I’m just angry now

[BathFullOfEels]

They knew a vaccine would be the only way of getting us out of this mess. The country has already been locked down twice. Why, why, why didn’t they use this time to set up the logistics of distributing and administering these vaccines?

Why, why, why are the government allowed to decide who to prioritise to receive these vaccines when they were always going to distribute in a way that benefits them. Surely any government with an ounce of realism would be self aware enough to realise that they would make this vaccine distribution a political decision and instead allow the decision to be made by an independent third party who can distribute it in a way that would allow the country to get back to work. Instead it’s likely that months and months down the line we’ll all be forced to go back to work despite still be unprotected.

I have visions of pensioners being able to swan off on holiday over the summer while the workers of the country will still be unable to.

It’s an absolute fucking farce. Watching that press conference last night just finally made it snap for me - they genuinely don’t know what they’re doing at all

I agree with you 100% op.
My fil has had his first dose of the vaccine. He is 94, has dementia and lives in a care home. He actually hasn’t a clue about who people are and he doesn’t know his son (my dh) has recently died, despite being told numerous times! My dd is in the shielding group, due to taking immunosuppression medication for a medical condition. There is no word on her getting the vaccine and she is now back shielding (Scotland).

Why on earth are people like my fil (who, by the way, I do love dearly) a priority over people like my dd? He has had a good life and has said he is ready to go, as he hates life where he is now! My daughter has a young family (one of whom also meets shielding criteria) and has everything to live for. It is absolutely awful to think she is a lower priority than her gf!

@passporttohell where have you read gp onlY ? There are centres being set up where I am and also I see one on news yesterday saying what capacity they had and they could increase if vaccine supply does etc ?

The work age population aren’t the ones dying in huge numbers.

The working age population getting sick are not the ones that are going to cause the nhs to become overwhelmed.

By protecting the vulnerable first we are making sure this is over quicker. Once less people are dying or in hospital we can all get on with our lives. Protecting the vulnerable first is protecting all of us.

@Myheartisbroken91 another one who hasn't read the thread even the op has changed her views
As your dd also has someone clinical vunerable what would happen to them if they needed treatment and there are no beds on the hospital

" I have a nurse relative, working in a hospital, desperately trying to volunteer/work overtime (either depending on how the system works) and is actually currently unable to do so. There are many healthcare professionals willing and able (many currently in work so no need to retrain etc) to vaccinate who are being turned away or can't even get through to anyone."

It was exactly like this with the long established NHS suppliers trying to offer PPE to the NHS via the government. Couldn't speak to anyone who could place an order.

in order to give the over 80s a year or two of extra life.

A year or two? Wrong. 80-90 year olds can expect to live 5-10 more years. Life expectancy at 80 without Covid is 10 years for women and 9 for men. At 90 it's 5 years and 4 years.

Calculator here:
www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/healthandsocialcare/healthandlifeexpectancies/articles/lifeexpectancycalculator/2019-06-07

There are many healthcare professionals willing and able to vaccinate (many currently in work so no need to retrain etc) who are being turned away or can't even get through to anyone

So it seems - which is why it's valid to ask why this is happening
I don't imagine anyone blames the government for the virus appearing in the first place, but they most certainly do for the disastrous handling of so much, and rightly so

Sorry for your loss @Myheartisbroken91.

What you say is understandable at an individual level. And makes total sense in terms of who would benefit most. But vaccination programs are all about what is best for the population not about the individual.

@Myheartisbroken91 if dd is cev on england they are in the priority groups ,I am guessing that scotland is similar . And you can go online to look at roughly when you may be due in england again not sure about scotland

@Myheartisbroken91 sorry about your dh as well , hopefully your daughter is one of the ones soon in next few weeks and guessing maybe scotland may even get through them quicker

I'm not going to trouble myself to read the whole thread - I get a certain vibe from the little I have read, and with parents in their 80s, I can well do without that.

I'm sorry you're just angry now OP. Just dropping in to say I am feeling optimistic - I am happy with the prioritisation, the protocols and the roll out of the vaccination programme. This data shows we're doing alright and I've no doubt the roll out will be ramped up in the coming days. ourworldindata.org/covid-vaccinations

@Puzzledandpissedoff where is the proof , if they have enough to administor what we have then yes they will turn people away
No point having 2000 volunteers if you only have 1000 doses

[quote donewithitalltodayandxmas]@passporttohell where have you read gp onlY ? There are centres being set up where I am and also I see one on news yesterday saying what capacity they had and they could increase if vaccine supply does etc ? [/quote]
I think there is talk of one stadium in the region in the future, but currently the vaccine (including AZ Oxford, available to administer since Monday) is still only being given to the public by GPs in my county (NHS staff and inpatients can get theirs in hospitals, but no-one else).

[quote donewithitalltodayandxmas]@charlotterose but that is pretty much what we are doing apart from more over 70's and the cev bwfore over 60's here
And you have said thats how it should work on the lady from mexico post but here your saying it should be different ??? Makes no sense
[/quote]
It should be different because here we’re doing it by age groups rather then just anyone over a certain age. In a ideal world it would be those that care for others and anyone over 60. Every countries different though and that’s why others are working better then ours.

@passporttohell
It is daft that they are working out the logistics after the vaccines have been approved, and the only system in place is a very slow-moving system

Not sure I agree. The logistics depend on the storage requirements for the vaccines, and that could not be known until only a few weeks before approval. In addition, the U.K. started vaccinations on 8 Dec. As of yesterday, a mere 28 days later, 1.3 million people have been vaccinated. That’s over 46,000 people per day. There is nothing slow about that kind of progress especially when you consider they are administering the vaccine as fast as the manufacturers can make the batches considering they have to whole world to supply, not just the U.K. For example, Pfizer’s CEO stated it takes a year to make enough vaccine for 15 to 20 million people. That’s why nations are ordering more than one kind of vaccine from different manufacturers. All the manufacturers are working on increasing the numbers they can make, but currently they’re being used as fast as they are made.

@charlotterose we are doing bu age groups as well plus health care workers and careworkers as they are most on contact
Its no different really at all

@CharlotteRose90 those over 60 will get it over those over 50 etc so we are doing exactly the same but also prioritising cev ( rightly so) and doing the same as most other countries who have introduced the vaccine

[quote PlanDeRaccordement]@passporttohell
It is daft that they are working out the logistics after the vaccines have been approved, and the only system in place is a very slow-moving system

Not sure I agree. The logistics depend on the storage requirements for the vaccines, and that could not be known until only a few weeks before approval. In addition, the U.K. started vaccinations on 8 Dec. As of yesterday, a mere 28 days later, 1.3 million people have been vaccinated. That’s over 46,000 people per day. There is nothing slow about that kind of progress especially when you consider they are administering the vaccine as fast as the manufacturers can make the batches considering they have to whole world to supply, not just the U.K. For example, Pfizer’s CEO stated it takes a year to make enough vaccine for 15 to 20 million people. That’s why nations are ordering more than one kind of vaccine from different manufacturers. All the manufacturers are working on increasing the numbers they can make, but currently they’re being used as fast as they are made.[/quote]
Many of those in the vaccination numbers will be NHS staff getting injected inside hospitals. When that population is done, what happens to the current vaccination capacity inside hospitals? Currently the general public are not being invited to get their vaccinations inside hospitals - that should change.
And the storage requirements were known because those have to be approved before the clinical trials can even start. Uncertainly about shelf-life, stability test results and storage conditions are part of the review process for authorising a clinical trial and will have been known about for months now (I work in clinical trials).

No point having 2000 volunteers if you only have 1000 doses

Very true, but we could at least have them ready to move for when vaccines are available, and so far that's reportedly not the case

It also comes back to the blame game currently going on, with pharma insisting the problems lie with rollout arrangements and government claiming it's all down to supply ... yet another farce to go with all the rest

@PlanDeRaccordement people do not seem to get This and for once we are getting something right and its still not good enough
With the new vaccine approved we will get higher numbers done as well and maybe some more if these volunteers will be asked
But pointless having more volunteers than vaccines

Currently the general public are not being invited to get their vaccinations inside hospitals - that should change.
Why? Isn’t it better for vulnerable to get vaccine locally rather than have to travel to a hospital that can be miles further away? GP offices are usually closer to one’s home than the area hospital.

It should be different because here we’re doing it by age groups rather then just anyone over a certain age. In a ideal world it would be those that care for others and anyone over 60.

Anyone over 60 as opposed to age groups? How are you going to sort all those over 60 for their appointments? Alphabetically?

@Puzzledandpissedoff they will be ready when they need them
We know supply is a slight issue as they are having to get to all so suppliers may be supplying what they said but we all want and need more, plus they mentioned how each batch has to be signed off.
I don't think currently we are doing bad with the rollout , we should keep an eye to make sure it continues but is that not why we are having more tv statements etc
Have a look at europes rollout
This is hugely challenging and tbf the recent flu roll out was good and much larger than normal but again took slightly longer as waiting for more vaccines

@donewithitalltodayandxmas

I agree. As far as I can see the U.K. vaccine roll out is going far better than most other countries and don’t understand why there is so much discontent.

@passporttohell why would you want loads trapping in and out of hospitals that are already full of covid patients ? Better at gp's and are they not already setting up centres like they did with the flu jab ?