Has Boris got the balls to cancel Xmas for London?

[Gobacktothe90s]

Obviously the answer is no, but the huge increase in cases in London should tell anyone it's not a good idea for Xmas mixing. How high will the rates go before he has to step in?

I think rather than cancel Xmas for the worst hit areas the only thing he would do is cancel Xmas mixing for everyone and do a complete u turn rather than single London out.
If however the North west still had high rates he would have no hesitation In stopping the north west mixing at Xmas but allowed other areas to mix.

I don’t think they care about children.

I think it’s appalling what our children are being put through. They don’t have a voice because they are children. The people who normally protect them, eg teachers, parents, headteachers are being threatened or sued. My dd is so scared.

How did a democracy come to this?

@Unsure33

Why can’t people make their own decisions based on their areas ?

Are you all lemmings ? Just because you can do something does not mean you should ?

If he banned Christmas the rule breakers would not listen anyway so what’s the point .?

Cos a) too many of the population are not as good at assessing risk as they think b) unfortunately this action has consequences if it leads to a surge in cases

Doing a relaxation leads to a false sense of security / belief that 'if it was that serious the government wouldn't have relaxed the rules' mentality.

Personally i think people would have broken the rules anyway which would have led to other problems (fights between neighbours breaking out cos Tom at No45 has his parents and brothers family over), but i don't think the relaxation in the form it is, is particularly helpful either.

Johnson has said to be jolly careful but i think it would have been wise for more government led stressing against things like long distance travel - particularly between low and high areas. The tone isn't right on how its been put forward and hasn't been stressed heavily enough in a repeated manner that perhaps its still not wise for many.

January is going to be interesting.

@Chailatte20 I agree too that schools should go back 11th Jan. That would only work though if children were kept at home and not allowed to play out with their friends...

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow what is your DD so scared of?

Catching it and bringing it home. Quite a lot of her friends are too.

They are GCSE. Torn between wanting to study but scared of infecting parents. It’s affecting them quite badly.

Whereabouts are you Arse?

Big Tier 3 city

@Whattheactual20201

Out of curiosity why just London this whole London rates are sky high isn’t really the case per 100,000 we are no where near where Manchester etc was. There’s about 4 or 5 boroughs our of 36 which are above 200.

There were parts of Manchester that had v low numbers of infections yet were still put under additional restrictions in August and haven't had them lifted. We've effectively been in lockdown since March.

If they don't put London in tier three and consider putting Manchester in tier 2 there will be riots.

Im ruling out riots for the time being. But the restrictions will become increasingly unworkable and unenforceable depending on other events the government has a higher chance of things spiralling out of control in Manchester. I do think things could get interesting. But riots. No. Not unless other incoming events are handled particularly poorly (which isn't beyond the realms of possibility just yet). That depends on what happens to the price and availability of food... And thats one for the new year not this week at least.

@RedToothBrush

Im ruling out riots for the time being. But the restrictions will become increasingly unworkable and unenforceable depending on other events the government has a higher chance of things spiralling out of control in Manchester. I do think things could get interesting. But riots. No. Not unless other incoming events are handled particularly poorly (which isn't beyond the realms of possibility just yet). That depends on what happens to the price and availability of food... And thats one for the new year not this week at least.

Agree. If no deal actually happens things could turn nasty in jan but I don't see riots on the horizon before Xmas

Also agree with your other post re why it would have been better for govt to clarify / tighten the Xmas rules. Due to the relaxation we agreed to an overnight visit from my sister and family over the relaxation period (including Xmas day). No one is vulnerable in the group but it now looks like a bad idea, especially as she will be travelling from area which will stay in tier 2 for sure (rates low and decreasing) while we are in London (not the east but still rates rising). We need to have a rather tricky convo this week which will likely result in much upset as overall my husband is the most cautious of the bunch so it will likely be seen as him stopping something which is allowed. I myself see it that way sometimes even though I know he's probably right. It would be much easier in terms of avoiding a row if there was official goby advice not to travel between areas or no overnight stays

Breadwidow, in some respects i think the Christmas rules were decided too early but i understand people were desperate to make plans at the time.

I think the situation is rapidly changing too.

At the moment our situation is we ruled out seeing family for various reasons due to location, age, risk factors.

However we are still planning to do something with friends who live about 50m away. We figure keeping it local is very much more sensible. But whether we will keep it indoors or outdoors we haven't decided. And won't until the last minute. And we are all on the same page about this. It depends on what the numbers locally are looking like in two weeks i think. (amongst other reasons i wont go into here).

I think the problem is that few people are willing to be flexible. Or have the ability to be. And that adds to the issue.

I'm kinda of glad that we made a point with the family in October that Christmas wasnt wise as thats set the tone and we didn't even really discuss the idea later down the line.

@RedToothBrush

Im ruling out riots for the time being. But the restrictions will become increasingly unworkable and unenforceable depending on other events the government has a higher chance of things spiralling out of control in Manchester. I do think things could get interesting. But riots. No. Not unless other incoming events are handled particularly poorly (which isn't beyond the realms of possibility just yet). That depends on what happens to the price and availability of food... And thats one for the new year not this week at least.

Riots may have been a slight exaggeration on my part BUT people are very unhappy. There are parts of greater Manchester and Oldham which have had consistently low numbers of cases yet have been under additional restrictions pretty much since March.

My local primary school has had minimal cases and closures - since September there have only been 3 closures of bubbles. Our local pubs and restaurants are closed despite spending a fortune to make themselves COVID secure and have zero cases tracked back to them. Plus the numbers across the GM area have reduced significantly over the last few weeks.
If we remain in Tier 3 and London remains in Tier 2 the government haven't a hope in getting the population of Manchester and surrounding areas to comply.

11 Jan should be the standard school return date

100% support this, makes perfect sense given there will be non adherence over the holidays, let’s at least have schools not physically open to kids until the proper quarantine period has passed.

@DateLoaf

11 Jan should be the standard school return date

100% support this, makes perfect sense given there will be non adherence over the holidays, let’s at least have schools not physically open to kids until the proper quarantine period has passed.

That would be asking for the Govt to use common sense & forward thinking - so obviously it’s never going to happen because they can’t do either of those things.

11 Jan should be the standard school return date

And how do working parents manage this?

I am a working parent, the school sends us work home and the kids have to muddle through it. It’s a fucking nightmare tbh but less so than the prospect of overwhelming the NHS with COVID cases after Christmas. Which will kill people.

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow

I don’t think they care about children.

I think it’s appalling what our children are being put through. They don’t have a voice because they are children. The people who normally protect them, eg teachers, parents, headteachers are being threatened or sued. My dd is so scared.

How did a democracy come to this?

Because the people of this country allowed it to come to this by being bullied and coerced into submission.

@Dateloaf

I am a working parent, the school sends us work home and the kids have to muddle through it. It’s a fucking nightmare tbh but less so than the prospect of overwhelming the NHS with COVID cases after Christmas. Which will kill people.

Are your children old enough to 'muddle through'? Mine isn't so it means I can't work or he gets neglected and very little school work done.

My area has had very few cases throughout the whole pandemic - why should our children lose yet more education? A blanket approach isn't appropriate.

I know😭

@SueEllenMishke People are very unhappy where I live. Low cases, well below national average but still likely to go into tier 3. However, they are not baying for other people to go into higher tiers just to make themselves feel better. If they have an issue they direct it at the Government, rather than wanting other people in different areas to suffer.

If you have genuine concern for the numbers, consider demanding that parts of Hertfordshire are put into tier 3. The Southern part that borders London has cases higher than many London boroughs and many parts of Essex. 328 per 100,000 where my PIL live. That’s more than three times as many cases as area of Essex that I live in.

No mine aren’t old enough to do it alone,
If you read my posts I advocated for more localised lockdowns led by scientific advice.
The alternative is still hospitals being overwhelmed though.

"I think it’s disgusting that children are being put in this situation. Schools should have opened safely rather than herding them all back in. And now it has become akin to heresy discussing any sort of rota system"

ArseInTheCoOpWindow How would you make a rota system work? I'm really interested as if the children are not in school then the parents (one or both) will be at home.

So will we send home say half the doctors? Half the people supplying us with electricity? Half the ambulance drivers?

And you're be telling parents that their child is forbidden to go to school at certain times. Might not those parents object to their child's education being neglected?

I'm not convinced that every step the government has taken has been right, but I've yet to see anyone come up with a better method.

And of course it's not just Boris unless he is secretly chief lizard of the New World Order.

@SueEllenMishke

11 Jan should be the standard school return date

And how do working parents manage this?

Well reopening on the 4th of Jan will result in a rise of infections in mid Jan & possibly another school closure end Jan. So working schools will be forced to manage anyway, BTW I'm a working parent.

[quote BunsyGirl]@SueEllenMishke People are very unhappy where I live. Low cases, well below national average but still likely to go into tier 3. However, they are not baying for other people to go into higher tiers just to make themselves feel better. If they have an issue they direct it at the Government, rather than wanting other people in different areas to suffer.

If you have genuine concern for the numbers, consider demanding that parts of Hertfordshire are put into tier 3. The Southern part that borders London has cases higher than many London boroughs and many parts of Essex. 328 per 100,000 where my PIL live. That’s more than three times as many cases as area of Essex that I live in.[/quote]
You've misunderstood me. I'm not 'baying' for other areas to go into T3 I'm pointing out how unfair it will be if London don't move up a tier as a result of the significant increase in cases and large parts of the NW stay in T3 despite a significant decrease.

I'm fed up of hearing how devastating T3 will be for London when nobody seems to give a shit about how devastating being under additional restrictions since August has been for the NW.

When numbers increased in Oldham we were given 24 hours notice before being put under additional restrictions. I live on the outskirts of Oldham in an area that has stayed well below the national average in terms of cases yet we have essentially been in lockdown since March.

I'm talking about equality here - if London escape additional restrictions there is something very unfair going on.