What do EU nationals think of the vaccines mess?

[Frazzled2207]

I’m a committed remainer. But the EU really did mess up last night. More seriously they are not in a good position right now with regards vaccine supply. Lots of anti-Eu posts here right now from committed remainers like me.

Just wondering what EU citizens make of all this and is there any bad feeling towards the UK? Do you think the EU has a right to some of the UK’s vaccine supply? Are people angry at the fact that the UK was able to secure more vaccines more quickly? Or are we coming across as selfish idiots?
Generally curious and am not here to start an argument

@Focalpoint

Are the uk not jealous of Israel?

Wow, no. It's so impressive they way they've thrown the kitchen sink at their vaccination programme. There have been various newspaper articles I've read where the focus is always why are they doing so well & what can we learn from them.

I'm very surprised people in Ireland aren't more annoyed about it. The Irish government were I think. Seems to me like the EU were pretty quick to throw Ireland under the bus in a very disproportionate way

If people in Ireland are annoyed, they won't be represented in the Europhile media or commentariat.

Are the uk not jealous of Israel?

@Focalpoint um, nope! I’m genuinely happy for their success, it gives the rest of us hope. What an odd comment!

Atm I think all this is just the result of someone having had enough, lost the plot and in sheer rage invoked art. 16. Then came to their senses and backtracked. And yes, it was a mistake.
Tbf I am in awe at the EU diplomats for not loosing their shit in the past years of negotiations

Hahaha! Sorry but this comment is hilarious

[quote Stovetopespresso]@Tobleronehouses good point, Gove has offered (patronisingly) to share 🤔 but probably limited amount enough to stave off bad PR. let's hope we share with poorer countries too.[/quote]
Firstly, take a look at what we’re currently donating to covax (and compare it to the amount from the whole of the EU).

Secondly, we massively hedged our bets on various vaccines. We had no idea, at the time, whether any would be effective and also approved by MRHA. We basically covered all bases “just in case”. The fact that it has paid off in numerous vaccines is great. But that’s very different from placing a huge/disproportionate order for an established product at the expense of everyone else. And, in addition to the covax funding, the govt have mentioned a few times that the aim is for any surplus stock, once priority groups have been vaccinated, will be diverted elsewhere.

I’m shocked that I’m defending the govt so strongly, but this really is one area where credit is due. Both in terms of very early planning and investment, along with making plans for offering help elsewhere.

All legal arguments aside, another reason I’m so disappointed in the EU over this is that their “argument” with AZ should have been held behind closed doors. Boil it down to the very basics, they have chosen to attack a not-for-profit attempt to get us out of this current situation. Yes, there are going to be stumbling blocks along the way (which the UK were able to start ironing out due to signing earlier). The fact that the EC went on the offensive so harshly for a not-for-profit in times of a pandemic really doesn’t sit well with me. The cherry on their cake was not even being competent enough to correctly publish the “redacted” contract with AZ. Actually, that was more like the sprinkles on the cake. The huge shiny cherry was article 16 - it doesn’t matter that they withdrew it a few hours later, the fact they invoked it really showed a completely flawed “strategy”.

Here’s hoping that all production sites can get glitches ironed out and production ramped up over the coming weeks.

Well apparently we, this. What has been called, shitty little inconsequential, crap Island is going to "help the mighty strong 27 nation eu with vaccines!!

Good comment, @Furries.

Ireland is a small country. They seem to be a bit renegade in refusing to change their corporate tax, pissing off half of the EU, GB and Trump lol at times along the way. I don't think that anyone at any level in the EU gives two shiny shites about peace on the island of Ireland. I suspect Biden being US president might have shifted the political landscape slightly as we don't know what he will do if he perceives Ireland to be shafted in any way. For such a tiny little part of land that is in dispute, bloody hell, they seem to get pulled into everything. Palestine is a similar victim to international politics. Sort it out.

The jealous of Israel comment was a response to an earlier poster saying the EU were acting out of jealousy of the UK.
Agree with you that both are totally ridiculous positions!

This thread asked about how EU citizens view this issue. My response is that the EU are just protecting the interests of its citizens in a dispute with a pharma company. The commission took it too far with the Article 16 threat which was promptly withdrawn.

Lots of "committed remainers" suddenly seeing the Brexiteer light. Funny that.

The commission took it too far with the Article 16 threat which was promptly withdrawn.
What is/was the threat?

@Justthebeerlighttoguide

Well apparently we, this. What has been called, shitty little inconsequential, crap Island is going to "help the mighty strong 27 nation eu with vaccines!!

Um no. U.K. has already been in receipt of many millions of vaccine shots manufactured in the EU. EU has ordered vaccines that may be manufactured in the U.K. it's not a competition.

@Focalpoint

Are the uk not jealous of Israel?

Can only speak personally, but no from me. Bloody good on them.

Am not sure how it would have been taken here in the UK - securing a large order based on monitoring and releasing data. At the end of the day, am happy that they’re getting so many people vaccinated. And it’s hopefully going to be beneficial to see evidence of the data that’s going to be collected. It could reinforce certain strategies, and could also throw up problems - either way would hopefully be beneficial to how other countries plan their strategies.

It is possible to have voted remain without thinking that the EU are perfect.

This now withdrawn incident would not make me vote Leave. The incident being the invoking of Article 16, not the dispute between AZ and the EU which is nothing and which will be resolved.

@Waspnest

Yes I love both the pizza and Take That (on another thread) descriptions of this farce.

I loved the pizza one on this thread. But am now intrigued by a Take That one! Where can I find it?!

Furries I think it's this one.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/coronavirus/4150598-Can-anyone-quickly-sum-up-what-the-EU-dispute-all-about?pg=1

I am both British and French and I was a remain supporter. I no longer am.

I was already rather appalled by Macron's behaviour after the Kent variant was made public (closing the border, causing that lorry chaos & the potential threat of food shortage).

What happened in the last two days has been pathetic and they behaved like bullies. From now on the EU can get lost as far as I am concerned.

A lot of European posters on here are saying they haven’t noticed much reporting on this topic or that it is fairly low key.

If all that tough talk wasn’t for internal consumption, I’m not sure what it was for. I was stunned to watch the news for the past few days seeing EU representative lose their cool and speak directly to a UK audience in very aggressive terms. Then threatening the Irish border briefly. What was the point in saying all this wild, inflammatory stuff to a UK audience? The UK is more united than ever. Leavers and remainders are coming together, Nicola Sturgeon’s boats have been spiked (who’d want to join the EU now?) and all parties in Northern Ireland finally agree on something. The UK also looks like a better safer bet for life sciences investments than the EU.

If this jingoism didn’t play well to a EU audience or wasn’t even noticed by them, I’d say the EU representatives are totally incompetent or perverse.

They’ve done the UK a favour.

I just feel sorry for AZ, a company making zero profit off all this.

[quote MesmerisingMinerva]@Furries no we aren't. Far too slow.

But I wouldn't be happy with the uk rollout either. Too hasty and risky with the 3 month gap.[/quote]
Completely understand, the slow process would be sending me nuts!

I kind of agree re the risk with the switch to 3 month interval. I’m trying to not drive myself totally insane due to the pandemic! So am currently rationalising things as follows:

• it’s a global pandemic and no-one knows the 100% correct way to handle things
• the data seems to show that the level of protection from the first dose is good and that the second dose simply extends the level of protection
• by getting the first dose to double the amount of people, it will hopefully have done impact on the level of those needing hospital treatment

It’s definitely a gamble. My hope is that it works out - not just for the UK, but that hopefully data will help other countries to feel confident in adjusting their processes.

I can’t even construct a reasonable sentence re it not working out - my brain can’t contemplate that thought right now!

@Splodgetastic wow, and people on this thread have said I have been shit stirring.

My tentative return to MN has been tough. So sad that it reflects the divisive and angry discourse elsewhere in the UK fora and press.

We used to be better than this here. People have tried to make me feel shit on here tonight for giving an opinion in answer to the OP and defending it.

I don't mean to be "I remember when this was just fields" but the tone here has been surprisingly aggressive. We used to be able to debate much more nicely.