I’m just angry now

[BathFullOfEels]

They knew a vaccine would be the only way of getting us out of this mess. The country has already been locked down twice. Why, why, why didn’t they use this time to set up the logistics of distributing and administering these vaccines?

Why, why, why are the government allowed to decide who to prioritise to receive these vaccines when they were always going to distribute in a way that benefits them. Surely any government with an ounce of realism would be self aware enough to realise that they would make this vaccine distribution a political decision and instead allow the decision to be made by an independent third party who can distribute it in a way that would allow the country to get back to work. Instead it’s likely that months and months down the line we’ll all be forced to go back to work despite still be unprotected.

I have visions of pensioners being able to swan off on holiday over the summer while the workers of the country will still be unable to.

It’s an absolute fucking farce. Watching that press conference last night just finally made it snap for me - they genuinely don’t know what they’re doing at all

(the vaccinators) will be ready when they need them

I admire your faith, donewithitalltodayandxmas, and only hope it turns out to be justified

@PlanDeRaccordement

Currently the general public are not being invited to get their vaccinations inside hospitals - that should change. Why? Isn’t it better for vulnerable to get vaccine locally rather than have to travel to a hospital that can be miles further away? GP offices are usually closer to one’s home than the area hospital.

Yes, but in my county they are not going to their GP, they are going to central hubs (one per town), nearly always further than their GP surgery.

And now there are very more doses available, it would enable more people to be vaccinated if all sites/staff were used, rather than just GPs.

@passporttohell if you work in clinical trials you will also know there are a few vaccines being worked on , no one knew which one would be approved first
So they would not of planned loads of things until a vaccine was approved as 6 months ago no one knew when or if we would have a working vaccine

[quote donewithitalltodayandxmas]@passporttohell why would you want loads trapping in and out of hospitals that are already full of covid patients ? Better at gp's and are they not already setting up centres like they did with the flu jab ? [/quote]
Yes, GPs are certainly a v good option - but shouldn't be the only option, especially now the vaccination programme is supposed to be rolled out on a mass scale.

If the vaccines and staff are currently available inside hospitals, then it may well be suitable to use these sites/staff for drive-through or outdoor marque type vaccination programmes (safer than indoor, I agree).

Although I should not be so shocked at the complaining as I have even seen on social media some avid Brexiteers saying that they will refuse any Covid vaccine that is not the Oxford vaccine because buy British first and they don’t want to support a “non-U.K. vaccine”

@passporttohell first your saying only gp's then central hubs ? What is it ?

Emergency services, police, paramedics, fire fighters, frontline NHS staff including GPS and practice nurses should receive their vaccines first. Without them and their specialist skills and commitment to their jobs we would quickly see the collapse of our society.

[quote donewithitalltodayandxmas]@passporttohell if you work in clinical trials you will also know there are a few vaccines being worked on , no one knew which one would be approved first
So they would not of planned loads of things until a vaccine was approved as 6 months ago no one knew when or if we would have a working vaccine [/quote]
But the UK massively prioritised the ordering of the AZ Oxford vaccination - hundreds of millions of doses (much more than the others).

So they would have known what logistics would be required for that particular vaccine. And storage/transportation conditions are known before the trials can even start (or it would be unsafe to run the trials).

@rosie1959

Thingybob ok if we vaccinated the young first do you think this will help the NHS become overwhelmed Would you like to explain to the vulnerable groups that sorry we are just leaving you to take your chances

I never suggested that we do young before old, we should use some common sense and not just target one specific age range. There are almost 9 million people over 70 in this country, do they all need to be vaccinated ASAP. I would think there is no rush for a good 75%+ of this cohort. The same is probably true for the CEV and the over 60s

An individuals risk is not only dependent on age and CV status but on exposure risk too. Many people can cut that exposure risk to almost zero so should they be front of the queue? e.g My Auntie Janet who is 81, completely independent and out riding her bike 5 miles a day. If she stays away from her church group and day trips out on the bus she'll be almost zero.

Whereas cousin John, 50ish, is not CV but very overweight with a high exposure risk as he's a taxi driver. His sister, late 50s, is also high exposure risk as she teaches in a secondary school and will still be going in for key worker kids

Those later two are not likely to be vaccinated before the end of the year, do you think that's right? Should Auntie Janet take precedence?

Is it really beyond the wit of the government to come up with an algorithm that includes 'unavoidable exposure risk'? We could then vaccinate those that are most at risk on an individual level and all get back to some normality.

*Names changed but these are real people and I could have added a dozen more close family members

@passporttohell drive thru at hospitals in uk ?? Not many have the space for that and hospitals are pretty busy and they will use hospitals for patients aa well as nhs stuff
But foe those that can get to gp or a hub they will use those

[quote donewithitalltodayandxmas]@passporttohell first your saying only gp's then central hubs ? What is it ?[/quote]
I think I was clear. GPs doing vaccinations are great, but now we are entering the mass vaccination stage, many more options are needed.
Even the government are saying they will now be using pharmacies, hubs etc. But these places should have been ready now - pharmacies are reporting that they haven't even been contacted yet.

[quote donewithitalltodayandxmas]@CharlotteRose90 those over 60 will get it over those over 50 etc so we are doing exactly the same but also prioritising cev ( rightly so) and doing the same as most other countries who have introduced the vaccine [/quote]
I 100% agree with the CEV getting it as I’m one of them. Can’t wait to get my freedom back and stop wearing a mask

@Thingybob yes because that would be easy to sit and weigh up every individuals risk and then decide !!

PlanDeRaccordement also agree! The link I posted above shows UK 5th in the number of vaccinations administered per 100 population. And our figures had only been counted up to 27th December.

@passporttohell why would they contact until needed? All these places will be used to settiNg this up as they do the flu etc
But if they don't have the vaccinea to give them yet whats the point
It may be months before we use them
The vaccine is being given out quite quickly at the moment have you looked at the numbers given elsewhere around the world ?

@CharlotteRose90 but you don't agree you said you agreed with how mexici were doing over 60's first and said thats how we should be doing it , which we basically are apart from healthcare workers and cev also being in the top ( which mexico may well be doing aa well)

Pharmacies are reporting that they haven't even been contacted yet.

There was an article in the Mirror this morning headlined -
Pharmacies' offer to speed up Covid vaccine effort snubbed by ministers, but which included this -

*Boots, Lloyds and Superdrug have been involved in setting up vaccination centres, and NHS England said community pharmacists would be utilised, but it was finalising details of how many.

A spokeswoman said: “As more supply becomes available, community pharmacists able to administer large numbers of vaccines will be the first to play a role.”*

[quote donewithitalltodayandxmas]@Thingybob yes because that would be easy to sit and weigh up every individuals risk and then decide !! [/quote]
Would it be more complicated then weighing up the ever changing restrictions and tiers we currently have?

Ask six questions
Age?
Sex?
BMI?
ECV list?
Job?
In need of care?

Calculate a value, which most could do themselves, then vaccinate all those above a certain level

@FippertyGibbett

The teams who have just finished the flu campaign are best placed to deliver this vaccine, yet they are not being used. They have staff who are qualified and experienced vaccinators, they have fridges, they have equipment. I know vaccination nurses who are currently furloughed , and whose furlough letter states that they are unable to work for anyone else while furloughed. Someone high up needs to see that and sort it, yet it won’t happen.

That's fucking ridiculous.

I'm angry too. I've forgiven the government a lot of mistakes this past year, but this is just too much a mess.

Its really not that hard. The flu vaccine is rolled out every year.

Shambles.

Do you intend to trust the numbers generated by individual or do you expect doctors to generate a personalised risk number for everyone?

How long do you give people to upload the data? Obviously it takes a while for 70 million people to add thier details to a database

How different do you think the resultant ranking would be to the current ranking? If it worth the additional delays and possible fraud?

@Jessuk86

I’m feeling concerned I’ve been offered a vaccine as an NHS worker because I work as admin in a hospital (mental health) I will have it as otherwise I’ll get bagged by work but in all honesty I’d give it to someone else in a higher risk job if I could.

I can see your point. However, in my local hospital the Management Staff (non patient facing) made sure they were first to get the Vaccine, before they even started to roll it out to the front line staff, so I wouldn’t feel bad if I were you.

@midgebabe

Do you intend to trust the numbers generated by individual or do you expect doctors to generate a personalised risk number for everyone?

How long do you give people to upload the data? Obviously it takes a while for 70 million people to add thier details to a database

How different do you think the resultant ranking would be to the current ranking? If it worth the additional delays and possible fraud?

Ok make it simple. Drs receptionist rings an over 80 year old/CV simply asks,

Do receive any care?
Do you go to work?

If answer is no then reply will be

"You are not eligible for a vaccine at this time, please stay locked down"

Thingybob different idea but not going to happen far to complicated

[quote donewithitalltodayandxmas]@CharlotteRose90 but you don't agree you said you agreed with how mexici were doing over 60's first and said thats how we should be doing it , which we basically are apart from healthcare workers and cev also being in the top ( which mexico may well be doing aa well) [/quote]
If you read my post I said it should be the people who do caring jobs first, then the vulnerable and elderly meaning anyone over 60. Dont see why they are doing it in age groups rather then everyone. Although if your talking about going first it should be CEV but that won’t happen so should be the older generation which to me is over 60

@Thingybob

"Do you go to the supermarket?"
"Do you attend hospital and gp appointments?"
"Do you live with household members who leave the home for any reason?"

mindnumbing