Scaremongering threads about children - RCPCH have responded to worrying Twitter claims

[NaughtipussMaximus]

The RCPCH have responded to reassure parents and refute the claims on twitter and elsewhere about increased numbers of children with serious covid19 in ICUs. Please, if you’re worried about your children, read this and feel better. And if you’re one of the ones perpetuating unsubstantiated reports to further an agenda, please get in the sea.

www.rcpch.ac.uk/news-events/news/rcpch-responds-media-reports-increased-admissions-children-young-people-covid-19?fbclid=IwAR0To78ci_Ra9CXHCAV3pM91MO31zfcpmMlcfxi9-ozdtwPu9n9xE54dPc4

Well said @JedwoodDeadwood - the new variant has been around since September and even though schools didn’t close in the November lockdown, children still aren’t being disproportionately affected. In fact it appears to be the opposite, as it was with the first wave.

@Satsumatrifle

And that's how you spot propaganda. Challenge them on the facts and they disappear with a few vague insults.

What propaganda?!? Do you believe the statements from the RCPCH and the Evelina are propaganda? That my posting of them is?! I’m trying to allay the fears of parents who were alarmed by the threads here on Friday night and Saturday.

And yes, @Satsumatrifle I am a concerned parent. I’m not sure why you think otherwise. Because I’m posting links to reassuring official statements rather than unsubstantiated tweets?

Happy that particular story is unfounded, that is excellent news for all parents as her account was very worrying.

As I said at the time - I try to keep an open mind, it was a single account - it could have been true or false.

I think we are all operating in very sad times, where our current government can not be trusted, either to tell us the truth or to prioritise the preservation of human life. That creates huge stress for all of us, as we try to understand.

So my experience is propaganda but the matrons isn’t ? I assume her narrative fits with what you want to promote despite being refuted by reliable sources @Satsumatrifle

I didn’t disappear ...I just didn’t feel like continuing to reply to you - your posts were quite unpleasant towards other posters.

FWIW - I have direct experience - unlike Laura the misguided matron and unlike you.

@Pomegranatespompom

So my experience is propaganda but the matrons isn’t ? I assume her narrative fits with what you want to promote despite being refuted by reliable sources *@Satsumatrifle*

I didn’t disappear ...I just didn’t feel like continuing to reply to you - your posts were quite unpleasant towards other posters.

FWIW - I have direct experience - unlike Laura the misguided matron and unlike you.

Your posts have been very helpful. It is reassuring to hear from someone with direct experience. The comments from paediatricians and childrens hospitals, along with the actual data suggest the situation has not changed for childen in terms of severity. As a pp said, this variant has been ripping through London for a while now so there would have been warning signs (other than one account by one nurse) by now

I am glad you posted this OP. People won't believe you though.

I agree hospital admissions are likely to rise if infection rates go up, but that's not the issue here, the claim was that children in particular were affected by the new variant. She should have kept quiet unless she knew she was right.

Just wanted to point out that Laura Duffel’s interview was not on LBC but on BBC Radio 5 Live. In some ways that makes it worse as you would assume that the BBC would fact check before allowing such claims to be aired, or at the very least give a massive disclaimer after she had spoken to say they had no evidence to back up the claims.

There was a tweet yesterday from a picu consultant saying the report did not chime with the experience in his hospital. A number of others from across the country (including Dr Ranj) then jumped in to say the same.

Paed admissions will be up on April in December, that is true of most years - mainly respiratory admissions . And if they're now testing every child on admission then they may well have a higher rate of admissions with covid. That doesn't mean that's why the children are there.

@Iamtooknackeredtorun is this the tweet you are referring to? It’s worth a read.

twitter.com/damian_roland/status/1345366410386681856?s=21

I don't understand how some people want to make things worse than they already are.
I can see it here as well, some people are exagerating things so much. Someone commenting the other day there would be 12000 deaths per day...we really don't need to make things more dramatic than they already are, they are bad enough already!

I wish it was someone other than Russel Viner offering this reassurance. He has form for cherry picking comforting stats to say that children are not affected by the virus. Note, I am not commenting that I think children are more severely affected by the new U.K. strain. Only that I have reservations about that man, whatever his official position, and have had for some time. If you are interested, do an advanced search on Viner in this topic and you will see many rants about him that long predates his involvement in this matter.

@Noellodee but it isn’t just Viner. Many people have come forward with a different experience.

People are being way too harsh to the matron. If we applied the same standard to politicians they would be sacked multiple times over. Delay in implementing masks, ppe in hospitals/care homes, Cummings, Gavin Williamson and Greenwich council. People make misjudgements, people should not be so harsh.

Plus - it is possible that all things could be true. The word ‘rate’ is notoriously ambiguous because it depends on what the denominator is.

eg is it possible that there are increased numbers of children WITH covid but not necessarily there because of it? Like fractured bone and also covid pos. covid pos are likely to be warded separately to neg. some reasons for this being different from apr may be increased detection of covid due to more testing and also different patterns in the population - which change all the time (eg rates increasing in north or different age groups at different times from each other). This is SPECULATIVE, but we should have nuanced thought and debate rather than just condemnation.

It is good that all those paediatricians did promptly publish those statements so that people know they can take their kids to hospital to get assessment and treatment if they need it.

@Pomegranatespompom thanks for your reassuring comments on this thread. It’s really good to hear from someone who knows what they’re talking about.

www.bbc.com/news/amp/uk-55518248?__twitter_impression=true

Not sure if already shared but on bbc now

People are being way too harsh to the matron. If we applied the same standard to politicians they would be sacked multiple times over.

It's a politicians job to make statements...that's why we don't trust them, all the spin and rubbish, but it's what they do. The job of a HCP is to care for their patients. I was under the impression that having a social media presence and discussing work on it wasn't allowed, it certainly shouldn't be, for this very reason. I've just seen her tweets and one of them she ends by saying that what she's saying is just her observation, not researched in any way. It's very easy to come to a completely incorrect conclusion. She has been stupid and the furore she caused here proves that. She should be ashamed of herself.

I think she had good intentions but misjudged. She seemed to me to be trying to counter the narrative that hospitals were empty etc (as they are not) but was naive to the effects her exaggerations would have. That’s on her but the blame also lies with radio 5 live who presumably asked her on exactly to counter this message so she gave them what they asked for. That’s on them.
Nurses aren’t like media savvy politicians. They don’t get any media training. I think she thought she was doing a public service but it was misguided.

“The new coronavirus variant, which is thought to be behind the spike in cases, appears to be hitting younger people harder. Duffell has been forced to turn over two paediatric wards to children with the disease. “We had the odd child here and there last time, but in this wave we are getting a lot of positive younger people,” she says. “We have one Covid ward for children already and we are just setting up a second one.”

This is in the guardian today from a paediatric nurse... I’m guessing they are all just lying then?

Full story below...

www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/03/it-makes-me-want-to-cry-voices-of-hospital-staff-on-the-covid-frontline?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

[quote Ladydowntheroad]“The new coronavirus variant, which is thought to be behind the spike in cases, appears to be hitting younger people harder. Duffell has been forced to turn over two paediatric wards to children with the disease. “We had the odd child here and there last time, but in this wave we are getting a lot of positive younger people,” she says. “We have one Covid ward for children already and we are just setting up a second one.”

This is in the guardian today from a paediatric nurse... I’m guessing they are all just lying then?

Full story below...

www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/03/it-makes-me-want-to-cry-voices-of-hospital-staff-on-the-covid-frontline?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other[/quote]
That’s the same woman who was on Radio 5 and whose claims are being highly disputed by multiple paediatric specialists. She has presented no evidence to back up her claims.

That’s the same nurse. Plus 2 doctors. I wonder if she gave this interview before her radio interview blew up.
If she has exaggerated this too I think she has been foolish to do so. But I still think she has good intentions.

[quote Ladydowntheroad]“The new coronavirus variant, which is thought to be behind the spike in cases, appears to be hitting younger people harder. Duffell has been forced to turn over two paediatric wards to children with the disease. “We had the odd child here and there last time, but in this wave we are getting a lot of positive younger people,” she says. “We have one Covid ward for children already and we are just setting up a second one.”

This is in the guardian today from a paediatric nurse... I’m guessing they are all just lying then?

Full story below...

www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/03/it-makes-me-want-to-cry-voices-of-hospital-staff-on-the-covid-frontline?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other[/quote]
If you read the article, she is not saying that she has wards full of children seriously ill because of covid. When she's discussing ventilators etc, she's talking about adults. With the children, it will be "red" and "green" wards, head like we do with adults. It's common knowledge that lots of children are asymptomatic. When they are admitted, they are tested. If they test positive, they need to be on a "red" ward, whatever the reason for admission was.

Isn’t this the nurse who was supposedly scaremongering? In today’s Observer - second interview down...

www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/03/it-makes-me-want-to-cry-voices-of-hospital-staff-on-the-covid-frontline

None of the doctors have given evidence. Why does a nurse have to? I sense snobbery.

Nurses aren’t like media savvy politicians. They don’t get any media training. I think she thought she was doing a public service but it was misguided.

Whaaat???

Do we all need media training now before speaking to the press?????