future supply.

@CoffeeandCroissant

We aren’t getting any apart from 2nd doses for the next 3 weeks.

Happy to be corrected if that's the case, but then there must be a significant fall in the previously scheduled Pfizer numbers (due to the factory reorganisation) with a catch up next month (as Pfizer have said total quarter 1 figures for the UK will still match the schedule). (Because scheduled second doses at the moment and over the next 3 weeks are very low numbers proportionally. )

(By 'we' I assume you mean the UK rather than a specific area or hub?)

I mean my Trust. We only get the Pfizer one and supply is slowing for a while as I understand it. Plant upgrades here and in Belgium.

@minchinfin

If someone is CEV and has been shielding, I can understand why they’d hold out for the best they could get.

I don't understand that at all. In fact I think it's fucking bonkers and I'd have been furious if my mother or CEV partner had done that after shiellding since April. Why on earth would you continue to leave yourself as vulnerable as you were when you walked in when you could make yourself less vulnerable with the AZ vaccine and leave with some immunity to Covid 19 building up as opposed to none?

In fact you'd make yourself more vulnerable, as more and more people around you were getting vaccinated and developing immunity around you, where is the virus going to go? Nobody wants to be at the back of that queue!

I'm with you, @minchinfin.

I'm CEV and shielding. I was thrilled to have my first AZ dose last Tuesday, and for DP to have his today.

It's a massive relief and the beginning of the way forward. There will be second doses, boosters, future vaccines and better social practices that centre young people properly.

I'm positive now.

It might even turn out to be the case that 2 doses of the AZ vaccine by the end of summer, then a tweaked mRNA vaccine 'booster' in the Autumn, actually gives the best protection overall?

Early results on mixing doses of different vaccines using AZ and mRNA vaccines (1 dose of each) looked very promising (caveat, this was tested on mice, not people!), trials on humans will take place soon though, results possible by late June...

Yes Coffee who knows what the outcome will be of all the ongoing data collection?

Far from being scary, bad news, doom and gloom, the current situation is bringing us new knowledge of vaccines, their efficacy and best logistics. It's quite exciting, if you can step back for a longer view!

Also if you are CEV and keep turning down vaccines until the one you like comes along, do you expect your family to keep isolating until you get vaccinated? Do you expect your children not to go to school, not to see their friends? Your partner not to go out anywhere? I would not be happy if my partner expected me to do this. Where does this leave you with work if they expect you back? Furlough stops, do you still expect the government to pay for you to stay at home?

@Baileysforchristmas If people were to do that, I doubt they’d have to wait more than a few weeks for their vaccine of choice.

why wouldn't they? Especially if Pfizer is reduced delivery, restricted to certain areas/hubs, saved for second doses etc. It could well be that even if people would prefer it, the supplies simply aren't there.

I’m in Boston, USA and I have the choice between Pfizer and Moderna. They’re on track to vaccinate the general population by April! Yay!

@Thimbleberries It’s not just Pfizer, Moderna is pretty much the same thing. Novavax also looks promising.

I guess if a shielder is going to wait it could take longer because it’s available for them now, but as time goes on I think it will be easier for someone to choose as we will have a variety.

Moderna won't be here til at least April, wouldn't be surprised if it's later than that, and Novovax even later. I'd expect that Moderna will only be at certain hubs and there are relatively small amounts of supply, not all arriving at once, so someone can't count on being near one of those centres or having the choice to go to one. I agree they look good - but it doesn't really mean someone can just wait a few weeks to get the one they want. More like a few months, until their use is widespread and there are more available. It really doesn't matter how much choice people want, or what they think about the vaccines' relative efficacy - there are just not supplies available to give everyone that choice. The UK had to made bets on what to invest in way back when, and changing to try to order more of certain types won't happen until all the current orders are fulfilled. They may well want different ones at that point, but it's just not really an option right now.

And in the meantime, if too many people wait, there will be more spreading and more mutations that may render all the vaccines useless. So they really have to give out what is available now.

Ooh! Looks like Boris has been reading this thread!!!

😁

I know what you mean. I really want to have Pfizer because i think it has fewer side effects and is better against other strains. But I'm sure by the time it's my turn they'll just be the Oxford one left and I don't really see the point in it.