Secondary schools are totally stuffed, WELL-RESPECTED SCIENTISTS ADMIT

[noblegiraffe]

I don't normally get asked for an encore, more usually 'urgh, not another bloody thread', but per a request we have a follow-up to the resoundingly popular:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/coronavirus/4078722-Secondary-schools-are-fucked-BOFFINS-ADMIT

Feedback has been received and acted upon re the title so hopefully that will temper the urge to complain.

Quick round-up of where we were at:

1. the infection rate is now highest in secondary school pupils in Y7-11, higher than uni students and sixth formers. They're not catching it at the pub...

2. The government/ONS put out misleading figures to suggest that teachers weren't at higher risk than NHS frontline workers, where actually looking at the data, they may well be. They fudged this by calling the largest group of teachers, who are at higher risk than frontline NHS staff 'teachers of an unknown type' and pretended they were irrelevant.

3. The DfE have changed the format of their attendance statistics report to remove the reference to how many hundreds of thousands of kids are currently isolating due to exposure to covid at school.

4. Boffins are cool

New info: The Guardian reports that teachers are being instructed to ignore app notifications to self-isolate by the school helpline and this might be a bad thing. They can't help themselves though, and have a lovely photo of a socially distanced classroom of lies at the top of the story.

www.theguardian.com/education/2020/nov/16/union-says-teachers-in-england-being-told-to-pause-covid-app-in-school

www.tes.com/news/exclusive-coronavirus-schools-roulette-wheel-covid-hotspot-teachers

This is just awful - such a dreadful read - well done TES for reporting on this (come on national media). Senior management trying to hide who's off with covid, teachers finding out that colleagues have had severe cases while management says they've 'been off too long', supply teachers walking out and being offered ever higher rates of pay when they refuse to work.

Public Health Director giving political non answers - shame on you. All those teachers off sick or self-isolating - those are real people, with real lives and real loved ones. Putting their lives and health at risk so they can do a 'fantastic job' of keeping the schools open. It's so appalling.

All this rubbish about being in school improving children's mental health and wellbeing - well obviously not in those schools where they've got 5 supply teachers out of 6 and the behaviour has taken a nosedive.

Is it REALLY best for pupils to see their teachers treated so shoddily? They're not stupid, children. They can see what's going on.

Behaviour has taken a real nosedive in the last few weeks.

Students' mental health is also terrible because they are not stupid. They know it's not safe in school.

They may not be allowed to, but dozens of schools ARE now on rotas. If the staff aren't there, they aren't there. It's not safe to open to everyone if you are ++++ staff down.

Yes, but the suggestion was that it was up to a school to decide, as in a free choice, not simply schools limping on till they have no choice.

@IloveJKRowling

www.tes.com/news/exclusive-coronavirus-schools-roulette-wheel-covid-hotspot-teachers

This is just awful - such a dreadful read - well done TES for reporting on this (come on national media). Senior management trying to hide who's off with covid, teachers finding out that colleagues have had severe cases while management says they've 'been off too long', supply teachers walking out and being offered ever higher rates of pay when they refuse to work.

Public Health Director giving political non answers - shame on you. All those teachers off sick or self-isolating - those are real people, with real lives and real loved ones. Putting their lives and health at risk so they can do a 'fantastic job' of keeping the schools open. It's so appalling.

All this rubbish about being in school improving children's mental health and wellbeing - well obviously not in those schools where they've got 5 supply teachers out of 6 and the behaviour has taken a nosedive.

Is it REALLY best for pupils to see their teachers treated so shoddily? They're not stupid, children. They can see what's going on.

Hear hear!!!

It actually made me feel sick reading that article.

I hope all the teachers who are feeing scared in Hull (and anywhere else) get signed off with stress from the GP.

They really shouldn't be having to do this, and most GPs I am sure would be supportive.

Clearly the benefits of being in school for children in these very high risk areas are now being outweighed by the amount of supply and the deteriorating behaviour. So teachers going in despite the clear risks is no longer helping pupils either.

I wonder how long it will be until they can't get supply teachers either.

I'm isolating and have taught all my lessons online via Teams this week. I've absolutely loved it, although I was nervous at first. I teach re-sits in a college. I did a poll of students after each lesson and almost 90% preferred online (the ones that didn't said it was because they were using their phones so harder to see screens)

They said it was safe, they could inbox me questions, pics of their methods, I sent pics and links to further work to those acing the work etc... and they were warm! My classrooms are fucking freezing as I insist on having the windows open!

It's tantamount to government manslaughter if a teacher dies. The lack of protection is terrible.

It is very telling that my daughter who is teaching in a mask has so far avoided having to self isolate.

God, yeah.

Our year groups who are at home are so happy to be warm!

get signed off with stress from the GP.
Completely irresponsible suggestion. And what gets teachers a bad name generally. If the job is too stressful you need to get another one, not simply sit at home being paid while others do the work.

I don't think it's irresponsible - did you bother to read the article and what teachers are going through? Where else would they be expected to face a risk far higher than anyone else at work?

Those teachers in the article sounded very, very stressed. I don't think you risk your health until you get sick and then leave. Leave first.

Actually, they shouldn't get signed off with stress, they should stay off because it's unsafe and put the onus on senior management and the government to prove it is safe (which they can't).

It is illegal to expect employees to go into an unsafe workplace.

We've got teachers off for more than 3 weeks due to the severity of their symptoms and SLT are still pretending it's just a cold. I think it's an attempt to keep everyone calm as they know once we realise people are really poorly they'll have a mass revolt on their hands. I feel for the head. It's an impossible job trying to keep everyone safe, protect people's mental health and keep up with the governments demands to keep schools open.

It's awful as until someone does end up in hospital or losing a loved one (who was otherwise fit and well) we are going to continue burying our heads in the sand and hoping it will go away.

I've started with a cold and sore throat today but as they're not strictly Covid symptoms I'm expected to go to work. Staff members who have tested positive have all spent at least a day or two in school not feeling well (non-Covid symptoms) before they started with a cough or a temperature. We're so short staffed though no one feels able to let colleagues down when it could just be a cold. Rapid testing in such cases is what's needed.

I feel for the head.

I don’t think I do. They consider themselves “leaders” - in that case, they need to show a bit of leadership and start pushing back instead of pushing down.

They consider themselves “leaders” - in that case, they need to show a bit of leadership and start pushing back instead of pushing down.

Hear hear.

If the job is too stressful you need to get another one, not simply sit at home being paid while others do the work.

If someone is made ill by the conditions of their employment they have every right to paid time off to recover.

@Susanwouldntlikeit

get signed off with stress from the GP. Completely irresponsible suggestion. And what gets teachers a bad name generally. If the job is too stressful you need to get another one, not simply sit at home being paid while others do the work.

You are about 80 years out of date with this. There are workplace regulations these days that apply to any mills or pits that are left, you know.

@HipTightOnions

I feel for the head.

I don’t think I do. They consider themselves “leaders” - in that case, they need to show a bit of leadership and start pushing back instead of pushing down.

They need to lead. That doesn't mean acting as agents of the government but remembering that first and foremost they are teachers. They need to act to keep those safe that they are responsible FOR not to those they answer to.

FrazzledChip hope its just a cold.

If the job is too stressful you need to get another one, not simply sit at home being paid while others do the work.

A vomit of a comment considering the circumstances those teachers in Hull are suffering.

People with stress caused by their work place have every right to paid sick leave and time to recover their health.

Luckily most of us are working when we probably should be signed off because the conditions we are working in are such that we are very much at risk of stress related illness on top of being at risk through unmitigated risk of catching a pandemic disease that is killing 500 people a day.

If people do become ill from the stress levels they will need time off. These are humans not robots and we need them to stay in education for the long haul rather than burning out and leaving in droves anymore than they already are.

OverTheRainbowLiesOz, I was wondering what jobs! sure, the statistics prove there are safer professions and working environments, but there are few vacancies going spare.

Plus, if those before us hadn't campaigned for safer conditions, 2 rest days, a 40hr week, for better pay, for holiday entitlement and pay, sick pay, maternity rights, and equal pay for women we would all be quing up on the docks begging for a days work and kids would still be down the pits. Yeah, if those stressed out kids can't hack school with all that covid they should just go somewhere else

I feel for the head.

I don’t think I do. They consider themselves “leaders” - in that case, they need to show a bit of leadership and start pushing back instead of pushing down.

This, many times over.
Our "leader" is currently rearranging the deck chairs on her school.
It's called "The Titanic Academy"
And we hit the iceberg a week or so ago. But still she blames us for not morphing our classes into magical tardis type affairs, where we can sit students 2 metres apart.
My TA told a student off for not wearing his mask in the corridor today. Student spat at TA. I reported it. Nothing done.

A year 7 is off awaiting a test, with both parents testing positive. Older year 11 sibling in school still - SLT aware. Nothing done.
Teacher living with a positive case, SLT aware and pressured said teacher into coming into work.
No support, apart from other staff.
Shocking.

@Susanwouldntlikeit

get signed off with stress from the GP. Completely irresponsible suggestion. And what gets teachers a bad name generally. If the job is too stressful you need to get another one, not simply sit at home being paid while others do the work.

Unbelievable! We're not back in WW1 you know. Teachers never signed up to this shit and should be better protected. And teachers won't be paid to sit at home doing nothing. They'll still be teaching and probably going in to the school building but without the overcrowded classrooms.

@SophieB100 that's dreadful. Your Head sounds awful.

@monkeytennis97
She is.
She's weak.
Thankfully, colleagues are amazing.