Primary schools back sooner than expected?

[deeplybaffled]

It’s hard to know what to believe, but PHE now seem to be suggesting that primary schools can safely return after half term - which seems to contradict all other recent reports and government comments
focussing around Easter!

Snow if it comes to you post it later I’ll still be interested in hearing it

Joke’s on you Marsha, but you keep ranting on lovely. Like I said, mindsets like yours and failure to explore other solutions (you can’t even be bothered to read a thread) are the reasons we’ve failed and the reasons we will continue to fail. But yeah hilarious, you just keep laughing Marsha, you just keep laughing.

Btw Snow my point about enforcement was a positive one. You think we don’t do things for others. I say rubbish we are pretty good actually. Much more positive.

.Snow My solution to keyworker issue is...

Complete the sentence

You came on to thread with a huge old rant

[quote SnowGnome]@MarshaBradyo ffs there are thousands of threads on that and more importantly many many more ways to make things better than if we did nothing.... better TTI, masks in schools, smaller bubbles, scrap school transport, better ventilation, part time schooling for essential subjects, you name it. If you want to unpick any of them there are threads where you can do that[/quote]
👍. Someone who gets it'!

The divisiveness our current system is creating in primary schools KW/vulnerable vs no place is astounding. Even in June this was the case when only certain year groups were allowed back. And some people will continue to point out that schools have been open throughout in England, which is just ludicrous when the vast majority of kids were not allowed to attend, nor was proper teaching provided remotely in many cases for many many months.
I don’t know of any other country doing this “divide and conquer” strategy when it comes to their children. Why can France/Germany/Switzerland/Sweden/Denmark put the rights of the child on par with those of adults but we can’t? Why are we acting more like Asian counties and the Middle East when it comes to our children?! We used to be a society that values the rights of all! And why does anyone accept that schools were not given substantial extra funding to do deal with the pandemic because this is the crux of the matter. Every other sector is being propped up with education left at the bottom.

And then dribble about my mindset

Far too invested

I just want one solution

One solution is we set a cap on how many are allowed in schools, and then let schools decide who they think will most benefit from any additional places.

Musicaldilemma - average class sizes in many European countries is far smaller. Sweden averages between 15-22 (22 in cities) so that must make it easier to socially distance (and get all those hands regularly washed!).

Could you restrict KW definition in order to bring classes back in on a rota? (I'll own up that I don't know what the current definition is so might not be possible).

Simple solutions seem improbable in a complex situation.

”sooner then expected”
This is what I take issue with. Boris always said the closure of school was to be reviewed at Feb half term. There’s never been anything official extending that, other then to say 2 weeks notice would be given. The talk of Easter, May half term, September has always been speculation.

The numbers are coming down. Sadly where I live so many people have had it or at least exposure to it. There’s a 450% uptake in key worker places at my DC’s school - they are all in school already!!! Allow those isolated at home to join them.

[quote GabriellaMontez]@ThePricklySheep

This graph shows the reduction in the percentage of the new variant. In England.

Now I dont think this is 'proof' of anything. But certainly doesnt support the idea that this strain is much more transmitted.[/quote]
You said “the new strain is not more transmittable”. That’s a pretty strong statement. I don’t think this observation of distribution of the strains is enough to counter all the actual evidence we have that it is more transmissible.

www.theguardian.com/education/2021/jan/26/teachers-in-england-should-pick-vulnerable-pupils-for-early-return

Scrap school transport so the poorest in society whose parents don’t have cars get punished again . Sounds like a great idea.

@MarshaBradyo

.Snow My solution to keyworker issue is...

Complete the sentence

You came on to thread with a huge old rant

FFS! 🙄

Carpe ah it’s you lovely

Nellodee an answer fab

Notonthestairs- yes class sizes are bigger in primary schools here but the countries I listed don’t all have teaching assistants. So we need to learn to use the teaching assistants to teach temporarily, perhaps pay them a bit more, get all agency staff out. With bigger budgets much more could be done and obviously safety measures such as enhanced cleaning, masks etc In the warmer months space becomes less of an issue with marquees, portaloos etc - it really is all about money and organisation.

@ThePricklySheep

I see it the other way.

The public claims of 70% remain unfounded. Other earlier 'indications' aren't supported.

But its become very widely repeated.

Someone on here asserting fatality rate higher in new variant. Also possible but by no means certain. Equally likely that any increase due to pressure on hospitals.

I do think they could at least get the other kids in for one day a week after half term. Do two hours of outdoor PE (they all need it!) Mine would happily do an outdoor lesson too if it involved running around. Wrap them up.

Did you not look at the links I added?

Also

“Multiple lines of evidence indicate that B.1.1.7 is more efficiently transmitted than are other SARS-CoV-2 variants (1–3)”

www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7003e2.htm

Former teacher here, watching the news and reading the runes, here's my 2p worth.

Easter is late this year, early April, which means that if kids go back on 22 Feb they will get a clear 5 weeks at school before Easter. This means that govt will be very tempted to give in to the perfectly understandable pressure from families who are struggling to cope.

We have a libertarian government that by instinct doesn't like telling people what to do, hence all the 'advice' and appeals to common sense, which in a minority of cases fell on deaf &/or stupid ears.

Up against that temptation will be the weight of medical opinion, which will no doubt counsel in favour of hanging on until after Easter in order to get the R number down to almost 0, and they will point to the (in their opinion) premature lifting of measures last Autumn as a mistake that should not be repeated.

So, as usual, it comes down to medicine v politics. No one votes for doctors, so I think we know what will win in the end. However, the politicians know that having nailed their colours to the mast of 'following the science' they will have to at least appear to still be doing so.

SO - I think we're in for a repeat of the phased return to school that we saw last year after Lockdown #1. The biggest problem in schools will be social distancing and space, so we will see big tents erected in playgrounds and on playing fields, extra support staff drafted in, and probably some rotation of days on/days off between year groups, as well as the previous 'bubbling' reinstated.

With all that in place, I think they will try to get Reception/Y1/Y6 back on 22 Feb, and probably Y10/Y12 in Secondary schools. They won't go for Y11/Y13 first because we already know that their exam grades will be teacher assessed, whereas hopefully the current Y10/Y12 will be taking real exams in 2022 and therefore they will want to get them back on track with their courses ASAP.

Once those groups are back I suspect they will then drip feed the others back as logistics allow, with the idea that all students should get 2-3 weeks of school before the Easter break. By this point the vaccination programme should have covered all school staff.

Finally, because the Summer term won't be interrupted by exams this year, expect a massive catch up programme with extra help for those who have fallen behind. Plans for this will already be in place in individual schools. And if travel is still restricted this summer, then either govt &/or schools may well decide to keep going until the end of July.

Here's hoping that 'normality' will then return to schools in September.

we need to learn to use the teaching assistants to teach temporarily,

Apart from how teaching is not their jobs, how would this help with social distancing if they didn't have a separate space to teach kids in?

The KW thing is a big issue. DH and I are teachers. If our kids can't go in, we can't be in to teach everyone else's kids.

I do wish there was clarity but I do agree with waiting to have a better view of how the covid land lies. New cases are going down, which is fantastic news, but of course this is being achieved on the back of both primary and secondary schools being mostly closed.

We were told last week that we would get a two week notice in England before re-opening. Current going back to school date is Monday 22nd Feb, so we won't have any more clarity until at least Monday 8th Feb.

Anything in the meantime is more data to make an informed choice, and opinion pieces.

@MusicMan65

Former teacher here, watching the news and reading the runes, here's my 2p worth.

Easter is late this year, early April, which means that if kids go back on 22 Feb they will get a clear 5 weeks at school before Easter. This means that govt will be very tempted to give in to the perfectly understandable pressure from families who are struggling to cope.

We have a libertarian government that by instinct doesn't like telling people what to do, hence all the 'advice' and appeals to common sense, which in a minority of cases fell on deaf &/or stupid ears.

Up against that temptation will be the weight of medical opinion, which will no doubt counsel in favour of hanging on until after Easter in order to get the R number down to almost 0, and they will point to the (in their opinion) premature lifting of measures last Autumn as a mistake that should not be repeated.

So, as usual, it comes down to medicine v politics. No one votes for doctors, so I think we know what will win in the end. However, the politicians know that having nailed their colours to the mast of 'following the science' they will have to at least appear to still be doing so.

SO - I think we're in for a repeat of the phased return to school that we saw last year after Lockdown #1. The biggest problem in schools will be social distancing and space, so we will see big tents erected in playgrounds and on playing fields, extra support staff drafted in, and probably some rotation of days on/days off between year groups, as well as the previous 'bubbling' reinstated.

With all that in place, I think they will try to get Reception/Y1/Y6 back on 22 Feb, and probably Y10/Y12 in Secondary schools. They won't go for Y11/Y13 first because we already know that their exam grades will be teacher assessed, whereas hopefully the current Y10/Y12 will be taking real exams in 2022 and therefore they will want to get them back on track with their courses ASAP.

Once those groups are back I suspect they will then drip feed the others back as logistics allow, with the idea that all students should get 2-3 weeks of school before the Easter break. By this point the vaccination programme should have covered all school staff.

Finally, because the Summer term won't be interrupted by exams this year, expect a massive catch up programme with extra help for those who have fallen behind. Plans for this will already be in place in individual schools. And if travel is still restricted this summer, then either govt &/or schools may well decide to keep going until the end of July.

Here's hoping that 'normality' will then return to schools in September.

I was thinking something like this - it sounds fairly reasonable (I think?!)

Then you've 2 weeks at Easter providing a firebreak of needed.

@MusicMan65 thank you. I forget that our primary school did do the Reception/Y5/Y6 first in after the 2020 lockdown. It stands to reason they will do the same again.