Australia loosing their minds at being offered the Oxford Vaccine..

[MoirasRoses]

I’ve just been pottering through Twitter & came across a trending thread re-Australia mostly buying the Oxford vaccine. They are losing their minds at being offered the less effective vaccine & accusing the government of wanting to ‘kill them’ & being corrupt & pals with Trump (no idea what he’s got to do with a vaccine from the UK).

Why this major over reaction? Compared to the much more positive & hopeful reaction here? I thought more recently data showed Oxford to be 90% if given 12 weeks apart? And even if only 60%, more than good enough? I was reading an article where a couple doctors were saying almost 100% of people did not need hospital treatment or became seriously ill after one dose. That’s incredible..

@ajandjjmum

Didn't realise this was a UK vs. Aus thread. Shame

I think the problem is that Australians dared to take a different approach. Those who dare to do things differently will always be vilified as it makes others feel insecure in my opinion

@Changi

Try being Irish on here. Massive anti-Irish sentiment that MNHQ ignore. Same with the anti-Aussie sentiment

To be fair, there is an equally huge huge anti-British sentiment on here.

Espoused by Brits themselves.

I don't follow your logic. How does anti-brit sentiment, by brits, justify xenophobia? It tends to be a different cohort exhibiting the xenophobia.

Typical Australian response quite frankly. They have closed their borders and so managed to largely keep COVID out (except for small "escapes"). They are all panicking now about the UK variant getting out of quarantine hotels. I know everyone keeps saying they are doing a great job but I am getting sick of this. They are an island and have essentially just closed themselves off to the rest of the world, they are wreaking havoc across the country with States randomly closing borders, separating families and not allowing people to return to their home state. They have abandoned their citizens abroad and speak about them as if they are dirty, good for nothings who chose to leave Australia and so bugger them. They have no plan for getting out of COVID and have no acceptance of any case numbers. So they want a highly effective vaccine rather than the Oxford Vaccine which will be more effective than the flu vaccine but won't mean there will be no COVID. Quite frankly they can bugger off and make their own vaccine!

Agree that perhaps they should develop their own vaccine if others are not good enough - after waiting to see what happens to us guinea pigs of course.

@ajandjjmum, it is a shame when posters with no knowledge about a foreign country make condescending assumptions - such as that somehow Australia is the only place where people are experiencing 'constraints' as a result of this pandemic.

Australians do get defensive when overseas posters suggest we're 'doing it wrong', especially given the absolute shit show taking place in the UK presently. It is absurd.

@Australia77

Why are you speaking about 22 million Australians as though we are all one person?

Are you that a) stupid and b) xenophobic?

@Wakeupalready thanks for the Twitter links, will check them out!

If you feel I have been condescending @Chookie89, I apologise, that was certainly never my intention.

I am interested in the way that different countries have handled the pandemic - certainly living in the UK, I am very aware that Australia is not the only place where people are experiencing 'constraints'.

My interest is largely from the fact that DS is in Sydney - and when all is said and done, this is a global problem.

What I didn't realise when I commented, is that I was entering competitive territory - I was purely interested in the discussion. Surely we're all old enough to realise others have different points of view, and still have a civil conversation? Not saying that you weren't - just so that no-one takes exception to that!

You're saying Australians get defensive - you've just said that the UK is a shit show. Pot/Kettle?

This is exhausting!

@Chookie89

I am doing that and yes I shouldn't. However, I am certainly not stupid and I am the least xenophobic person I know! I am Australian but living in the UK and I am generalising about Australians yes. I shouldn't do that. However, I know particularly what people in WA are like and they live a free existence as if nothing else is happening in the world. I am bitter and upset about the way we have been treated and spoken about by people from Perth and particularly McGowan. I think his border policy is disgraceful and its makes Perth even smaller and more parochial than it already was. I say that as someone born and bred in Perth. So I feel entitled to criticise!! So I apologise for the Australia bashing but I am very angry and annoyed at the heart ache their attitude and strict borders are causing me and my family.

thank you @ajandjjmum. I appreciate you wanted to have a conversation about it.

I'm sorry but given the case numbers and death toll in the UK, I think it's fair to say it's a shit show. I say this as someone who spent time living in the UK. I absolutely loved it; met some absolutely awesome people, so it genuinely surprises and saddens me that you've not had stronger leadership on this.

Hopefully this thread has shown you that Aussie mumsnet users have to regularly defend ourselves from a small number of pompous and ignorant posters who perpetuate negative stereotypes about Australians. Some posters automatically assume we're one homogenous and rather stupid entity, which is the very definition of xenophobia.

Anyway thank you for your apology and stay safe.

There is nothing like hearing people criticise their own governments to realise how similar all our concerns are, I think.

It's a shame the pandemic has been so divisive because this is the first global challenge, in a long time, where we've all had a common foe (the virus).

@Australia77

I'm in WA too, and I don't get that vibe from McGowan at all. He's come under heavy fire from the hard-right media who have advocated for unlimited movement and 'business as normal' here, due to their Trumpist ideological leanings. As a result, McGowan has had to use some pretty strong language to match the rhetoric that Andrew Bolt et al have thrown at him.

I also think it's a mistake to lump in McGowan with the federal government as they have totally different approaches to this pandemic. I think Morrison's government have been fucking useless as getting international travellers home; his rhetoric on that has been appalling. I sympathise with you there, for sure. That's not an area that state governments can make policy in. It's also not rhetoric that I've ever come across in 'average' Australian - we're a far more moderate lot than the politicians who represent us, inexplicably.

I'm sorry your family has experienced so much heartache. I got married last year and my brother lives interstate so couldn't come, though we'd asked for permission for him to travel. It was devastating and I can't begin to imagine what it's like experiencing bereavement etc in this context.

However, what's the solution? We have a free existence here in WA because of these controls. When other states have locked down, we've continued working and paying revenue into government coffers, which has been absolutely essential for funding the Covid Centrelink support payments. Our elderly and vulnerable people aren't locked away. I'm happy to not have my brother at my wedding, so my elderly grandmother can be well.

I'm not sure how long you've been in the UK, but I can assure you that WA is far less parochial than it was 10 years ago. We had the biggest Black Lives Matter protests in Australia here in Perth last year. There is a ton more emphasis on Aboriginal history and social justice issues than there was five years ago, even.

Perhaps when you do get home eventually, you can come home and work with us at moving things forward even more Perhaps that would feel better to you, than perpetuating negative stereotypes about us to your overseas friends

Hi everyone :) I live in the UK and have family in Australia, so I'm interested in everybody's opinion on this thread.

I know none of us know the answer but just wanted to gague people's opinions. If Australia decide to wait and go with a mass Pfizer vaccination strategy, when they do open their borders do you think it will be an issue as to which vaccine you've had? Do you think they'll still let people in who have had the Oxford/AZ? Or perhaps still insist on mandatory hotel quarantine for those people? Presumably if they're going for herd immunity with Pfizer then it won't be too much of a problem having international arrivals anymore.

I really really don’t understand why everyone is so bitter about Australians not dying! The alternative would be open the borders and let it rampage through the country including our very vulnerable Indigenous population. It seems like a whole lot of people on this thread would be much happier with that! And again Australia IS contributing to vaccinations. And paying for them. Us opening up and letting covid flood the country wouldn’t somehow fix your problems. It would just mean we would be in the same position which would seem silly

Literally everyone I know is happy with things here. Yes it is a pain cancelling interstate trips with no notice but actually it’s a price worth paying for freedom. Literally the only thing being mismanaged is repatriations (and that is really shit) but otherwise I think most people are pretty pro- lockdowns and aggressive management if it means we keep what we have.

Maybe direct your bitterness towards the UK government rather than Australia (I note no one is pissed off at Taiwan who are managing it the same...)

And I think it is fairly obvious why we can’t open up until we have a really effective vaccine if you actually think about the maths. We are happy to wait because we can. And there is no need to design a new vaccine if there is a perfectly good one- we can wait until the hardest hit countries have got going on vaccinations and then wait for later batches because we don’t have the urgency. In the UK ANY vaccine which will reduce the catastrophic death rate will help. Here, using a less effective vaccine and opening up will INCREASE our death rate

I really really don’t understand why everyone is so bitter about Australians not dying!

I really don't think everyone is. Possibly a tiny minority of twisted individuals who are probably just bitter about life in general, but not the UK as whole.

@Wakeupalready
We've also contributed over half a million dollars to assist our Pacific island neighbours purchase vaccines. Has the UK done this or something similar?

Australia committed AU$500m to its neighbours' vaccines.

The UK helped to set up Covax to help all countries get the vaccine, not just our neighbours. The initial pledge was £500m, that's approx AU$881m:
www.gavi.org/news/media-room/countries-pledge-nearly-us-1-billion-support-equitable-access-covid-19-vaccines.

For context, the rest of Europe managed €500m so far; that's approx $785m: ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/ip_20_2262.

The Covax funding shortfall is still over $4bn, but that's in the context of pitiful donations in general. Many countries need to contribute a lot more, but I don't think either Australia or the UK are among them because both already contributed far in excess of their "share".

@Mrbob

I really really don’t understand why everyone is so bitter about Australians not dying! The alternative would be open the borders and let it rampage through the country including our very vulnerable Indigenous population. It seems like a whole lot of people on this thread would be much happier with that! And again Australia IS contributing to vaccinations. And paying for them. Us opening up and letting covid flood the country wouldn’t somehow fix your problems. It would just mean we would be in the same position which would seem silly

Literally everyone I know is happy with things here. Yes it is a pain cancelling interstate trips with no notice but actually it’s a price worth paying for freedom. Literally the only thing being mismanaged is repatriations (and that is really shit) but otherwise I think most people are pretty pro- lockdowns and aggressive management if it means we keep what we have.

Maybe direct your bitterness towards the UK government rather than Australia (I note no one is pissed off at Taiwan who are managing it the same...)

This! why are people so bitter that death and the potential devastation of our indigenous population (which is a culture in which a huge amount of knowledge is passed on verbally - so elders die, valuable knowledge dies too) is actively being avoided! we have a huge cultural responsibility to keep this virus out.

The bitter criticism of Aus and Nz are so misguided when brits have their own islands adopting the same suppression or elimination strategies - where are all the fuck Guernsey/CI comments ?? they have adopted a similar strategy, closed borders, restricted movement, quarantine on arrival etc.
A few people questioning the choice of vaccine on twitter - and all of Aus are slated as ungrateful pricks.... righto

@TheHoneyFactory - it's just a few chattering idiots either way, so assign that both ways; net off the few people making stupid comments on Twitter with the few people making stupid comments on mumsnet. There you go, all idiots happily ignored so everyone else normal in the UK and Australia can continue as friends.

I am extremely proud of British scientists that developed a world class affordable vaccine - and of all of those delivering the vaccines right now, millions are people are going to be safe now.
I am very proud how we have pulled together, and managing really well under the circumstances. We are an international hub - Heathrow particularly link the West to the East and vica versa, it was always going to be tricky with so many connections here.

But on the whole it has been an amazing effort by so many in countries across the world - and most of all I would like to thank Kate Bingham for her excellent policies she will have saved tens of thousands of lives by the time this is over.

@Icanseegreenshoots

I am extremely proud of British scientists that developed a world class affordable vaccine - and of all of those delivering the vaccines right now, millions are people are going to be safe now. I am very proud how we have pulled together, and managing really well under the circumstances. We are an international hub - Heathrow particularly link the West to the East and vica versa, it was always going to be tricky with so many connections here.

But on the whole it has been an amazing effort by so many in countries across the world - and most of all I would like to thank Kate Bingham for her excellent policies she will have saved tens of thousands of lives by the time this is over.

I have pride in my own achievements or those of my children but I really don't get feeling proud of others' achievements when you've had no hand, act or part in them (unless you're being modest and are actually one of the scientists ).

I can understand being impressed or delighted with their achievements, because they are amazing.

I think it is okay to feel very proud of the Oxford team, in the same way that the Germans were very proud of their vaccine. It is called national pride. I am proud of lots of things - my children, my country, my work. When we won lots of medals at the olympics and so on.

It is very motivating to feel the country is behind you, whether you are developing a vaccine or an invention or a team sport.

The vaccine is an incredible achievement. As a volunteer I played my part, so yes definitely feeling collective pride as do most people. It is wonderful news, and will save millions of lives.

It is very motivating to feel the country is behind you, whether you are developing a vaccine or an invention or a team sport.

I agree with you completely there.

I guess I see pride as a personal thing. Enthusiastic, impressed, supportive, grateful are words I would use for others' achievements but not pride.

As I said, he's enjoying life in Australia, but has commented that many of his friends and associates are feeling restricted by the constraints.

Are you seriously trying to tell us that your DS feels restricted by the constraints in Australia, yet there are no constraints in the UK?

Misery loves company.