Extended School holidays leaked document (Scotland )

[Peppafrig]

What’s everyone’s feelings on the leaked document suggesting school holidays could be extended till the 11th January ? I think it makes sense to keep them shut for the week. Allowing everyone to not mix again for two weeks after the Christmas bubbles end . Seems like it could save a further even longer lockdown later on in January.

At the very least they should move a couple of the inservice days to during that time so that the children can get as many days in school as possible next year. I am still stewing over the “extra” in service day they insisted on.

Are in-service days not held whenever a trainer is available? I can't see there being a coach available for every school in Scotland during that period. It's not a jolly, work is being done.

In service days are done at council level I believe.

So all schools in area have same dates.

I would say that picture is absolutely what is happening in many schools. Schools are full to bursting with many more students crammed into old, dilapidated buildings that were never meant to hold that many. My own DC are at secondary & whilst the schools are trying their hardest, this is the reality. I'm amazed that people are surprised TBH!!!

I work in a primary. It's not as bad but in my (very high R) area, schools are being absolutely decimated. Particularly secondary. My own school currently has 2 yeargroups self isolating after children were sent in while waiting for test results that turned out to be positive. But that's a whole other thread.

I would welcome a week of online learning in Jan for secondary at least to try and break the chain of transmission around here.

Kids have missed souch education. I hope they don't add extra weeks holiday on. We won't be meeting up with family and friends this Xmas. Instead a quiet Xmas with just us at home. Won't see in-laws won't see dgc. I will be having a huge party after we have the vaccinations though.

@Covidnomore

Private that pic is not an ideal situation.

It doesn't ring true with my experience of high school and surely they are easy ways to get around it?

I did leave high school (relatively large) a number of years ago so obv things have changed. But I can't remember it being that bad.

But I do still believe and will continue to do so that household mixing is the biggest problem.

BUT we always need to make the distinction between primary and secondary.

I think there is more chance of my child catching the virus in a prolonged period of household mixing than there is at primary school.

But if you aren't mixing households, if you are in fact shielding, then the biggest risk is from school. And this is in fact quite hard to live with.

"So you think everyone will strictly isolate, no parents will go to work, no dc will leave their house and the virus will be no more?"

Exactly. Very few will isolate after the 27th. Lots of people will be back to work etc. I'm back to work on the 5th like many others. And if shops etc are open I bet quite a few will be doing shopping in the sales too, including kids who might be wanting to spend any money they get for Christmas.

That picture is absolutely correct. Aswell as staff meetings of 50+ with no masks

@Iamsodonewith2020

That picture is absolutely correct. Aswell as staff meetings of 50+ with no masks

Where is that happening? One school or a local authority area? It's certainly not widespread across the country.

If they are extended schools should be providing remote learning to reduce the impact on pupils. I would expect that is what private schools will do and there if there is enough warning then state schools should also be able to put something in place.

"It's certainly not widespread across the country."

How on earth do you know that?

@CallmeAngelina

"It's certainly not widespread across the country."

How on earth do you know that?

I know as much as those saying it is. That's fair and reasonable, wouldn't you say?

Also I know it isn't happening in our local authority area. So it can't be widespread. It doesn't happen here.

@papaelf, it kind of depends on your role. Does your job entail you going into a large number of schools at break/changeover times?

If not, I'd prefer to take the word of the many teachers on these threads who say that this is exactly what is happening in their schools. I see it in the Primary where I work to a certain extent - at lunch-time, where it is well-nigh impossible to separate the children out to any useful degree. There are no photos, it is not broadcast, and so the parents continue to believe that the school is "Covid-secure" because the kids come out at the end of the day at 5 minute intervals.

it * kind of depends on your role. Does your job entail you going into a large number of schools at break/changeover times?*

If not, I'd prefer to take the word of the many teachers on these threads who say that this is exactly what is happening in their schools

These teachers only see their school and you will take their word for it but you won't take my word for it when I say it's not happening in my school? I can't think of any reason you would take one individuals word over another's with absolute no solid reason for doing so. Why is poster X/Y/Z's account real over mine? I am simply poster W.

As it happens I do have some involvement at local authority level so I do know what's happening in my area enough to be confident that the image posted up thread is not indicative of the nation.

I hope I haven't taken things off on a tangent by sharing that picture again!

I just think it hits home that mixing at Christmas, within the guidelines, is bound to pose a much lower risk than being in school.

I fully understand not all schools are quite so bad as that, but I don't suppose any look like what the average home will look like at Christmas when a few households get together.

That's why I find this extra week off a bit weird. It just feels to me like there will be so much negative impact from it but not much benefit.

Surely trialing blended learning for all of January in secondary schools would be much more sensible, ie all dc in part time.

If you are not a teacher there every day, how can you be so sure it's not happening in "your" school (although you did say "it isn't happening in our local authority area. So it can't be widespread. It doesn't happen here," and that "nobody is crowding like this daily.")
I'm afraid I would doubt the word of your average school student to accurately relate the level of crowd in a corridor. I doubt they "see" it in the same way as adults might unless they're AntiDementor adults.

@CallmeAngelina

I'm not really sure what you are hoping to achieve here.

You believe the posters that day it's happening in their schools but won't believe the poster who says it's not the same at their school, with no good reason. It's not actually unbelievable that both my account and other posters accounts are correct, hence it not being the same across the nation.

However, we have gone way off on an unnecessary tangent and tbh I don't care whether you believe me or not. It makes no difference either way.

I'm afraid I would doubt the word of your average school student to accurately relate the level of crowd in a corridor. I doubt they "see" it in the same way as adults might

Just to clarify I am not a school student and neither am I citing any information given from a school student.

So you think everyone will strictly isolate, no parents will go to work, no dc will leave their house and the virus will be no more?

I would be as deluded to think that as those on here who think that being allowed to mix over Xmas won’t increase transmission in the community which will spill out into schools.

I was just stating why they had decided on that week.

Fwiw I doubt any mitigation’s will be put in place. Schools will just have to suck it up as they currently are doing. Lots more children will be out of school , staff will be sick and parents will be struggling with childcare. That’s my prediction. I hope I’m wrong.

Maybe I’m coloured by my current experience where my y11 dd has isolated 3 times and today in revision classes another group of children got taken out due to a positive case. That’s the 3rd In their year this week. They have a whole younger year group at home as there were 4 cases last week so at least they have managed to avoid that. My primary class has 4 cases as of this end of this week. Hoping that’s it and my test comes back negative.

Not long until January so time will tell.

I think if you don't work in a school - in whatever role - how would you know? Working for schools or with schools - nope you won't see what it's like on the ground. When JS visits a school, do you think he sees the reality?
I would assume the 50+ staff meetings aren't happening though as they are completely against the rules and the union should be involved if anywhere is doing that. Corridors, on the other hand, there are no rules about other than "wear masks"

They had in service days whilst the teachers were at home- presumably on teams or zoom.

"I'm not really sure what you are hoping to achieve here."

It's a Mumsnet thread. People converse and debate. In the course of this conversation, I have taken (mild) issue with your assertion that, because your DC have said their school corridors aren't crowded, that this means it's not happening anywhere else. I've no idea what your job is that means you have first-hand knowledge of corridor conditions (and nor do I care), but there are so many actual teachers across MN relating their own experiences that I believe there must be some truth to it, and therefore an issue.

I think if you don't work in a school - in whatever role - how would you know? Working for schools or with schools - nope you won't see what it's like on the ground.

I didn't actually say I didn't. I know exactly what it's like 'on the ground'- thanks for jumping in and adding to the doubt simply because I dared to suggest the picture isn't an accurate representation of the schools across the country.

It's a Mumsnet thread. People converse and debate. In the course of this conversation, I have taken (mild) issue with your assertion that, because your DC have said their school corridors aren't crowded, that this means it's not happening anywhere else.

I don't have children in high school. I never said this. Not once did I say my children told me the corridors were not crowded. Not a single time. In fact I was quite clear to star I did not get that information from children.

I would be as deluded to think that as those on here who think that being allowed to mix over Xmas won’t increase transmission in the community which will spill out into schools

I am not saying mixing at Christmas won't increase overall rates of transmission, I just don't think it will make cases in school higher than they are now.

I do think we will see more cases in older people though when they freely mix with dc which is very worrying. So I fully expect to see further pressure on hospitals in January.

I totally agree with you there won't be further mitigations, I guess maybe the gov think having this extra week will look like they are doing something? When really it will change nothing imo!

Whatever.
The point remains, regardless of whether you have children in secondary school.