Why should the UK vaccine supply be diverted to Europe?

[lovelemoncurd]

They ordered 3 months later than the UK. They have themselves less time to sort glitches. They have been slow to the table and now they wish to punish to UK for being efficient.

I was a remain voter. I'm starting to change my mind!

@maddy68 they also are delivering on the order albeit not in time frame
The uk also funded and pre ordered as did other countries

@Motorina, thanks for the link.
Based on that article, I'd say Sturgeon would be an utter fool to re-publish vaccine supply numbers.

Agree they didn't find it all but the amount was substantial twitter.com/JJHTweets/status/1354694948692570113?s=19

@maddy68 how much is that per nation though and compared to other nations , percentage wise .
Does that money also cover order ?

@Dongdingdong

is it not simply first come first served?

The EU is NOT a butchers shop!

Indeed not. Most butchers shops do not work on the basis of 'Might Equals Right', which as far as I can see is the EU position.

Given the news that the Oxford/AZ vaccine is only being licenced for under 65s, then the EU position is in essence that vaccine supply should be diverted from 70+ people in the UK, not all of whom have had a first dose and only a fraction of whom have had a second, to give a first AND second dose to under 65s in Europe.

I feel a sudden urge to apologise to all my leave-voting friends.

"A failure of the vaccination plan would unleash a crisis of European institutions' competence and confidence in them, which is difficult to restore"

I think the phrase there is "No sh1t sherlock" - the real irony being that we don't yet know just how well the AZ vaccines will even work

Thanks for the link, Motorina - I've no idea either if the Scotman's reputable (though it can hardly be worse than the Mail) - but if Wee Nicola really did say it, good luck expecting Boris to play when she wants her next referendum

@maddy68 have you read the comments to the links do many different versions and this should still be between az and eu they should not if dragged uk in the way it was
Although most countries main leaders have not commented much I see, maybe they are waiting to see all evidence as well , the media spin things any way and people have to read between the lines to get to the truth

[quote donewithitalltodayandxmas]@maddy68 the eu didn't entirely fund it at all[/quote]
From Ambrose Evans-Pritchard in today's Telegraph:
"The UK and the US invested seven times as much public money per capita to accelerate the vaccine breakthrough, acting with war-time energy while the Commission remained stuck in its bureaucratic box-ticking subculture, catering to the lowest common denominator of 27 states. If ever there was an example of why Brussels should not be let anywhere near policies of real national sensitivity, this was it."

www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2021/01/27/astrazeneca-scapegoat-european-commissions-staggering-institutional/

(I know a lot of posters turn their noses up at the Torygraph - I'm historically and instinctively a Guardian reader, but I believe in knowing what the other side think - but AEP is a reputable journo who typically fact-checks and references his articles very carefully).

In March France and Germany would not allow exports of PPE to other EU countries and the whole thing was shambolic...
India have a good vaccination programme vaccinating 1.4 mil by the 24th and so compared to international standards they have not done well.
It's much easier for EU politicians to say that British vaccine producers let them down and the British are being unfair because they won't share than to admit their own shortcomings.
It's classic political blame-shifting behaviour but I don't think that it will go down well with the member states.

[quote donewithitalltodayandxmas]@bluethrough if the eu are correct then it is still their beef with Az there was no reason to bring the uk into it the way some have, and no one has corrected this.
Pfizer is behind and So they should be treating all the same
Everybody wants more than can be provided at the moment
Demand outstrips supply [/quote]
UK is getting 29m doses by March out of its order of 100m, for 50m people.

The EU is getting 25m out of 400m ordered but over a longer time period for 400m people.

We've ordered 367m vaccines and the govt has discussed giving vaccine to the EU, which is excellent news.

AZ is now going to publish the contract.

The don’t want it now anyway for over 65s.

[quote maddy68]Agree they didn't find it all but the amount was substantial twitter.com/JJHTweets/status/1354694948692570113?s=19[/quote]
I'd also like to see vaccines made available to all pharma companies to be able to manufacture.
Such as the Pfizer/ Sanofi deal

If i can get generic pain killers etc, Cv vaccine should also be treated in this way.

When in doubt, check the Swiss media for a no skin in the game analysis.

"La Commission a une carte à jouer. Elle mettra sur la table en fin de semaine une initiative pour renforcer la transparence dans l’exportation de vaccins vers les pays tiers. Des notifications seront demandées aux entreprises qui exportent, avec des précisions sur les destinataires. Une démarche que Londres observe de près, soucieux justement que ça ne bloque pas son approvisionnement, ce qui pourrait alors se transformer en première grande crise post-Brexit.

Mise particulièrement sous pression par Berlin pour agir en ce sens, la Commission a assuré hier que ce ne serait pas une interdiction d’exportations. C’est pourtant bel et bien ce qui s’était passé l’an dernier avec l’épisode des masques avec de vrais blocages. La Suisse en avait d’ailleurs fait temporairement les frais."
www.letemps.ch/monde/lunion-europeenne-se-sent-bernee-fabricants-vaccins

I’m a committed remainer, buy my god the EU are behaving like petulant toddlers over this!

In the Guardian it says the EU are going to stop vaccines doses entering the UK, it doesn’t sound like the EU are taking their issues with the supplier.

I'm in the EU and the pandemic has completely changed my feelings on the EU now.

I'm in Lombardia, where the EU's response from right back at the start went down like a cold cup of sick in my rural corner.

Things have not improved since.

Yes @Baileysforchristmas

The EU is laying the groundwork to stop exports
www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/28/belgium-launches-investigation-of-astrazeneca-vaccine-plant

Time to fire up trident!

@Bluethrough - Astrazeneca did that. It'a Novasep factory that had the main problems.

Greedy twats. We paid for them fair and square, months before the EU ordered any. This has totally changed my feelings about the EU, I’m glad we left!

From the Guardian, "The criteria for blocking exports will be published on Friday, with adoption of the mechanism expected within the coming days"

Strange how they can move at the speed of light when it suits isn't it ...

@CrotchBurn - not surprising. Many aeons ago, I drafted UK legislation implementing single market (and third country import) directives into UK law. This sort of non-tarrif trade barrier dressed up as something else (health legislation, "transparency" about where vaccines are destined for) is absolutely standard Commission MO, I'm afraid (and it's shit, and designed to be shit, for the third countries on the receiving end, which, post Brexit, we number among).

However, presumably this affects Pfizer exports. So in effect they're saying "the one card we have left is - give us your UK produced AZ vaccines, or we will block supply of second doses of Pfizer."

I still think turning it into a bash-Brexit-UK exercise, when it's actually a quarrel with AZ (and one where AZ has the moral high ground - they were indeed contracted on best endeavours, as far as I can see this is standard practise in the pharmaceuticals industry because of problems of scaling when you industrialize a process) which the Commission are trying to distract attention from (because they have cocked up on so many levels - not procuring enough doses, dragging their heels on approving the vaccine, all sorts of dodgy dealing over saying "we'll centralise procurement" then doing deals with the French to protect Sanofi's position, then finding Sanofi couldn't deliver the goods).

Which is not to say the UK's handling of the covid pandemic hasn't been woeful. Every big decision Johnson and his merry band of raving incompetents had to take was made two weeks late, with catastrophic results and one of the worst death rates in the world as a result. But the vaccination programme is the one thing they have got right, and the thing the EU has cocked up.

I find it interesting to read the US press for the same reason you read the Swiss media - and even the Democrat leaning, pro EU outlets seem to be pretty much "the CEO of AZ is telling it straight, the Commission is trying to use it as a distraction from a cock-up of their own making, and however much of a disaster one thinks Brexit was, this really wasn't the fault of Brexit."

Whilst an export ban is obviously not ideal, it’s worth remembering that it will have no effect on our AZ supplies which are now entirely within a UK supply chain.

Of course it will affect Pfizer supplies and it will have a knock on effect on the vaccine rollout, we only ever ordered 30 million doses of the Pfizer compared to 100 million of the AZ and I imagine a large proportion of that supply is already here and being distributed.

No 10 not ruling out sending vaccine to EU- headline in Guardian
Ridiculous. Once the EU started using bullying tactics that should have been the end of any negotiation and any possibility of sending them our vaccines.

The issue is getting the second doses of the Pfizer for those who have had the first. Really what she should be looking at now as a worst case scenario is to just negotiate the amount we need to ensure that for those who have received the first dose, tell the EU to fuck off, and with the reimbursement of payments with a nice little layer on top for non delivery, concentrate on AZ.