WHO urges Britain to pause covid jabs after treating the vulnerable

[Jay2020]

Link

www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/30/who-urges-britain-to-pause-covid-jabs-after-treating-vulnerable

I am beyond broken if this means we can't get to any kind of normality.

Surely this could only be advised if they list who should get it first is the same in every country.

Yes exactly.

How does this fit with Indonesia who are vaccinating their working age population.

I don't get to the WHO rationale that if we don't pause vaccinations in this country and give them to poorer countries, the virus will go unchecked and may mutate. It will mutate in this country to if a lot of the population isn't vaccinated. The death rate in this country is generally much higher than in poorer countries anyway as we have more elderly people. They are much more bothered about malaria and TB.

It’s a long thread so sorry if I’ve missed it, but exactly which countries are we talking about? Have we been donating test kits to particular areas that are struggling to get hold of them? Surely that would be an indicator of who is in the most need of assistance.

I'm 28 I want my vaccine, asking as there is a risk I want it I wasn't under the impression young people would be prioritised for the vaccine in the UK, unless clinically vulnerable?

Also maybe if the who had issued different advice at the beginning if all this the world may not be in same situation as it is now .

It's interesting that the one thing the UK do well, we need to share. We haven't broken any rules, been devious, acted outside of the law, or sold misinformation to other countries to affect their decision making. It isn't a global effort, it hasn't been throughout. Places like Oz and NZ have rightly been getting on with relative normality because they had some areas on their side, but largely made good decisions; have they shared anything with us that may have helped when we have been on our knees? Not really. Closed their bars and restaurants in solidarity, or donated some of the profit from them to other countries who have had to close? No of course they haven't because that would be ridiculous. Plenty of countries have had the capacity to prepare for the production of vaccines, just as we did, and the ones that didn't, we are supporting. Are the WHO saying Russia need to share theirs? Demanding that America slow down their efforts? Makes me wonder if the who have EU donors who are trying to apply another layer of pressure.

Yes but that's a bit selfish. 'Your' vaccine? You're less vulnerable than other groups in other countries. This isn't a UK thing it's a global thing and I absolutely think it should be a worldwide effort. Nobody is saying you'll never get one. Just that others should get theirs first. And that's fair.

The UK organised and paid highly for the vaccines so yes it is their vaccine. Or it will be when it get to be their turn on the UK priority list. Bought and paid for by the UK. It doesn't mean we don't support a world wide vaccination program. The UK certainly does. And it also ensures that its own citizens are safe. As far as they can be. You put your own oxygen mask on first.

@Cornettoninja

You're less vulnerable than other groups in other countries

Given the risk profile for covid I’m not sure that’s a blanket truth tbh.

I totally agree. A friend of mine lives in a much poorer country and they are wondering what the fuss is about with Covid. They have children dying of malaria whereas most of the population is not affected by Covid.

@BolloxtoGender
Not being a nationalist is 'sickening' but people who overtly say 'fuck everyone else I only care about those I know' is somehow applauded. Okaaaay then. 🙂

@HettieMills

The anti your own country, self loathing attitude is quite sickening

Yep truly revolting. I trust these people won't be sticking their arm out for the vaccine that could go to someone more deserving than them...

Of course I bloody wouldn't! Are you joking? 😂 I'm 29 years old ffs.

This thread is ridiculous, I actually can't quite believe it. Months and months of posters screaming that people are selfish and how important it is to save lives, when now it's clear that by "saving lives" they actually meant "reducing the risk of me and my loved ones getting covid".

I feel like MN is playing some big joke on me right now

Why should we get back to 'normal life' and have our young and healthy people receiving the vaccine whilst the clinically extremely vulnerable are still dying in other countries?

I'm not in favour of prioritising the "young and healthy" for vaccination, but the answer depends on which countries you're talking about
Even in these difficult times many can afford to sort it out for themselves, and for those who can't I'd suggest looking at just how much we're given to Covax

@marbellamarc

What do you think of Israel? Well that’s a whole new thread right there lol

Well?

Good for Israel, they've played an absoute blinder and done a fantastic job for their people. They ought to be both congratulated and examined for ideas we can implement at home (e.g. drive through vaccination centres).

Having vaccines available at pharmacies and vaccination centres is great, but involves finding parking at the town centres and then being indoors with potentially infected people - we know people can contract covid within 2 weeks of being vaccinated so point of vaccination is a risk vector which could be eliminated by outdoor drive through vaccination. The Israelis had outdoors temporary covered areas to stop the car and receive the vaccine - for all those concerned about our rainier weather 😂.

[quote Poppystars]**@kowari but they are not at risk of having urgent medical treatments cancelled or risk long COVID or being seriously ill or dying.

And people in England have hardly been able to travel or see families in Wales/Scotland and vica verse.

Ok so you think that travelling to see family is more important than 1,00 people in Uk and other countries dying a day. Interesting priorities. I hope our leaders care about death rates, medical treatments. In Australia you could have dental treatment last year, get cancer surgery. Here nope.[/quote]
No, not what I said. If we vaccinate our vulnerable (the first 9 groups include everyone over 50) then our death rates will drop dramatically, and the NHS will be able to treat both younger covid patients and others requiring medical treatment. I don't agree with people saying that Australia and NZ don't need the vaccine though. Vaccinate all the vulnerable first.

Of course I bloody wouldn't! Are you joking? 😂 I'm 29 years old ffs

I would say good, but if your sorry arse came through my hospital with covid because you're a vaccine refuser I would be very fucked off. I'm sure most people working on the frontline would. You are the definition of a covidiot.

Like everyone, I've had a horrible horrible year. I'm isolated and depressed. But why should we get back to 'normal life' and have our young and healthy people receiving the vaccine whilst the clinically extremely vulnerable are still dying in other countries?

Do you apply this selfless, globalist attitude to everything, or just vaccines?

Every time you spend money on 'non-essentials', to use a popular word these days, do you think "I don't need this new pair of shoes. £50 could save a life in another country. Why should I have luxuries while others suffer?" And do you then donate that money, along with all your excess funds? Because, on a utilitarian 'moral' basis, that money could surely be put to better use, couldn't it?

And 'getting back to normal' isn't simply about being able to go to the cinema or meet your friends. It's about people's livliehoods. Children's education. People's mental and physical health. So putting aside the need to limit spread on a global basis, I don't think it's selfish or immoral to want to see these things sorted out soon, especially as Britain is big doner to the Covax global vaccination scheme.

Agree - that the vaccine we have bought is 'ours'

But we ordered way more than we need because we ordered early - before we knew which ones wouid be safe and effective.

We could relinquish that excess - particularly any which require a single shot only, as that simplifies roll out in areas without good infrastructure.

Because yes, there is something very wrong with healthy young people in rich countries getting it before vulnerable HCPs who weren't lucky enough to be born into privilege we take for granted here.

The slogan "we're not safe until we're all safe" has considerable truth to it.

But had to grin at the suggestion of tech billionaires funding this - not least because some already are, and look what that did for Bill Gates (as an aside, his funding of the global campaign to suppress malaria is also praiseworthy)

This thread is ridiculous, I actually can't quite believe it. Months and months of posters screaming that people are selfish and how important it is to save lives, when now it's clear that by "saving lives" they actually meant "reducing the risk of me and my loved ones getting covid".

Of course people want to reduce the risk to themselves & their loved ones first. It's human nature.

I disagree with the WHO, mainly because the countries which are slow off the mark will continue to be so, and the countries who are proceeding quickly would be pausing (at risk to their citizens) for an uncertain benefit. I also think, given the shockingly high death rate in the UK, that it is hard to argue vaccination should not proceed as quickly as possible.

I think it would be better to focus on increasing production, especially of the vaccines which are easiest to administer correctly.

Of course we should share with the rest of the world, once the most vulnerable in the UK have been immunised, not selfishly hoard the vaccine because Boris desperately wants to improve his ratings.

I'm dismayed to see such moral bankruptcy being so widespread.

We need to model global solutions to a global crisis, if we don't start learning to cooperate now, we're fucked once the effects of climate change really start to hit. And it may not be us with the vantage point next time.

@HettieMills
Are you a HCP?

@HettieMills

Of course I bloody wouldn't! Are you joking? 😂 I'm 29 years old ffs

I would say good, but if your sorry arse came through my hospital with covid because you're a vaccine refuser I would be very fucked off. I'm sure most people working on the frontline would. You are the definition of a covidiot.

When did I say I'd refuse the vaccine? You asked if I would stick my arm out for a vaccine that could go to someone more vulnerable. No I wouldn't! I would have the vaccine if it was either going to go to someone in the same category as me or in the bin. If I'm required to have the vaccine then I will, happily. Don't twist my words!

To all those pointing out the high contribution to COVAX: That's certainly commendable, but it doesn't help anybody as long as all the rich countries insist on having priority for the vaccination, and right now the program isn't doing any good at all:

www.spiegel.de/international/world/a-stalled-global-vaccine-drive-the-west-s-greed-could-come-back-to-haunt-it-a-dc4b8653-d935-4938-928a-746b031bf0c9

"Covax hasn’t distributed a single dose so far."
"Poor countries are now facing a supply shortage that has been created artificially because of Covax’s structural failures – and they will now have to take what they can get on the world market, in some cases at higher prices."
"South Africa is awaiting delivery of doses of the AstraZeneca vaccine that are being produced in India. Reports in the media suggest that the country is paying almost twice as much as the EU per dose."

Did the WHO ask Germany to share out their testing capabilities when they had loads and the rest of Europe had very little?

[quote Perfect28]@BolloxtoGender
Not being a nationalist is 'sickening' but people who overtly say 'fuck everyone else I only care about those I know' is somehow applauded. Okaaaay then. 🙂[/quote]
Do get a reality check and brush up on your comprehension skills.