Keir Starmer calls for immediate lockdown in England

[herecomesthsun]

www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jan/03/keir-starmer-calls-for-immediate-lockdown-in-england-as-covid-cases-soar

@Beebityboo

So we can expect Boris to talk shit to him on Wednesday followed by him promptly locking down on Friday then? What a shower of shite.

Yeah, redo of 'Starmer is trying to steal xmas, the fucker!' on its way..

@2boysand1princess

What was the maximum number of deaths in a day of covid? Approx 1000? I can’t even remember. Think was April time? We are now getting figures in that region. Don’t judge the number of death on weekend figures like today, as they are always lower than the true number. Weber had pretty high figures last week unfortunately

Deaths are hovering around 450/500 and have been since mid Nov. They are pretty stable at the moment. Nowhere near 1,000 if you look at "date of death". Figures have been high recently because of xmas/bank holiday catch ups. Always look at the "date of death" for deaths, and "specimen date" for cases. They give an entirely different view of where we are currently.

@CompleteBarstool

The trouble is it's too late for a total lockdown.

If it's announced now or this week then 10's of 1000's of uni students, private school pupils etc have already relocated back to their schools/uni which has the knock-on effect of meaning that staff at these establishments then have to go into work.

For example where I work it means hundreds of catering staff, cleaners, maintenance teams and support staff as well as the teachers will have to go to work regardless of any lockdown that's imposed because the children/young people are back and need these services.

If it had been announced before Christmas then the establishments could remain closed and the majority of non-teaching staff be furloughed/work from home.

Uni students going back to Uni doesn't mean staff have to physically return there too! My son is at a local Uni. None of his lecturers etc have physically been on campus since last Easter - they're all WFH. Also support staff, i.e. they have no IT support staff on campus, so any students with IT problems have to be helped via phone/email whereas normally they'd just pop along with their laptop to the IT support suite. Same with the library - it's all automated with just a very skeleton staff for a few hours a day. The staff car parks are basically empty.

@Puppylucky

The changes since March are less to do with the severity of restrictions and more to do with people being less afraid. Back in March the streets were empty because a lot more people were scared to venture outside and basically imposed a hard lockdown on themselves. That's not the case any more. Trying to recreate the March lockdown is doomed to fail without societal intervention that wouldn't be acceptable to most people.

This is also very very true. Didn't SAGE actually predict this? I remember hearing back then that the public will only comply for so long, or something like that. The fear is not there anymore. I mean, some are still (understandably) scared, but the general attitude seems to have moved, quickly (anecdotally, seemed to be the xmas thing that lost most people) from 'be cautious' to fuck this.

I fear that trying to make things stricter at this stage, might actually make more start ignoring the rules. The only way it would work in reality, is with china style enforcement, which surely noone would actually want?

@Tenyearsgone

Most of us are in lockdown though?

What exactly do the people calling for a full lock down want? Lock us in our houses?

Well apart from schools.

I’m in tier 4 and the only thing I can see which is different now is the schools being open. Shut the schools and that’s lockdown. So yes, effectively London is in lockdown. Oh I suppose we can meet one person for outside exercise which I don’t think you could before.

LQ, the list of non-essential shops will be reduced soon I'm sure.

In the interview with Marr, Johnson did say that restrictions were likely to be tightened soon.

Indeed, Marr had a list of things he put to Johnson that might happen. They included a 1hr limit outside the house, the closing of secondary schools (including exam years), no household mixing at all (including outdoors - so no exercising in pairs I guess) and a curfew.

Johnson didn't say 'no we are not considering that' to any of these suggestions.

So even though Johnson hasn't said explicitly and Starmer is being utterly opportunistic with this 'call' both are really on the same page one way or another.

Its just not official yet.

Which makes all the shit with the schools this weekend look utterly pathetic and ridiculous.

Looking at the numbers for my area and the rate they've been increasing, it will be like the SE in a couple of weeks. Why on earth reopen under those circumstances? It makes no sense other than to posture to the public and to pander to the Tory Wing Nuts.

What dirt HAS Williamson got on Johnson?

I just can't see the government position on primaries lasting the week anyway.

Yes, but what did the 454 people die of, sure they were positive but they probably died of flu.

@SmidgenofaPigeon

What do you mean, we are in lockdown do you mean all counties tier 4, all schools closed?

Tier 4 is not the same as lockdown! There's a huge difference between how it was back in March-May to how it is now. Case in point, I saw a pub doing take-out pints and various groups of men sitting in a park and/or standing outside Waitrose drinking them.

The Tier system does not work, and the PM is only putting off the inevitable. However, given how the Government clearly don't give a damn, the apathy of various facets of the media and Dominic Cumming's behaviour back when he broke lockdown restrictions, vast swathes of people aren't going to comply with a lockdown anyway.

Death rate is not necessarily that helpful on its own. We’ve got better are protecting the elderly in care homes and their own homes. However, younger people may not die but they are the ones that can survive hospital and ITU treatment for prolonged periods but survive. So hospitals are not coping because so many of the ‘middle section’ are being admitted due to the high incidence rate. More at risk from covid but strong enough to survive with hospital treatment.

RTB
During the spring lockdown, the BooHoo factory ran at full capacity the whole time
illegal
but where the heck did people THINK their stuff was coming from.

The number of people involved in food production and distribution
and grocery production and distribution
and takeaway restaurant kitchens
is FAR FAR higher than most people realise.

My local big Supermarket has given up on enforcing social distancing
because the staff get so much abuse

THOUSANDS of people are working in Takeaway kitchens
and then sleeping in shared housing

and essentials vary between families

• if you are looking after an incontinent OAP with dementia, clothes are essential.

What the hell? Bore off.

@RigaBalsam, is that the best argument you have?

It's a fact that the unions do have a great deal of power within the Labour Party.

There'd be no problem with a full lockdown in economic terms if the Government would respond to this properly. Scrap HS2 and increase taxes for the mega-rich and they can afford to furlough everyone and support businesses through a week or two of lockdown, easily.

I do agree the borders need to be closed though.

Compared with previous lockdown tier 4 is not as strict, in the first one garden centres were shut and less shops were open, a lot of takeaways were shut (coffee shops, the large fast food chains etc), no support of childcare bubbles, kids playgrounds and outdoor places shut (Forrest, national trust etc). I’m not arguing that some of these could or should shut but tier 4 is not equivalent to the first lockdown

He’s the leader of the opposition, of course he’s going to call for lockdown. If Boris had locked down he’d be calling for it to be lifted. It’s politics.

They included a 1 hour limit outside the house
They had better STFU about obesity then.

@Kazzyhoward - I realise that lecturers and a lot of support staff work from home, I was thinking more along the lines of catering staff in catered halls of residence, maintenance, security, wardens etc. who are on site dealing with the wellbeing of students in halls.

For most people full lockdown won’t make much difference . We are wfh . Avoiding going out . Not socialising . And most people can’t avoid supermarkets unfortunately.

Boris already had said this morning they are considering tighter restrictions . They want to see if the tier 4 restrictions are working.

Whatever happens we all must take personal responsibility as well .

KS can fuck off. I do not want a national lockdown.

Kazzyhoward

If they do another lockdown, then they really need to sort out the self employed support so that the 3 million excluded finally get some support in the hope that fewer people will lose their savings, their businesses and their homes. The crazy support system has given loads of money to people who don't need so much and very little, if any, to the 3 million excluded.

^ yea

Since going into Tier 4, there are people who can't work and many of them aren't getting any help whatsoever. It's disgusting to hear Rishi Sunak saying he's helping everyone who needs it.

I agree that hospital admission rates will have the biggest impact on the population more broadly because beds full of COVID patients means no resource for accidents or other medical treatments - this will demoralise our healthcare workers and families on top of COVID.

Tier 4 is equivalent to the lockdown we had in March anyway isn't it?

Stammer is playing politics

gosh a politician playing politics, this is what the opposition is supposed to do and it is a logical solution to reduce infections

As someone said on here a few days ago: lockdown = the well off hiding away at home while other f-ers do the dangerous work for them.

My DH will go out to work during lockdown - doesn't it benefit those out at work if cases are lower? They are the most risk - why would you want their risk to be higher?

Tier 4 is equivalent to the lockdown we had in March anyway isn't it?

no

@hettyhooverdoover

Tier 4 is equivalent to the lockdown we had in March anyway isn't it?

No - schools, universities etc are open.