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Christmas bubble! What a load of shit

249 replies

doodledo92 · 24/11/2020 22:31

Christmas bubble.... really! Sorry but what a load of bollocks all this shit is now!!

OP posts:
VanGoghsDog · 25/11/2020 10:19

Not all the rules have been released, they've not given the tier information yet. So questions about what you can do other than the bubble still can't be answered.

If no tier one then we're barely coming out of lockdown at all.

Confusion67 · 25/11/2020 10:22

There are 4 households in my family group, so we will not be sticking to 3 households.

Considering each household is only 2 people, who are generally distancing and working from home, I don’t see how there is a higher risk than the legal 3 households with children at school etc meeting up. It’s all getting a bit ridiculous now.

RichTeaCheddars · 25/11/2020 10:23

@badger2005
It's an exclusive bubble of 3 households. As an example....You can see your parents and brother's family under the xmas bubble BUT none of you can see anyone else under the xmas bubble rule.
However, as per the first section in government guidelines: "you can continue to meet people who are not in your Christmas bubble outside your home according to the rules in the tier where you are staying". So your bro can see his PIL outside if it is within the teir rules.

The guideance is here:
www.gov.uk/government/publications/making-a-christmas-bubble-with-friends-and-family/making-a-christmas-bubble-with-friends-and-family

To the people saying but that's guidance not law....well the government released it on their own website not dripped through media so I assume this is what they are going to stick to (or close enough without being pedantic) to make law if they do indeed make it law. They haven't always made guidance law.

Bubbinsmakesthree · 25/11/2020 10:23

Yes I strongly suspect no tier 1, and that the Christmas bubble stuff was released prior to the Tier rules as a bit of a sweetener as Tier 2+ basically kills off the vast majority of pre-Xmas socialising.

RichTeaCheddars · 25/11/2020 10:25

@Confusion67
The more households the more the risk despite the fact there may be less people.
Also, the more people there are the higher the risk too. So 3 large households will be more risky than 3 small ones but 4 small households still have an extra set of household risk associated with them.

RedskyAtnight · 25/11/2020 10:27

@Confusion67

There are 4 households in my family group, so we will not be sticking to 3 households.

Considering each household is only 2 people, who are generally distancing and working from home, I don’t see how there is a higher risk than the legal 3 households with children at school etc meeting up. It’s all getting a bit ridiculous now.

It sounds like you are all couples? So will the other half of each couple not wish to see their own families - making this a significantly larger number than just 4 families mixing?
LethargicLumpOfLockdownLard · 25/11/2020 10:29

I've invited in laws (DSIL and family plus DFIL and DBIL who live together) for Christmas day as it's our first Christmas since MIL died. But I have said I understand that means no one can meet anyone else and I don't want to make that decision for them (DSIL's husband has family he may want to see) so have left it open to discussion.
My side of the family (Mum died last year) will likely do whatever they like so I'll see my sisters the week before to exchange gifts and then lock us down in our bubble for Christmas.

Confusion67 · 25/11/2020 10:31

Yes, 4 couples. For a number of reasons (bereavements, and fallouts in various families) none of the partners go anywhere else for Christmas, and the 8 of us always have Christmas together at my parents house.

BiddyPop · 25/11/2020 10:41

I was thinking about this - because it looks like we will be allowed to have similar here.

DSiblingA already bubbles with DPs.

DSiblingB and OH will definitely also be there.
DSiblingC, OH and DC want to be there if at all possible.

So even allowing for DSibA already being "a household" with DPs, that still means I cannot visit with my DH and DC. (And nor can DSiblings E or F, and their respective families - but they have overseas travel involved).

At present, we are not allowed to travel more than 5km, and it will reduce to not outside your county from next week (we hope). Sibs A and B are in the same county as DPs so have both seen a lot of DPs throughout the year, whereas SibC and I are in (2) different counties and have not seen each other or Sibs/DPs very much at all (I've seen DPs twice this year other than NY gathering, SibC possibly 4 times, and SibC and I have also met twice).

THen you look at DH's family.
DSiblingA, OH and DCs live next door to DMIL, but as there is another adult in her household (her own DSibling in granny-annex), they may not be considered a single "household" (if you were strict - it would already be 3 households there).

DSibling B, OH and DCs are also in a different county (also different to ours). So we have the same "have barely seen each other and DMIL" issues on that side.

So if I wanted to see my family, there would be at least 4 and strictly 5 households involved.

And DH would also be looking at 4 possibly 5 households.

And this is further complicated for DH and I by the fact that DPs and DMIL only live 20 minutes away from each other, and 2.5 hours from us - so if we travel to see 1 side, we MUST also see the other.

And while both DPs and DMIL (and DH's DSibA) all have large gardens (my 2 DSibs locally have very small ones), none of them are suitable for an outdoors gathering for various reasons (including a lot of long wet grass in both, and no shelter in either).

I know the locals will sort themselves out.

But those travelling have some hard decisions to make very soon - and it is actually upsetting me today in a way I didn't expect because I know they won't accept any of our decisions and I miss them but I am vulnerable (asthma) as are all the DPs/DMIL (all into 70s and all have underlying issues), so we have been doing the right thing all year (while a number of various DSibs have not been - some have been absolutely doing it all right - but some have held big family gatherings for communion celebrations even though the ceremonies themselves were cancelled, have had overnight visitors when no one allowed in to another house even for a coffee, have been supposedly self-isolating due to potential exposure in workplace but out shopping and getting coffee in restaurants before results of tests were known....) so it feels all sorts of wrong to say we can't go because there are too many already, but we miss them all...and the locals will absolutely NOT give way to the travelling family members - they will expect to be part of everything too.

Sorry, this is somewhat ranty, but I am feeling blue this morning. And trying to think of reasons why we shouldn't be travelling because the virus does not take a holiday either, when I really want to go see them all. How much of a risk am I willing to take - for myself, and those around me? And how much do I need to consider the actions of others, and where their personal limits will lie (which based on experience to date this year, is often way beyond what is actually allowed at any one time!)?

Bibidy · 25/11/2020 10:53

@Confusion67

There are 4 households in my family group, so we will not be sticking to 3 households.

Considering each household is only 2 people, who are generally distancing and working from home, I don’t see how there is a higher risk than the legal 3 households with children at school etc meeting up. It’s all getting a bit ridiculous now.

I agree. Some common sense does need to be applied, particularly as at the moment kids are some of the only people having very close contact with others.
sandragreen · 25/11/2020 10:59

Unfortunately I think the chances that most people will firstly understand and then secondly follow these rules are very slim.

I think @Bubbinsmakesthree has it in a nutshell.

The cases in January will be huge and so many people will die.

ravenmum · 25/11/2020 10:59

This is the first year I'm pretty pleased that my parents and sublings live in another country. Wouldn't have wanted a giant bubble of festive Covid as a Christmas present, and won't be under any pressure to do so.

Calmandmeasured1 · 25/11/2020 11:03

@VanGoghsDog

Not all the rules have been released, they've not given the tier information yet. So questions about what you can do other than the bubble still can't be answered.

The tier information was officially published by the Govt on 23rd November:
www.gov.uk/guidance/local-restriction-tiers-what-you-need-to-know

The only thing we do not know is which areas will be in which tiers. The Govt have always said that would be announced tomorrow and it will be. The tiers information applies to Thursday 3rd December to Wednesday 23rd December and Monday 28th December onwards. However, the numbers of households that can meet up will be suspended for the period Wednesday 23rd to Sunday 27th December.

It doesn't matter if, in your tier, you could meet up with 6 people from 6 different households. For 23rd to 27th December, the UK is operating under the same rules.

NothingButADreamer · 25/11/2020 11:04

Twatmas followed by Brexshit...

What does Boris Johnson have for his 3rd act to end 2020 and start 2012 - guessing a huge CV outbreak followed by a big lockdown. That is the optimistic guess, God knows What BJ and Michael Gove and Dominic Cummings working from home but still pulling the strings have in store for us next....

Tune in for the next installment!

MereDintofPandiculation · 25/11/2020 11:06

It's crap. It doesn't give me a thing we couldn't do under even the first lockdown rules, but we'll all be longer in restrictions as a result.

DF is in a nursing home and won't be let out, DS is temporarily living with in-laws, and there isn't room in their bubble for us.

Calmandmeasured1 · 25/11/2020 11:12

@NothingButADreamer

What does Boris Johnson have for his 3rd act to end 2020 and start 2012 - guessing a huge CV outbreak followed by a big lockdown. That is the optimistic guess, God knows What BJ and Michael Gove and Dominic Cummings working from home but still pulling the strings have in store for us next....
The plan has been agreed between the UK's PM and heads of the devolved Govts, Nicola Sturgeon, Mark Drakeford and Arlene Foster.

Calmandmeasured1 · 25/11/2020 11:19

@MereDintofPandiculation

It's crap. It doesn't give me a thing we couldn't do under even the first lockdown rules, but we'll all be longer in restrictions as a result.

DF is in a nursing home and won't be let out, DS is temporarily living with in-laws, and there isn't room in their bubble for us.
Might you be able to go and see your DF in his nursing home?
www.gov.uk/government/news/pilot-for-family-members-to-get-regular-testing-for-safer-care-home-visits

NothingButADreamer · 25/11/2020 11:22

@Calmandmeasured1 I guess I am unimpressed with all of them then.
At least Nicola Sturgeon wasn't a Brexiteer, but I am rather disappointed in her about this. But it isn't them personally anyway, since we are being pernickety - there will be teams of policymakers, advisors, backbench MPs, industry lobbyists, party donors, etc. who would all have contributed to the decision.

RichTeaCheddars · 25/11/2020 11:26

@Calmandmeasured1
"The tiers information applies to Thursday 3rd December to Wednesday 23rd December and Monday 28th December onwards. However, the numbers of households that can meet up will be suspended for the period Wednesday 23rd to Sunday 27th December."

This is not correct. Xmas bubbles apply 23rd to 27th December but at all times tier rules apply. Even when in an xmas bubble you can meet people in line with your teir rules.

"you can continue to meet people who are not in your Christmas bubble outside your home according to the rules in the tier where you are staying"
Section one here:www.gov.uk/government/publications/making-a-christmas-bubble-with-friends-and-family/making-a-christmas-bubble-with-friends-and-family

Xenia · 25/11/2020 11:39

Yes, I think during the Christmas period you still have the tier rules too. It is all extremely complicated but I think the gist is that single people who live alone like my son probably don't get to eat a family Christmas meal. My daughter also lives alone too. I suppose we just pick and choose which child gets the meal. May be they will be fighting to be the one who doesn't come amongst the 5 children and grandchildren! We also are 3 lawyers plus 2 law students so not keen to break any covid 19 legislation whereas some other people do break the rules. 5 of us don't want to put careers at risk because we ate a meal ( we are 4 households as my student sons count as mine - one is due back in December from university) even though it would have been the first time we could have met since Christmas 2019.
As they are over 18 the students cannot even see their father on Christmas day and his wife 5 minutes from here because custody etc visits are only an exception if you are under not over 18!

VanGoghsDog · 25/11/2020 11:41

single people who live alone like my son probably don't get to eat a family Christmas meal. My daughter also lives alone too.

Can't they get together for the day then?

RichTeaCheddars · 25/11/2020 11:42

@xenia A household that has just one adult in can be in a support bubble with another household to form one joint household. So could your daughter thst lives alone be in a support bubble with you?

Bubbinsmakesthree · 25/11/2020 11:58

I’ll be honest and say that if I had three adult DC who would otherwise be alone I would break the rules and create a 4 household bubble rather than see no-one or pick favourites.

But I wouldn’t start mixing up a more than 3 larger households.

ineedaholidaynow · 25/11/2020 12:02

If there were 3 adult children, they could meet up together so they wouldn't be alone, so no rules broken and no problems with favourites.

RichTeaCheddars · 25/11/2020 12:03

If you have 3 adult children who would otherwise be alone that means they live alone?

So you could form a support bubble with one and be classed as one household with them. Then you see your other 2 as well and that only makes 3 households as per the government xmas bubble rules

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