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Can anyone quickly sum up what the EU dispute all about?

104 replies

2boysand1princess · 29/01/2021 18:44

I’ve been so busy recently with wfh, homeschooling 2 primary kids and looking after a baby etc that I’ve not been keep up to date with the news. What’s the dispute over the vaccines and EU all about? Is there an obstacle for us getting the Oxford vaccine into the county now? If so why?
Thanks Flowers

OP posts:
HarveySchlumpfenburger · 29/01/2021 20:32

I suspect before that happens they would make sure any remaining doses are 2nd rather than 1st doses.

I love your confidence in the ability of the U.K. government not to fuck this up. We’re already running an experiment on how many weeks between doses, leaving the population partially vaccinated with high levels of circulating virus.

Love the Take That analogy.

mrshoho · 29/01/2021 20:36

@titchy

The UK booked Take That to sing at its wedding reception in London.

Three months later the EU booked Take That to sing at Angela's birthday in the same day in Berlin, but several hours later.

Take That said yes to Angela on the basis that they could get a flight in time - which was looking possible on EasyJet. But crucially they also said we'll do our best, but if the flight gets cancelled we won't be able to get there.

EasyJet did cancel the flight so Take That told Angela it couldn't make the gig.

Angela threw her toys out of the pram and demanded the UK cancels Take That singing at its wedding.

The UK told Angela to fuck off.

Angela then told the UK that it wouldn't deliver the UK's wedding dress that was being made in the EU.

Very good.

The EU are looking rather hypocritical right now and so worrying that they can disregard the NI border agreement so abruptly.

At the same time it's disheartening to see this bickering from all round. Can't help but feel China is laughing its head off. Cool heads are needed and I am hoping a satisfactory solution is found.

titchy · 29/01/2021 20:39

In all seriousness what is being missed here, and I suspect will continue to be missed for months to come, is that the AZ vaccine is most suitable for developing countries and they won't get so much as a sniff of a shipment till all of Europe has been fully vaccinated - probably not for another year Sad

LetItGoGo · 29/01/2021 20:45

The AZ/ Oxford is to be produced at different sites worldwide.

LetItGoGo · 29/01/2021 20:46

It's an international effort, one to be proud of tbh.

mrshoho · 29/01/2021 20:46

Sad but true Titchy. Every country for itself and all that.

PatriciaHolm · 29/01/2021 20:47

Technically, I think it was Take That that told the EU to fuck off.

The UK has just carried on issuing wedding invites and telling invitees everything is going ahead as planned.

HarveySchlumpfenburger · 29/01/2021 20:51

@mrshoho

Sad but true Titchy. Every country for itself and all that.
I thought the WHO had pointed out this was a bad idea early on and that we needed more equality between countries with Covid vaccination. Obviously they got ignored.

Absolutely pointless for anyone to rush ahead because not much changes until a certain number of people are vaccinated everywhere.

Marmite27 · 29/01/2021 20:54

@MargaretBall

^^Good article from the Irish Times on Wednesday for a slightly different take on the debacle , although out of date re the contracts publication.

“If the vaccines row wasn’t real, Boris Johnson would have to invent it

Europe Letter: The pandemic will not end without international co-operation

An EU demand for vaccines made in factories in Britain fits perfectly into the jingoistic and conflict-focused strain of British reporting on the EU.

An EU demand for vaccines made in factories in Britain fits perfectly into the jingoistic and conflict-focused strain of British reporting on

If a mischievous god wanted to do so deliberately, it would be difficult to engineer a conflict between the European Union and the United Kingdom more embittering than the rivalry over whose citizens should first receive a life-saving vaccination in the midst of a raging pandemic.
The tale is tangled, and obscured by the fact that the contracts signed by pharmaceutical companies are being kept confidential to protect competition.
But AstraZeneca was the EU’s first great hope. It was the first pharmaceutical company with which the bloc signed a contract, back in August, for up to 400 million doses. BioNTech-Pfizer and Moderna surprised the bloc by overtaking AstraZeneca: their vaccines were both granted approval by the European Medicines Agency (EMA) before AstraZeneca even applied on January 12th.
By that stage, many governments had already built their vaccine strategies around the assumption that the British-Swedish company’s vaccines would arrive first. AstraZeneca’s vaccine was more attractive than the others: it was based on a more familiar technology, cheaper, and easier to distribute, as it can be stored in fridges rather than requiring a deep-freeze supply chain.
The supply problems spell deep trouble for those countries – mostly Europe’s more struggling economies – that opted to rely heavily on AstraZeneca. Even more so if the vaccine does not receive approval for those aged over 65 when the EMA decides whether to authorise it on Friday. (A relatively small number of people over 65 took part in the trials of the vaccine, and the EMA has not ruled out that the vaccine could be approved only for younger groups.)
The EU has reacted angrily to a surprise update from the company on Friday that it would deliver the EU only a quarter of the vaccines initially agreed by the end of March. Tensions were stoked further when AstraZeneca chief executive Pascal Soriot claimed EU and UK supply chains for the vaccine are separate, and explained the delay was due to EU dependence on just two factories, one with a production problem. The EU insists its contract named four plants – two of which are located in the UK – and that the EU’s supply should come from these as well.

This row arose in an already febrile atmosphere, in which some political actors in Britain are keen to represent its vaccination head start as a benefit of Brexit, and are glad for opportunities for more antagonism with the EU of the kind that fuelled Johnson’s rise to power.
Already this week, a proposal by the European Commission to require pharmaceutical companies to provide data when vaccines leave the bloc resulted in British front pages claiming the EU was threatening to block the UK’s vaccine supply.
An EU demand for vaccines made in factories in Britain is a tabloid dream, or nightmare, come true. It fits so perfectly into the jingoistic and conflict-focused strain of British reporting on the EU that if it wasn’t true, Johnson would have had to invent it.
Yet here’s a fact that fits awkwardly into that narrative: according to Britain’s vaccine taskforce, its initial supply of AstraZeneca doses were made in the EU, in plants in Germany and the Netherlands.

Like last year’s fight for PPE, the row reveals how toxic competition for scarce resources can be and how quickly it can escalate. And how if all sides act in their own pure self-interest, all are left worse off. If Britain blocked AstraZeneca exports to the EU, the EU could block Pfizer exports to the UK.
Some read in the affair a justification for the EU’s strategy of jointly procuring vaccines, because it’s just a taster of the vicious fight that would have ensued if 27 member states were all competing against each other, with Germany inevitably coming out on top.
But there’s a far larger story than a fight among the world’s richest populations over who gets a vaccine first. The EU has put €500 million towards buying vaccines for poorer countries, but because supply has all been block-booked for the rich nations, that doesn’t translate into doses. As of last week, 39 million doses had been given in richer countries, according to the World Health Organisation. Among poorer countries, just 25.
The WHO has warned that unless doses are equally distributed internationally, new variants may continue to emerge that will make the whole effort fruitless.
“It’s in every nation’s own medium- and long-term interest to support vaccine equity,” WHO director general Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus wrote this week. “Until we end the pandemic everywhere, we won’t end it anywhere.”

Conveniently forgetting to add that the UK has contributed more than the EU to that developing world vaccine fund!
mrshoho · 29/01/2021 20:58

My feeling exactly Rafals. It feels like everyone's lost the plot and racing along but we're in this for years to come now and collaboration needed more than ever.

knittingaddict · 29/01/2021 21:02

@titchy

The UK booked Take That to sing at its wedding reception in London.

Three months later the EU booked Take That to sing at Angela's birthday in the same day in Berlin, but several hours later.

Take That said yes to Angela on the basis that they could get a flight in time - which was looking possible on EasyJet. But crucially they also said we'll do our best, but if the flight gets cancelled we won't be able to get there.

EasyJet did cancel the flight so Take That told Angela it couldn't make the gig.

Angela threw her toys out of the pram and demanded the UK cancels Take That singing at its wedding.

The UK told Angela to fuck off.

Angela then told the UK that it wouldn't deliver the UK's wedding dress that was being made in the EU.

Best explanation that I've seen all day. Grin
2boysand1princess · 29/01/2021 21:07

@titchy

The UK booked Take That to sing at its wedding reception in London.

Three months later the EU booked Take That to sing at Angela's birthday in the same day in Berlin, but several hours later.

Take That said yes to Angela on the basis that they could get a flight in time - which was looking possible on EasyJet. But crucially they also said we'll do our best, but if the flight gets cancelled we won't be able to get there.

EasyJet did cancel the flight so Take That told Angela it couldn't make the gig.

Angela threw her toys out of the pram and demanded the UK cancels Take That singing at its wedding.

The UK told Angela to fuck off.

Angela then told the UK that it wouldn't deliver the UK's wedding dress that was being made in the EU.

Just seen this 🤣🤣🤣 Definitely get it now!
OP posts:
HarveySchlumpfenburger · 29/01/2021 21:08

@mrshoho

My feeling exactly Rafals. It feels like everyone's lost the plot and racing along but we're in this for years to come now and collaboration needed more than ever.
I feel like we’re all suffering some sort of temporary vaccine madness today.
CayrolBaaaskin · 29/01/2021 21:28

Basically both the U.K. and EU signed a deal with Astra Zeneca for vaccines. Astra Zeneca have had problems with one of their factories which affected their ability to supply vaccines (basically the factory concerned did not pro. They say that this will affect the EU vaccine supply and the EU are challenging this and asking why it is not affecting the UK supply and have published the contract. This has led to hysteria In the media.

Separately, the U.K. government accused Nicola Sturgeon of hoarding vaccines and not administering them quickly enough. Nicola said the vaccines received were being administered and wanted to publish the supply details. Now she is being targeted with a load of ridiculous but predictable claims that she’s a traitor, etc.

CayrolBaaaskin · 29/01/2021 21:36

@Crakeandoryx - what do you base any of that on? We haven’t seen the U.K. contract and the EU contract is ambiguous. It isn’t relevant when you agreed a contract, just because one contract is agreed before another doesn’t mean the terms of one is more important than another.

StealthPolarBear · 29/01/2021 21:38

So what are the potential consequences? Clearly takr that have already broken up, thousand of heartbroken teenage girls

Spiratedaway · 29/01/2021 21:39

@titchy

The UK booked Take That to sing at its wedding reception in London.

Three months later the EU booked Take That to sing at Angela's birthday in the same day in Berlin, but several hours later.

Take That said yes to Angela on the basis that they could get a flight in time - which was looking possible on EasyJet. But crucially they also said we'll do our best, but if the flight gets cancelled we won't be able to get there.

EasyJet did cancel the flight so Take That told Angela it couldn't make the gig.

Angela threw her toys out of the pram and demanded the UK cancels Take That singing at its wedding.

The UK told Angela to fuck off.

Angela then told the UK that it wouldn't deliver the UK's wedding dress that was being made in the EU.

Idiots guide and I understand now haSmile
cyclingmad · 29/01/2021 21:48

Whilst the EU throw their toys out thr pram and piss countries off, the UK has been busy buying more vaccines Grin

Batten down the hatches and prepare for another hissy fit

MaggieFS · 29/01/2021 21:57

@PatriciaHolm

Technically, I think it was Take That that told the EU to fuck off.

The UK has just carried on issuing wedding invites and telling invitees everything is going ahead as planned.

Yes, this is how I read it too.

SummerBody1 · 29/01/2021 22:48

@titchy
I think catering would be a better analogy.
The UK booked a meal for 100 (contract unknown.)
EU booked same caterer meal for 400 - caterer explained difficulty accomodating so many. EU paid £300 million to improve kitchens.

'Best effort' is in contract, but described in dense legal text - not quite a la Judge Judy. Includes companies 3 other kitchens, should 1 be unable to deliver.
Days before first delivery of 100, caterer phones 'can only do 80'. Day of delivery, caterer says, well actually, it's 30 now. EU, 'WTF!'

Justthebeerlighttoguide · 29/01/2021 22:52

collaboration needed more than ever.

^^ some collaboration with the 27 would be a great start.

Blerg · 29/01/2021 23:23

God, what a mess. Though it’s reassuring that the UK seems to have lots of options, I keep remembering something some wise scientist said almost a year ago (not sure who, and paraphrasing), but in tackling Covid, we are only as strong as our weakest link. This lack of cooperation feels concerning.

Pinkcanoftan · 29/01/2021 23:42

I think

HJ40 · 29/01/2021 23:47

I see the EU have changed their minds on the NI decisions.

But what still worries me is if they do start playing silly buggers with Pfizer exports. We've invested a lot for huge numbers of people to have their first dose and they will need the second.

I hadn't seen as pp said that some components were made in the UK. Hopefully that gives some leverage.