Are they really going to cancel Christmas?

[fedupfrances]

And if they do, will loads of people just break the rules anyway?

It’s sodding ridiculous - myself and DP have barely left the house last week and won’t be going out this week either, other than walks in our local park. My parents have also been at home pretty much constantly. None of us has Covid 19 and the risk of catching it if we get together at Christmas is practically zero. So fed up with this shite!

I've heard quite a few people say they are planning an Aussie extra midsummer Christmas BBQ on 25 June

@PrincessNutNuts

Good on you *@Bimbleboo*.

There is definitely an emotional blackmail factor mixed in with the denial of reality with my family too.

My mum is the sort that usually smooths everything over all the time but once in a while spectacularly blows her top. I think that might be on the cards if my siblings don't acknowledge the danger to my dad and do the right thing - instead of riding roughshod over my parents worries because they (siblings) just want their usual Christmas.

I'm going through similar in my family.

Why can't people accept that it might be safer to do things a bit differently this year?

There seems to be a. We must have all the family around otherwise Christmas will be ruined! mentality with some people.

Cautionary tale. DH tested positive last night, no symptoms when test was booked but this morning feels unwell.

DH, DC and I will be isolating over Christmas. As DC have not tested positive their school will not be informing his close contacts. It worries me that these kids may be seeing vulnerable family over Christmas having possibly caught it from DS. He sits alongside some pupils for 4 hours at a time.

Christmas isn't 'cancelled' regardless of the rules in place. It's still 25th December and it's still happening. It will just be different.

I'm planning to spend it with my parents and brother but they live together and we are part of a childcare bubble with my parents so see each other anyway so not much of an increase in risk. My mum is doing the dinner but I have a backup in my freezer in case any of us tests positive or we have to isolate.

I know it's going to be a lot harder for people with bigger families and two sets of grandparents etc but I think we just have to look at this Christmas as being different and take it how it is rather than thinking of it as 'cancelled'.

@likeamillpond absolutely. I’ve always quite liked the grinch so I’m fine with being him for a year. Absolute nonsense to suggest that if there’s not legal rules stopping you, then you must just hate the family and be looking for an excuse to ban them.

Nothing will stop me spending it with my partner. We live apart and not local to each other but we are still going ahead.

[quote timeforanewstart]@ifonly4 and how many people took part in that poll , I mean all the polls said brexit wouldn't happen as polls are such small numbers you can't ask 2/3000 people and decide from that what 60 million want [/quote]
That is a recognised scientific method, I'm afraid. There is this science, called statistics, that people use to interpret the data.

Political polls are complicated hugely by the political parties' various tactics around election time, and are particularly hard to call. One factor, IMHO, is that right wing appeal is often to voters' self interest (even if it is frequently or a turkeys-voting-for-Christmas nature, as with Brexit). So my impression is that people may say they wouldn't vote Conservative, then get shocked into avoided perceived tax rises, and then spend the next 5 years not-quite-believing that they did that...

@cantdothisnow1

There is logic in the fact that those families who have seen Granny / Grandad for Childcare ought to be able to see them at Christmas but there are plenty of people on here who are planning to travel and stay over in the houses of relatives who they don't normally see for Christmas. There is most definitely a risk to the latter.

It is an impossible situation. I'm glad my family have made it easy by asking us not to visit this year.

I am astounded though that churches in all tiers will be open for services over the festive period as long as you only attend with your bubble. In our church if everyone's bubble went (which is effectively what happens every year) then Church will be crammed on Christmas eve. You won't be able to be separate from other people's bubbles due to lack of space.

Re churches, the CofE have stringent rules on social distancing so churches are limited as to numbers. Our church which seats around 400 and usual congregation around 200 (and packed to limits at Christmas services usually) is now limiting to 40 and they are sat well apart in bubbles ie every other pew, plus careful cleaning etc - we're very covid compliant and have had all the LA checks etc. I think it's the same with all churches. Even given that we've decided this year to do most of our big events online - so carols by candlelight etc as just not viable. We're having an outdoor crib service with limited numbers. It would be madness to go ahead with these things discounting covid safety and any churches who do get short thrift from me.

@Chaotic45

Cautionary tale. DH tested positive last night, no symptoms when test was booked but this morning feels unwell.

DH, DC and I will be isolating over Christmas. As DC have not tested positive their school will not be informing his close contacts. It worries me that these kids may be seeing vulnerable family over Christmas having possibly caught it from DS. He sits alongside some pupils for 4 hours at a time.

I hope you will all have mild or no symptoms. Your post demonstrates the problem. A lot of children and teenagers don't experience symptoms. There have been a few cases at DD's school where the parents hadn't been anywhere and the child had only been at school so the infection must have come from there from someone who is asymptomatic. If families with children mix with anyone else this Christmas it is a recipe for a huge rise in cases.

@PrincessNutNuts

Good on you *@Bimbleboo*.

There is definitely an emotional blackmail factor mixed in with the denial of reality with my family too.

My mum is the sort that usually smooths everything over all the time but once in a while spectacularly blows her top. I think that might be on the cards if my siblings don't acknowledge the danger to my dad and do the right thing - instead of riding roughshod over my parents worries because they (siblings) just want their usual Christmas.

Your mum sounds like an absolute passive aggressive nightmare - I note that she bitches about your siblings to you behind their back; I'm sure she does the same to them about you. While I can see that growing up with her might have given you a slanted view, can't you see that it's completely bonkers that your actual expectation is that the government changes policy just so your mum doesn't have to have a grown-up conversation with her adult children?

@Belladonna12 yes I can see how it can so easily get out of control.

In our case I'm fairly sure that DH's work is the culprit- they have had 10 people test positive, yet still are open and trading 😳

One factor, IMHO, is that right wing appeal is often to voters' self interest (even if it is frequently or a turkeys-voting-for-Christmas nature, as with Brexit). So my impression is that people may say they wouldn't vote Conservative, then get shocked into avoided perceived tax rises, and then spend the next 5 years not-quite-believing that they did that...

Do you realise how offensive that is? All people vote out of self-interest. It is human nature. Politicians vote for the 'greater' good of their electorate - theirs is also a self interest, albeit with input from a large number of people and their own eventual success being dependent on how much the greater good benefits those people. Your suggestion that Brexiteers were turkeys voting for Christmas totally writes off the intelligence of 52% of the voters at that time. People will always vote out of self-interest. Suggesting that Remainers were voting for the 'greater good' and not out of their own selfish interests is as ludicrous as your suggestion that Brexiters were too thick to realise what they were voting for. A lot of people, educated and uneducated, successful and unsuccessful, rich and poor, intelligent and not so intelligent watch the News and follow politics. The information out there was the same for every voter. How voters interpret that information in the context of what will be in their own best interests varies massively across all cohorts of society.

@Madhairday how do you go about determining which 40 of the normal 200 congregation can attend the Christmas service. I can imagine that would be a nightmare unless it's done by a draw/ lottery.

i agree it would be utterly irresponsible for Churches to allow a normal state of affairs, although reading from the Government Guidance they appear to be able to with legal (not moral) impunity, which is nuts in my opinion.

I feel so sorry for the single (often elderly) parishioners who rely on church for their community at this time of year. Many of whom might not have access to internet or the knowledge to stream. I feel much more sorry for them than I do for people who might have to alter their Christmas dinner arrangements.

@cantdothisnow1 we have to do it by a booking system but instead of doing that online we just ask people to phone into the office on a certain morning so that those not online can join in. We have found that most of our more vulnerable elderly don't come though. Those not online (a surprising amount are!) We take a DVD of the service round to them and we keep in touch making sure they have all they need and someone to chat to. It's so hard. I am one of the ECV shielding and it's been horrible even having online access, so yes I do agree. We can only do what we can.

There seems to be a "We must have all the family around otherwise Christmas will be ruined!" mentality with some people.

This was certainly the case when I was a child/teenager. Christmas was spent with the family. Full stop. To even consider the possibility of doing otherwise was tantamount to treason.

Now that our DCs are grown up, DH and I give them the choice. If they prefer to do something different, that's fine by us. At least this way, we know that if they do come to us for Christmas it's because they want to, not because of some perceived sense of obligation.

Well, it’s been cancelled for us now anyway as one of our DCs teachers tested positive so self isolating until Boxing Day. And then will see grandparents the day after by which time at least we will be zero risk.

There seems to be a "We must have all the family around otherwise Christmas will be ruined!" mentality with some people.

I also find this baffling

Single parent. No family. Primary aged children.

And honestly - it’s an absolutely fabulous time.
Easy, relaxed, lots of laughs. Ice skating, walks, good food, board games, more wood walks, hot chocolate, cuddles and films, presents...

It’s truly special. Just us three. No drama. Just positive

That is lovely PP x