What do EU nationals think of the vaccines mess?

[Frazzled2207]

I’m a committed remainer. But the EU really did mess up last night. More seriously they are not in a good position right now with regards vaccine supply. Lots of anti-Eu posts here right now from committed remainers like me.

Just wondering what EU citizens make of all this and is there any bad feeling towards the UK? Do you think the EU has a right to some of the UK’s vaccine supply? Are people angry at the fact that the UK was able to secure more vaccines more quickly? Or are we coming across as selfish idiots?
Generally curious and am not here to start an argument

Isn't it just that Kate Bingham's team prepared brilliantly for the impending vaccines from May 2020 having managed to persuade the UK govt to pay for vaccines which might not work in case at least one of them did. This is quite an expensive thing to do but definitely worth it. I am guessing the EU didn't do the same thing.

Every nation, UK included, has laws on the books that in times of emergency, that nation or bloc’s manufacturers are required to prioritise contracts based on not who paid or ordered first, but to their own nation or bloc’s orders first.

The WHO declared a pandemic on the 11th March 2020 but it appears to have taken the EU until now to realise it's an emergency. If they'd sorted vaccine procurement with the kind of haste that they tried to trigger article 16, they wouldn't be in the mess they're in now.

@PlanDeRaccordement

I’m a supporter of EU. This mess was caused by Brexit. British remainers did in fact warn the U.K. that the EU can close borders to imports and exports in times of emergency. They were laughed at and their warnings called Project Fear. With lots of “they (the EU) need our British exports more than we need theirs”

Of course, no one thought the exports would be vaccines from EU to U.K. during a pandemic. But as you can easily see, the U.K. needs this export. So this is a bed of thorns made by Brexit and it was fair to remind the UK of this. So, now you are reminded of the mistake of Brexit, it is ok by me to send some of our vaccines to you as a humanitarian gesture. Like we do aid to other countries as well.

There is so much wrong with this that I don’t know where to start!

Just reminding you it could exercise it’s legal right to direct it’s own manufacturers to prioritise EU contracts

Why are you referring to UK-based manufacturers as EU manufacturers?

@Pippa234

"But the basic idea of making vaccines on your territory to export them to save lives abroad rather than lives at home is what people in the EU find unacceptable. It is - clearly - the patriotic duty of those wielding power to protect its citizens."

They wanted our vaccines that are made here...

And the UK want our vaccines made here in the EU. It works both ways. The UK don't want any UK made AstraZenica vaccines leaving the UK until UK citizens are vaccinated. But the UK is also outraged at the EU bringing in legislation to stop EU made Pfizer vaccines (and others) leaving the EU until EU citizens are vaccinated.

@AllWashedOut

EU is fighting hard for its own citizens. UK would do the same if the roles were reversed.

Not excusing the EU: they have messed this vaccine procurement business to the detriment of EU citizens.

But the basic idea of making vaccines on your territory to export them to save lives abroad rather than lives at home is what people in the EU find unacceptable. It is - clearly - the patriotic duty of those wielding power to protect its citizens.

So you would support the UK preventing exports of the Oxford/AZ vaccine to Europe, regardless of any contractural agreements, on the basis they're made on our territory so are ours to do what we will with?

I came on this thread thinking it would be comments from EU citizens. Instead it's just erupted into another anti EU thread between Brexit and remain voters.

Can we stick to the question the op posted!?

@FatCatThinCat

I think the EU are fighting hard for us. I think the british media are whipping up an anti EU frenzy and I'm incredibly saddened to see how the UK public are lapping it up. Some of the threads on here give the impression that many brits will be cheering with glee if our vaccine rollout fails completely.

I disagree. Many of the posts I’ve seen are criticising the European Commission for getting the whole process horribly wrong, and at the same time stating that it is a shit situation for the EU citizens who deserve much better. I don’t think anyone wants the vaccine rollout to fail in the EU.

@FatCatThinCat

We haven't actually got into a pissing contest with them we just bought a vaccine that was supplied in line with our contract

I think that the venture capitalistsworking for the government in the UK did well in investing in and securing the vaccines.
I think the EU has been too slow to get its act together on vaccine procurement.
I think the jingoism, gloating and smugness demonstrated by the UK media and some individuals on here makes me despair of humanity.

Honestly, even before this latest debacle we were already annoyed with the frankly laughable level of planning, both the ridiculously low number of doses organised and the last minute plans for dishing it out.
Even with the Pfizer vaccine the local hospital is complaining they dont have the doses to vaccinate. Seems a total shit show and I'm not sure why the UK is being blamed.

@FatCatThinCat

I think the EU are fighting hard for us. I think the british media are whipping up an anti EU frenzy and I'm incredibly saddened to see how the UK public are lapping it up. Some of the threads on here give the impression that many brits will be cheering with glee if our vaccine rollout fails completely.

I agree with this. I have no strong feelings towards the UK other than about the difficulties Brexit has made with trade. The UK press is whipping up a frenzy about this but our media barely mention the UK when talking about vaccines.

I think the british media are whipping up an anti EU frenzy

The EU media (well, some of it) hasn’t exactly come out of this in a good light. The Bilt article - need I say more?

@PlanDeRaccordement
Yes they are AZ vaccines, but are manufactured by UK and finished in the UK then distributed in the UK.

Just as you say the EU can stop vaccines going abroad from its shores, surely the same statement could apply to the UK?

Why would a later contract with the EU/AZ override a previously established contract with the UK/AZ. Especially when the UK started planning this manufacture last February so to avoid the very difficulties the EU is facing now.

Sadly the EU are a slower machine, and had failed to hit the ground running back in February last year. Someone in power failed to grasp the mechanics of vaccine production and has not ordered enough from a variety of sources. I believe the UK invested as much in this vaccine roll out for our uk population as was the total investment for the entire EU. So yes, we were ahead.

It brings me no joy that the EU has been so poorly managed. This is people's lives, death of loved ones and crashing economy. The very least we should be doing is helping them once our vulnerable groups are protected and we have surplus to send.

What a mess.

I’m in the eu and the papers seem surprised and deeply disappointed by the vaccine situation but are focusing more on az than the U.K.. The commissions abysmal handling of this has not featured... so far.

No matter what way you look at it, it’s a shit situation. The amount of vaccine produced is still ramping up - everyone will eventually get it but it’s going to take time. That means that there are still going to be deaths.

We have been disproportionately affected by it in the UK insofar as we’ve had the most deaths. Let’s face it, ordering the vaccine is the only thing our govt has fucking got right.

Perhaps if the EU had pulled its finger out earlier this wouldn’t have happened. Although I can’t understand how earlier ordering could have significantly increased production now.

I don’t want to be inflammatory, but what would have happened if we’d stayed in the EU? Would we have vaccine now or would it only just be being approved still?

There is almost no awareness, let alone understanding, of the Irish border issue in general or with this case specifically.

@PlanDeRaccordement

Think you’ve got your facts arse over tit love.

The UK have the majority of the AZ vaccine production because the EU AZ factory isn't working very well yet.

The EU have the Pfizer production despite it being a US company

The EU threatened to block the Pfizer vaccine exports not the AZ. They don't have any AZ to block that's the problem.

It would be a really dumb move in the end to block Pfizer exporting to other countries presumably including the US because their predictable response would be to move production out of the EU which would lose German jobs.

That's why they never actually did it just threatened it. It is very important to the EU that the U.K. don't look to have obtained a major advantage from Brexit on this or others may get the same idea. Hence the fuss. A smokescreen to divert attention.

To bring the Irish border into it was so far overstepping and provocative as to be shameful.

I hate the Tories. I hate Brexit but the EU are all shades of wrong over this. It is shameful and embarrassing and a gift to Brexiteers.

Although I can’t understand how earlier ordering could have significantly increased production now.

The vaccine takes some weeks to produce. Yeilds vary from batch to batch. Scaling up production takes time. We had quite a few problems with production but starting earlier gave us the opportunity to iron things out before we had regulatory approval and were ready to start vacinating.

Speaking to very pro EU family in Ireland this morning and they’re all highly critical of the EU’s handling of vaccine procurement. And the decision about the border without even informing the TS.

Procurement Has been very slow and hampered by the decision to include a large order of French vaccine which isn’t looking hopeful.

The EU should have placed a timely order for AZ or increased its order of Pfizer. But it didn’t.
It still hasn’t managed to even approve AZ yet.

From what I seen yesterday, the only thing that came out of the UK goverment up until The article 16 thing was Gove coming out and saying it would effect our supply of vaccines

The UK goverment was pretty quiet all day yesterday, it was the EU that kept escalating it all day!

The EU’s poor management has given leavers in EU member states a huge gift...WTF is going to happen if this leads to the entire bloc dissolving??

@FOJN that makes sense - thank you

The UK government part funded the AZ/ Oxford research arrangement
France part funded SanofI

The EU backed the wrong horse unfortunately, this is the nature of medical research and big pharma

It's a shame that the EU did what they did in Ireland, not clever

What a shame it has come to this.

I did not want to leave the EU but wonder what other members might follow suit now