Costco denying entry to mask exempt unless they wear a shield

[LifelsAPigsty]

Surely this is discrimination? Some people who can't wear a mask can't wear a visor either (I can't, I have trigeminal neuralgia and can't tolerate any pressure on my face/head/temples). There are other conditions which make wearing them impossible, too. I'm sure the government guidelines state this sort of action isn't permitted?

I don't shop at Costco personally but I'm so worried other places will follow suit (and no, I can't avoid shops sadly - no delivery slots for months here and I don't drive so no c&c. Also no friends/relatives to shop for me).

Yet another layer of anxiety and worry

What if your GP or other professional were exempt? I for one would be backing out of the surgery. Yesterday I had to go for blood tests. If the phlebotomist had not worn a mask, and she necessarily had to get up very close to me, I would have walked out.

I applaud @likeamillpond ‘s mother. This is a public health issue, not something for which rules should be suspended for individual cases.

I have a persistent cough. Wearing a mask exacerbates this. I don’t go in public places at the moment unless necessary because it’s not my right to scare the pants off people.

I hate it when I see people without a mask in shops it makes me nervous but equally I understand some people cannot wear a mask

'How is it doing the right thing when the government do not allow visors to be worn alone?'

Clearly walking round shops where there could well be lots of vulnerable people with significant health conditions then any shield to contain any particles is better than nothing.

I'm sorry you have such extreme TN that you cannot bear anything near your face, it is a however extremely rare. Just take a lanyard with you if you need to go to Costco I believe exemptions are easily printed off online.

Every single contact is a chance of catching it or spreading it with the long term health damage and risk of death that Covid brings.

@IrmaFayLear

What if your GP or other professional were exempt? I for one would be backing out of the surgery. Yesterday I had to go for blood tests. If the phlebotomist had not worn a mask, and she necessarily had to get up very close to me, I would have walked out.

I applaud @likeamillpond ‘s mother. This is a public health issue, not something for which rules should be suspended for individual cases.

I have a persistent cough. Wearing a mask exacerbates this. I don’t go in public places at the moment unless necessary because it’s not my right to scare the pants off people.

This has already been covered upthread.

If you cannot wear a mask, you cannot work in a clinical role.

I don't work in a clinical role. HCPs are very kind and understanding to those with exemptions, I've found.

It's fantastic that you can avoid all public places. Some people have to go to work, however.

@GetOffYourHighHorse

'How is it doing the right thing when the government do not allow visors to be worn alone?'

Clearly walking round shops where there could well be lots of vulnerable people with significant health conditions then any shield to contain any particles is better than nothing.

I'm sorry you have such extreme TN that you cannot bear anything near your face, it is a however extremely rare. Just take a lanyard with you if you need to go to Costco I believe exemptions are easily printed off online.

I know how rare my condition is, thanks. I have atypical TN which is rarer still. It doesn't matter how rare it is. Some people still suffer from it - and other conditions which preclude mask wearing.

And no, shields are not better than nothing when it comes to a virus. They only protect the wearer from splashes and large droplets. They do nothing to protect vulnerable fellow shoppers. Ask any HCP.

I fully understand that there’s a minority of people who cannot wear masks and I accept they have a right to access places in spite of this. What Costco are doing is not lawful and not morally right. However, I wanted to say I have noticed on these threads that there isn’t a lot of compassion for those who are anxious and vulnerable. I’m extremely clinically vulnerable and would feel concerned if I was in a hospital waiting room with a person who can’t wear a mask. There needs to be compassion and thought on all sides.

I feel CostCo could find themselves on the receiving end of legal action for people like the OP.

I use the bus or walk. I have rheumatoid arthritis so can't carry a lot on each trip - c&c has a minimum spend which I don't reach on each trip, plus my Tesco only for cars, I think.

Would a wheeled shopping trolley be a good investment for you? Not just for covid times, but more generally!

Something like this amazon.co.uk/dp/B0827DJ9Z7/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_fabc_KQg5Fb1W9ED24?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1]]

Sorry the link didn't work
amazon.co.uk/dp/B071WM3JK6/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_fabc_aSg5FbM3H711J]]

@Haenow

I fully understand that there’s a minority of people who cannot wear masks and I accept they have a right to access places in spite of this. What Costco are doing is not lawful and not morally right. However, I wanted to say I have noticed on these threads that there isn’t a lot of compassion for those who are anxious and vulnerable. I’m extremely clinically vulnerable and would feel concerned if I was in a hospital waiting room with a person who can’t wear a mask. There needs to be compassion and thought on all sides.

A hospital waiting room should be now laid out so it’s perfectly safe with it without masks (not that I am encouraging no masks if you can wear one obviously)

Every clinic I have been to with DS (CEV and can’t wear a mask not a good combo!) has had very much lower capacity and seats well spread out.

@AvocadosBeforeMortgages

I feel CostCo could find themselves on the receiving end of legal action for people like the OP.

I use the bus or walk. I have rheumatoid arthritis so can't carry a lot on each trip - c&c has a minimum spend which I don't reach on each trip, plus my Tesco only for cars, I think.

Would a wheeled shopping trolley be a good investment for you? Not just for covid times, but more generally!

Something like this smile.]]

I have a few and they're fantastic! The ones you can fold up and put into a tote until you see them are particularly good.

@Haenow

I fully understand that there’s a minority of people who cannot wear masks and I accept they have a right to access places in spite of this. What Costco are doing is not lawful and not morally right. However, I wanted to say I have noticed on these threads that there isn’t a lot of compassion for those who are anxious and vulnerable. I’m extremely clinically vulnerable and would feel concerned if I was in a hospital waiting room with a person who can’t wear a mask. There needs to be compassion and thought on all sides.

I fully understand and empathise with those who are scared and worried. What I find unacceptable is abuse, threats and the 'you could if you tried/selfish/stupid' etc approach.

You're right - compassion and understanding is so, so important, always, but especially at times like these.

Unpopular opinion but why should you get to put others at risk if you can't wear a mask? There must be someone who can go shopping for you - friend, family, local support group, random person on Facebook.

This new version is spreading so quickly that we must do all we can to keep everyone safe.

I feel CostCo could find themselves on the receiving end of legal action for people like the OP.

That doesn’t mean Costco would lose though. You can legally discriminate against protected characteristics if it’s a proportionate means to achieve a legitimate aim, so they have a defence. Public safety in regard to lowering the spread of COVID-19 vs mask exemptions is an untested area of law.

@FairyAtTheBottomOfTheGarden

Unpopular opinion but why should you get to put others at risk if you can't wear a mask? There must be someone who can go shopping for you - friend, family, local support group, random person on Facebook.

This new version is spreading so quickly that we must do all we can to keep everyone safe.

Again... It's not just about shopping.

And I don't have friends/family/neighbours/random person on Facebook (!) to help me do my job or go to my hospital appointments for me. Thanks for the idea though!

"Unpopular opinion but why should you get to put others at risk if you can't wear a mask?"

Do you apply that to babies and young children as well?

OP - just to reinforce that some of us hear you. It's not just about shopping. I don't see why people aren't getting this.
I do think the answer has to be exemption certificates issued by doctors. Then no mask, no entry, strictly enforced.

@Vitaminsss

I feel CostCo could find themselves on the receiving end of legal action for people like the OP.

That doesn’t mean Costco would lose though. You can legally discriminate against protected characteristics if it’s a proportionate means to achieve a legitimate aim, so they have a defence. Public safety in regard to lowering the spread of COVID-19 vs mask exemptions is an untested area of law.

Given that visors themselves are not considered to be effective in reducing the spread, as backed up by the statements of the governments that they cannot be worn alone and in can only be worn in conjunction with a visor, I’m not so sure that an argument that asking a customer to wear an ineffectual visor would be a proportionate means of achieving a legitimate aim. They’d need to have some pretty shit hot scientific evidence, which I would guess even the government don’t have.

There is one thing this pandemic has shown me - the number of utterly ghastly judgemental turds there are who have the compassion of a toad

I completely agree with this. The majority of posts on this thread are disgusting. I don't know how you have stayed so polite OP.

What will these people do once this is a distant memory?

@Vitaminsss

I feel CostCo could find themselves on the receiving end of legal action for people like the OP.

That doesn’t mean Costco would lose though. You can legally discriminate against protected characteristics if it’s a proportionate means to achieve a legitimate aim, so they have a defence. Public safety in regard to lowering the spread of COVID-19 vs mask exemptions is an untested area of law.

And you can only justify indirect discrimination. Direct discrimination is not capable of objective justification (except age)

Unpopular opinion but why should you get to put others at risk if you can't wear a mask

I honestly don't know how someone could type this. It isn't an "unpopular opinion". It is you telling disabled people to stay at home so that you can do what you want. Sickening.

How on earth did you cope pre-covid and pre-masks? Just imagine what you could have caught from those unmasked walking germs that we used to call people. Were you aware that viruses existed before this one, and will do so after? Unpopular opinion but if you are that afraid then maybe you should shop online?

I don't think there are simple answers for both sides of opinions. I don't think the people who can't wear asks should be discriminated. But also the people should be able to protect themselves and feel safe.

The answer for that from Costco is to ask those who can't wear masks to wear the face shield without masks, regardless of gov guidelines, so at least people around feel slightly more safe than people not wearing anything at all.

@LifelsAPigsty

I said in my OP I don't shop at Costco. My concern is that other places will adopt this policy which is both illegal and discriminatory.

If it’s illegal it will be challenged. In any case government agencies including the NHS are not going to stop people seeking essential services if they have mask exemptions.

We are literally talking about one company, that is not an essential shop and actually functions as a members club. It is unwise for someone with a medical condition preventing mask wearing to be anywhere busy and indoors until the vaccine has been widely administered. Obviously for medical treatment etc there’s a clear reason to take the risk. For anything else - the concern should be less about “my rights” and more about “my health.” No it’s not fair that some people with some conditions have to stay at home more because they can’t wear masks.

But life is unfair. My DB who has no children and can work from home has had an easy time in this pandemic. I live in a country where schools have been closed for months and I’ve had to home educate and work and can’t travel to visit my family. We all deal with different shit.

Some people are never going to recognise that they has a duty to minimize risk. Those who do not wear masks are vulnerable, and pose societal vulnerabilities. The ongoing refrain of ‘it’s not just about shopping’ fails to recognise that the point is going out in the minimum amount of circumstances. Given they would arrange a delivery for you, and you could ask for help, you should not be putting yourself and others at risk by going to any supermarket. That is very different to medical appointments that call for exams you cannot do in your own home via video conference (lots of monitoring can be done by patients though, and prescriptions delivered) - and arrangements for using hospital transport are more appropriate than using a bus given your higher risk. I won’t enter into a debate about WFH, as I don’t know what your job is - and employers should be forced to furlough or allow people to WFH. The majority of jobs can be done from home.

Earlier someone raised the question of what you’d do if there was a noxious gas outside in the air that kills you instantly unless you wear a gas mask. It’s not a bad thought experiment to generate alternatives, given the rate of transmission and possible effects of COVID-19. I missed out on 6 months of my babies’ life because I have no choice but to travel for work, so stayed away until I got the vaccine. It was the hardest choice, but also the right one. I know you probably think all those who disagree with you are ableist arseholes, but I really, really want you to be safe and survive this. Just like I do with everyone else. It may be inconvenient, it may be disappointing, it may impact your accounting - but you will not be as likely to die after the excruciating pain of having oxygen attached to your face. I, and I’m sure others, desperately want you to avoid that.