The infection rate for pupils last week was 2,509 out of 100,000!!

[SoscaredforJan]

The Times today had reported that the infection rate for secondary pupils last week was 2,509 out of 100,000!! With the rate for primary school pupils close behind.

That’s absolutely shocking.

Rates of 300+ per 100,000 in the South East led to the emergency Tier 4 announcement at the weekend.

Rates among secondary school children are approx nine times this and primaries not far behind.

There can no longer be any conversation about schools remaining open. They need to close to all but key workers and the vulnerable and not reopen until the government has provided the money and means to make them truly ‘Covid secure’ or until enough people have been vaccinated.

How many deaths will we have in a months time when those infections have transferred to the elderly and vulnerable? How many more mutations will we have if the virus is allowed to carry on running through children? I for one do not want to find out that they vaccine no longer works.

It’s time to do what needs to be done. It’s tough and awful for everyone but it has to be done. The schools need to close.

Using OPs logic we should stop them all mixing in the community

What do you think the current restrictions are about?

School kids are the only section of the population who get to mix freely in large groups with no masks or social distancing.

She might be bizzare but she's putting school staff and children into dangerous settings because of her sheer and total ignorance.

I would move bizzare to dangerous and based in la la land and whoever decides what happens in school should be working closely with not heads or slt but teachers on the ground. Even tas because they are even more exposed.

Just seen tweet on another thread by London school of hygiene, it states hospitalizations and deaths will far exceed 2020 in 2021 due to the new strain and unless primary, secondary and colleges are kept off.

Maybe he is right or wrong but his graphs show deaths exceeding this years because measures won't work unless we simply stop the way the disease spreads.

Agree - dangerous and bizarre
She’s a worry

cmmid.github.io/topics/covid19/uk-novel-variant.html?fbclid=IwAR2UbRXfI-3JaZFb_xKmgL7MRBt1k86SPrD3gYF6N-Vg8-C8CJyHzZUEwww

[quote Marypoppins19]@nicebreeze I was referring to children in the main. Vulnerable children (well those that are known to be) were able to access school in lockdown. I know my own school worked enormously hard to ensure they were in school, but my point is, so many families were made to feel that they didn’t do as good a job as if they had been in school! Utter tosh! Many kids thrived at home. Parents were utterly awesome.[/quote]
My son spent waaaaayyy more time than I was comfortable with on the games console because my husband and I were in virtual meetings etc. I don't doubt the majority of parents, when engaging with their kids, do a great job. They may do some or all of the work set, but it's not sustainable, not possible in many cases and you will not convince me that it's equal to being in school

Many kids thrived at home. Parents were utterly awesome.

We were awesome parents.

Can't say that my kids thrived though. We kept them ticking along so they did everything they needed educationally.

They have thrived since September. Its amazing the difference in them.

For those who want to close schools, what's your long term plan? There are no plans to vaccinate children, so when will you think it's "safe" for them to go back? Or is this just about throwing children under the bus to protect older adults?

@noelgiraffe

Using OPs logic we should stop them all mixing in the community

What do you think the current restrictions are about?

School kids are the only section of the population who get to mix freely in large groups with no masks or social distancing.

I don't know - until recently I could go and spend a day wandering around a shopping centre, go and sit in a pub for a meal. In most places still can.

Children don't "get to mix freely in large groups" - they attend school for education which, short of having private tutor, necessitates being in a single setting together. They leave school, come home and don't get to do many of the things they might otherwise have done (Christmas events, parties, seeing friends and family).

Elizabeth its about using your common sense!

Schools can't open when rates are extremely high. And many kids will take it home.

A short closure to get cases down and where we get as many people vaccinated as possible may be needed, especially in tier 4 areas.

I also say that as a parent whose kids both have 100% attendance and 0 cases in school.

Last week I would have said primaries at the very least should stay open.

The overall evidence supported that but things have changed in the space of a week.

I don’t know if any school where children don’t mix with large groups. Most of ours arrive on overfilled buses, if in KS4 they then have different classes for options and core subjects so could easily be in a room with 100 plus different students and they then eat together with 220+ in the dinning room. I missed the queue outside the pie shop where they all cluster on a tiny pavement sharing their pie breakfasts.

@Wakeupin2022

Elizabeth its about using your common sense!

Schools can't open when rates are extremely high. And many kids will take it home.

A short closure to get cases down and where we get as many people vaccinated as possible may be needed, especially in tier 4 areas.

This might be the case. OP's hysteria doesn't help the discussion though and there needs to be a plan - we don't know how the hell we get out of a tier once we're in it but we need to know what the threshold is for schools reopening

@ElizabethG81

For those who want to close schools, what's your long term plan? There are no plans to vaccinate children, so when will you think it's "safe" for them to go back? Or is this just about throwing children under the bus to protect older adults?

A period of closure during the winter with well set up online learning with all those laptops promised followed by week in week out for the remainder of the winter to keep infections lower until more vaccination is more widespread. Then from March onwards full return with improved ppe, ventilation and mass testing

@nicebreeze but even in schools they are mixing (secondary school teacher here). Hugging, linking arms, joshing, play fighting, shouting at each other, crying over each other, sharing food and drinks. It may be more 'controlled' mixing but it is still mixing. (It's really not controlled just the illusion of it).

Mary closure to March is far too long!

You may be privileged enough to be in a situation where your children can thrive - most aren't.

For people who think schools should stay open, how do you foresee that working out? How many periods of isolation do you foresee? What do you think the hospitals will be like? I'm genuinely curious about your predictions if we follow that path.

@Wakeupin2022

Mary closure to March is far too long!

You may be privileged enough to be in a situation where your children can thrive - most aren't.

I’m afraid hard decisions need to be made. If we want to get out if this and return to normal - harder decisions are inevitable. We can’t have it all, the numbers are clear I’m afraid. It’s far, far worse for children to be in and out and to close, open, close etc. The trouble is, nobody in the dfe is taking control. March is 8 weeks. It’s not forever

@Wakeupin2022

Mary closure to March is far too long!

You may be privileged enough to be in a situation where your children can thrive - most aren't.

And for the record, I didn’t say I was privileged - if only! 😂

Mary well tell me what I need to do to make my kids thrive! As DH & I were mentally and physically exhausted last time.

Quite simply the data in my area does not support closure until March. It doesn't even support them closing now! But I accept this strain is spreading and has already been found locally. So a short closure would be beneficial at least at some point locally, if not at beginning of Jan.

At the very least children in Tier 4 with a vulnerable family member in their home should be allowed to stay at home with no fines. If there is provision for SI students then they should be able to use that.
It's not ideal but if the Oxford vaccine gets the go ahead many of those family members will be in the top 6 groups for vaccination before Easter.
It doesn't solve the problem of cv/ecv children's safety though and there needs to be consideration given to that.

@PastMyBestBeforeDate

At the very least children in Tier 4 with a vulnerable family member in their home should be allowed to stay at home with no fines. If there is provision for SI students then they should be able to use that. It's not ideal but if the Oxford vaccine gets the go ahead many of those family members will be in the top 6 groups for vaccination before Easter. It doesn't solve the problem of cv/ecv children's safety though and there needs to be consideration given to that.

And what about CEV staff or those with CEV family members?

@Wakeupin2022

Mary well tell me what I need to do to make my kids thrive! As DH & I were mentally and physically exhausted last time.

Quite simply the data in my area does not support closure until March. It doesn't even support them closing now! But I accept this strain is spreading and has already been found locally. So a short closure would be beneficial at least at some point locally, if not at beginning of Jan.

It’s about protecting life - I’m sorry you were exhausted. So are icu staff

And what about CEV staff or those with CEV family members?

Vaccinate! School staff needs to be prioritised.

CEV in tier 4 should not be in school.
CV are a grey area :(

This is very London/SE centric. Rates where I am are lower now than they've been for months. Why do we need to close schools here?