Primary schools back sooner than expected?

[deeplybaffled]

It’s hard to know what to believe, but PHE now seem to be suggesting that primary schools can safely return after half term - which seems to contradict all other recent reports and government comments
focussing around Easter!

Although cases are dropping, the ONS data shows they aren’t dropping that fast as the daily figures suggest. Snow? Who knows but Chris Whitty mentioned that very clearly last night,

There is also the inescapable fact that cases in primary aged children are climbing because so many are still in school. If they open them to all ‘as is’ it will be carnage again by Easter. The gaslighting is actually going the other way. Pressure groups and Govt mouthpieces falling over themselves to pretend schools don’t cause problems and community spreads isn’t an issue. 3 lockdowns in, 100k dead and people still make the same mistakes.

@MarshaBradyo see that’s exactly the kind of mindset that means schools will stay closed longer.

@Itisasecret completely agree

Have you heard the term often used on here ‘by consent’

The only reason they’re pretending that schools are safe is to cover up for the fact that they’ve done nothing at all to meaningfully improve measures, or ensure decent remote provision.

@Itisasecret completely agree

[quote SnowGnome]@MarshaBradyo see that’s exactly the kind of mindset that means schools will stay closed longer.[/quote]
What mindset?

What do you mean

I'm happy to go back to school when lockdown ends and not before!

If its not safe for me to go to the pub, get my hair done, or see my mum, then it's not safe for me to be in a poorly ventilated room with 30 different households, after having taken two different forms of public transport!

We had at at least 5 bubbles burst (one of them twice) when we went back last time. Many staff off, two of whom were seriously ill.

Sorry, but the safety and wellbeing of the staff in school is just as important as the children's education.

enforced how

www.legislation.gov.uk/coronavirus

Add onto this, if your workplace closes you can’t just rock up for work. There are all sorts of both soft abs hard ways of enforcing rules. But that’s getting off topic since the schools are following the rules to the letter.

What mindset? What do you mean

The inflexible mindset that there is no space at all between open and closed. I the longer we are pushing for “schools open” in the way they were before, the longer it will take to happen sadly. It’s a failure in the part of govt not of schools, not to have come up with ANYTHING in the last year at all, and their primary objective is to cover that up.

[quote GabriellaMontez]@ThePricklySheep

Sorry for the delay. Go to 10 in the table of contents.

www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/healthandsocialcare/conditionsanddiseases/bulletins/coronaviruscovid19infectionsurveypilot/22january2021#positive-tests-that-are-compatible-with-the-new-uk-variant[/quote]
Thanks @GabriellaMontez

I’m still not really seeing it. I think I must be missing something.
For example:

@SnowGnome

What mindset? What do you mean

The inflexible mindset that there is no space at all between open and closed. I the longer we are pushing for “schools open” in the way they were before, the longer it will take to happen sadly. It’s a failure in the part of govt not of schools, not to have come up with ANYTHING in the last year at all, and their primary objective is to cover that up.

Ok so I’ll ask you directly what is your solution for a half way house? Not the other mitigations but the one where we are not open or closed - isn’t that now

It’s far easier to do rotas if no KW provision.

All dc in for half the time. I won’t say no as my non KW dc could go

Is that the way to go do you think?

Maybe we could put KW in childcare centres so non KW could go

Ok great

@SnowGnome

enforced how

www.legislation.gov.uk/coronavirus

Add onto this, if your workplace closes you can’t just rock up for work. There are all sorts of both soft abs hard ways of enforcing rules. But that’s getting off topic since the schools are following the rules to the letter.

Well yes you can close things. But a large part is getting us to stop private mixing.

Enforcement of that? Largely relies on compliance by consent

@MarshaBradyo here’s a thread I started to discuss this exact thing BEFORE schools were closed, you’ll see some superb contributions from teachers and parents. Feel free to debate the merits of each on there if you think you can do better.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/coronavirus/4119034-SCHOOLS-How-could-we-do-it-better

As for enforcement, private mixing is a problem but the legislation is clear and it can be enforced. That makes it a choice for people as to whether they want to break the rules, not whether they want to do something for the good of society, which was your original point.

I’m starting work now.

Oh god no thanks

I want a simple answer to KW issue

Seems you can’t give it funny that

I really don’t understand why people take a headline and run with it. I don’t watch or read the news, until something is actively told to us by BJ and his team, I don’t see the point in speculation.

We'd love part-time school! In fact, we'd love a 3-day school / 1 day home week even post Covid. Much better than dragging poor kids to school 5 days a week.

@ThePricklySheep

This graph shows the reduction in the percentage of the new variant. In England.

Now I dont think this is 'proof' of anything. But certainly doesnt support the idea that this strain is much more transmitted.

@MarshaBradyo

Oh god no thanks why?

[quote SnowGnome]@MarshaBradyo

Oh god no thanks why?[/quote]
Because as I said I am looking for a solution to KW issue

Do you have it?

It’s not my mindset stopping the schools being half full to allow for SD - it’s because they are in many cases half full already.

So again, how would you resolve it?

It’ll be quicker to type answer than search up old threads

The best thing I can saw was dc going in for outdoor pe once a week. That's the maximum I'd do.

You said: And your suggestion for safe is?
I said: there are thousands of threads on that and more importantly many many more ways to make things better than if we did nothing.... better TTI, masks in schools, smaller bubbles, scrap school transport, better ventilation, part time schooling for essential subjects, you name it

Then you said it’s a cop out so I pointed you to a thread with a superb debate on a whole range of measures which you can’t be bothered to read, so you’re ranting on to try to pin down one part of a solution which has to be multi-faceted.

Bit like you did about people following lockdown out of the goodness of their hearts before I pointed you to all the legislation and other hard / soft enforcement measures, then you said you were only really talking about private mixing (which is also subject to legislation) because you’re fixating on winning points rather than looking at the bigger picture.

Hence the mindset observation.

Have a lovely day.

Laughing a bit at length of that when you could write the solution to KW issue

I’m sure you have it

@SnowGnome

But you see the dilemma? We have absolutely no plans and no measures to stop the virus spreading again once we lift lockdown.

Again.

Nothing has changed and no lessons are being learned. We don’t really know the efficacy of one vaccine dose, and personally I don’t understand why so many people in non-priority groups are so casual about letting a disease fly round that could cause an acute illness at best, long term organ damage, fatigue and cognitive problems at least worst but quite likely, and at worst death since the new variant shows no one is immune.

So the point the scientists are making is that unless something else changes we’d be making the same mistakes all over again. And there are no signs of anything else changing.

The PHE data is widely rubbished as being underreporting cases because it only reports tests from (some) symptomatic people. It depends on 1) people having symptoms and 2) people going for a test. ONS data is far more accurate because it’s a random probability sample if the whole population. It’s statistics clearly showed that school age children including primary were heavily affected.

The govt and it’s utterly useless education secretary are doing nothing but trying to cover their own mistakes by putting off worst case decisions (eg school closures) as long as possible to the detriment of spread. Why else would they have said schools are safe one day and then closed them the next. And the No 10 spin about “he meant safe for children so he was right” was bollocks. It’s nothing but propaganda and trying to pander to sceptics who seem to think 100,000 deaths is an acceptable price to pay.

And I used to be a conservative voter.

High drama here... best case is asymptomatic.

Loads of people are immune.

Most people will not have long term organ damage and certainly wont die.

And I'm not sure people are 'casual'. Just realistic that for most people this is a mild illness.

Its seasonal. That is the big change around the corner.