Anyone else find this slightly dystopian now ?

[Whitechocolatemarshmallow]

We may be 'allowed' to see families etc. Over Christmas but should be expected to 'pay' for this with subsequent lockdowns, and hugging will be banned.

Now, there's talk of a 'freedom pass' for people who test negative twice a week to allow them to live a more normal life, which they will be able to present should they be stopped and questioned.

What's coming next, having to show proof of vaccination status ?
I'm no conspiracy theorist and i'm fully aware that Covid is real.

Why are we willing to give up our old lives like this ?

That freaky film with Chris Whitty: "This is a message from the Government". It did feel a bit like they all watched Years & Years and thought, aha, this is how it is done!

It's been so badly mismanaged that I can't help but feel
If there had been clearer rules 6 months ago and everyone followed them then it wouldn't be the awful dystopia that the UK apparently feels like now.

I'm saying that as someone who lives somewhere where we've been masked and distanced since March and everything is relatively ok now.

It upsets me so much that I can't see my family in the UK and seeing my elderly parents cry on FaceTime because it's all going to hell.

I don't think there's anything sinister, I just think it's incompetence and ignoring all past experience of pandemics and tried and tested epidemiology.

The 2nd wave has now stabilised, and R is around 1 and reducing - this is the definition of the HIT. People are still dying of Covid, but there was never any way round this. Excess deaths are far lower than the 1st wave. Deaths will continue to fall.

In the data, you can only see the effects of two factors:

1. The first lockdown. This did have an effect and prematurely cut off the first wave. This of course guarantees a second wave.

1. Seasonality.

Everything else: masks, tiers, 2nd lockdown etc you cannot see in the data. All the nonsense on here about groups of 7, or banning Christmas are just ridiculous. They don't achieve anything.

I'm reeling from the death of a good friend from this fucking virus. I'd happily get tired of following rules if it meant it'd bring them back. Sadly they're gone forever.

This. I still don't understand why so many people are worried about 'missing' Christmas. I understand from the point of view of very elderly people who may not see another one. Kids will forget and most of us will have more Christmas's to look forward to. Is it really worth killing more people over this?

Yes I hope they bring in proof of vaccination status. You can then opt out of a vaccine, but there will be consequences as in things you might then not be able to do like visiting care homes, travelling abroad on holidays etc

Of course!
It's been dystopian since the panicked drafting of poor and ill-thought out legislation that has an effect on freedoms that I don't think anyone thought we would see.
And of course it dovetails with the loss of the bulwark of the EU and the government's attempted assaults on judicial review.
Still, 'if it saves just one life', and other SM-led nonsensical phrases, we're told that the future implications matter not a jot.

By the way, all the people who are denying the risk of easing the rules for Christmas, were the same people denying there would be a second wave.

Personally, I'd rather give up some freedom temporarily if it will create a safer place for all of us.

The government aren't removing freedoms because they want to. They are trying to stop the spread of an awful virus. I can't stand Boris and co but I am happy to follow rules that protect the health of the vulnerable.

Jourdain11
Perfectly put!

Yes it does feel dystopian but the hope of a vaccine, real hope, makes it feel now like there is a time limit.

I'm happt to be tested or vaccinated and show evidence of that in order to live nornally. If you think that's dystopian, you're an idiot who doesn't realise there's no better option.

Can't believe how many people can't see the big picture here - especially when the end is now in sight! Yes, it sucks. And if these rules and restrictions are still in place this time next year, then we'd have reason to be concerned about a dystopian society. But right now, it's simply a case of doing what we have to do in the short term to get through this.

Yes, I agree. The problem is the lack of a clear message. People can no longer plan their lives because there is no real indication of how long this coercive, intrusive level of government control is going to last. Meanwhile, small businesses fold and larger ones lay people off. Neighbours inform on neighbours. People retreat into their homes and immediate families with either an "I'm all right" or a survival mentality. This level of introspection and lack of human contact and interaction is not normal. Yet we are expected to endure it tamely without knowing when we will get our freedoms back. Yes, Covid is a dreadful death and we should be trying to reduce transmission as much as we can. But we also need to understand that lockdown measures are undermining the functioning of society and that is dangerous too.

The future where most people will be denied car ownership is also part of the bigger plan.

More than slightly dystopian.
I loathe libertarians.
And yet I find myself on their side in this situation.
So I must be wrong. Because the Libertarians are selfish nutjobs.
I try & try but still can't convince myself I'm wrong even knowing I'm on side of anti-Lockdown protestors among whom there are selfish zealots.

I End up being quiet, just trying to endure.

Are we meant to whoop with joy that we can sit around a dinner table on 25th and tuck into that food while smiling and laughing with our "chosen" few festive companions?
Then a few days later we are back in our prisons? Until when? weeks or months ahead and we may feel grateful we can once again be in the same room as a relative?
I have never totally dismissed the conspiracy theories as I can see reason in some of them. Dystopia seems to be creeping upon us and it scares me.

It's ridiculous. So many people aren't thinking for themselves. I have relatives who will bolt out of the door to shops, cafes, friends homes, restaurants, the second it's "allowed" and "safe". Because the virus knows better than to bother someone who is following the official rules!

@Funkypolar interested to hear more about this? Would like to know how this would work for people in rural areas and people who need their car for their job? Me being a community nurse in that rural community?

@Funkypolar

The future where most people will be denied car ownership is also part of the bigger plan.

@Funkypolar

Too true!

@PowerslidePanda

Can't believe how many people can't see the big picture here - especially when the end is now in sight! Yes, it sucks. And if these rules and restrictions are still in place this time next year, then we'd have reason to be concerned about a dystopian society. But right now, it's simply a case of doing what we have to do in the short term to get through this.

Don't you think the very idea of 'freedom passes' etc is quite odd and redundant if the end really is in sight?

I also think we need to be realistic about how much more time some of our elderly relatives have. My DF, for instance, is not in the best of health. Many of us do not have years and years ahead so we just should "suck up" being separated from family for what has now been 8 months. Life is precious...fundamentally, it is for living and making the most of because we don't know what the future will bring. What if an elderly person misses their family Christmas and then dies from Covid contracted from a carer?

Judging from the huge queue forming with their sleeves rolled up on the NHS STAFF vaccine thread I think we’ll see soon enough how effective this vaccine really is.

Also, anyone else read about President Xi of China advocating for a global QR code to enable travel etc. The only way to do anything in the future will be with the mark of the jab.

@Orangeblossom7777

What's coming next, having to show proof of vaccination status ?

Yes, it seems so. It is being reported today that this is needed to give individuals more freedom next year.

Yes this is the thing that annoys me. If you are healthy and under 50 you don't need vaccinating - those who are older and vulnerable (or work with those groups) need it. This isn't measles or polio and a vaccination should not more or less be compulsory - after all, you don't have to prove you're immune to measles to carry on with life, and measles is generally far more serious.

I'm meh over the rest. I don't care about wearing masks, I don't queue for shops, if they're busy I try again later or go to a different one or buy online. I don't care about whether I can go to a pub, and I only have a small family and my mum has had covid anyway so I am seeing her at Christmas whatever the government says I can or cannot do.

But I do think some of the restrictions make no sense and as time goes on, they have to make more sense, not less, for people to comply. For example, being able to walk across a golf course but not play golf.

@Thewiseoneincognito I have a feeling it will end up being a compliance thing in the nhs if you don’t have the vaccine it will be disciplined somehow

The Fail tells me this morning that aroud 40 people under the age of 40 have died from Covid and of the rest, most had underlying health issues.

My brain is mashed with it all.