To ignore track and trace?

[Coldandcross]

I was at a staff meeting last week. We are all wfh - this is only the second time since March we have met in person, for a necessary reason. All the precautions were carried out - we met in a massive room, with masks on, chairs spaced 2m apart, plenty of sanitising etc. 2 days later someone at the meeting gets symptoms. They spoke to T&T and told them about staff meeting (along with other movements the week leading up to their symptoms), and were told that because all safety precautions were taken, no one at meeting has to isolate.
Now however everyone is getting T&T texts telling them to isolate for 14 days, presumably because the phone’s proximity Bluetooth thing has kicked in.
So, who do we follow? What the T&T team said to the infected person over the phone, or what our texts are saying through the app?

If it was from the meeting last week then you wouldn't be getting told to isolate for 14 days as the isolation period would count from the date of contact so would be fewer days left

YABU.

Yes, that’s right, sorry that was misleading. It definitely says the date of meeting as being the day in contact with infectious person, so 14 days from that date (so 11 remaining)

Of course YABU

If listen to the human.

*I’d listen to the human that should say.

T&T told a relative of mine the criteria is contacts 24 hours prior to symptoms or positive test (if no symptoms), so sounds like you are out of their time interval unless rules recently changed.

YABU

It's illegal not to isolate if you've been told to.
Whether it's really necessary from a medical point of view is another matter entirely.

YANBU
Presumably you weren’t in close contact with the person of following all those rules!
I’d follow what the person said and not isolate, personally.

It's not illegal not to isolate if the app tells you to I believe for exactly this reason (you might have been the other side of a perspex screen but the app doesn't know). It's reasonable to do as the human track and trace said.

Listen to the track and trace advisor, and follow the government guidelines which are the only legally binding bit... Less than 2m for more than 15 minutes (from what I understand), which you weren't.

@ethelfleda exactly, I was never less than 2m from them and we were both masked! And as other pp have said, I’d rather follow what a human said rather than a computer. It just seems strange that they’ve not cross-referenced what they said in the phone vs sending out the text alerts, presumably they can see that data.

I'd isolate just because so much about covid is so hit and miss you are better to be safe. Plus our local factory had 30 cases, we know 2 of the people who have followed regulations to the nth and they said it flew through the place even though there were only 4 on the factory floor at the time, all wearing masks, sanitizing and disinfecting regularly, they said everyone was in shock when they started displaying symptoms or testing positive

Sorry at a time not the time

I personally dont trust the app at all. I've had notification to isolate when I've been nowhere! The only thing I could think of was our neighbours had tested positive 🙄. The dates for isolation aren't reliable and my friend who tested positive had to notify people that she knew she had been in contact with for the necessary time and the app never told them to isolate, she did and one of them did test positive the following week.

However, your situation is you have been in contact with someone for more that 15 minutes (probably an hour) indoors, who has tested positive. The rules say you therefore have to isolate. Regardless of the safety measures you were in contact for s while. What you do is your choice.

How long was the meeting for? Were there any windows open?

If you are working from home and we are in lockdown is it a real hardship to isolate?

I would isolate as my biggest fear is giving it to someone else. Also the message to you personally was to isolate rather than the advice given to your colleague.

Trust the human.

The apps a pile of crap

I had a very similar situation last week and was told by Public Health that the app is not legally enforceable so to go with what test and trace had said. There are so many variables that the app is unable to recognise that I was advised that it is best to turn it off in situations where additional covid security measures are in place.

Normal face masks dont make you not have to isolate. And if the Bluetooth has said you were close enough to each other for long enough then you should isolate. It doesn't have to be 15 minutes all at once, it is cumulative

Thanks all, I think I’ll trust what the human track and trace team said, which is that because of measures in place, we don’t need to isolate. Clearly the app doesn’t recognise all the measures that were taken (yes, windows open too).
In our area of the UK we are not in full lockdown, and it does have big implications for some in terms of childcare etc.

Go with what the human said.

We all know that the T&T is SERIOUSLY flawed.

I’m not saying it isn’t doing any good stuff, which we know that it is partly working.

But it does not work to the extent of how people think it should. There are many many cases of people being the other side of windows / walls and it being picked up on Bluetooth.

It’s not so sophisticated it can tell when you’ve actually been in the room as opposed to just in the vicinity. Which can be sitting in a car next to another car at a traffic light (obvs not for 15 mins but you get my drift re the Bluetooth).

You have to follow the guidance and if you haven’t been within 2 metres for over 15 minutes then there’s your answer.

It’s not illegal to apply critical thinking. I personally wouldn’t be isolating in this circumstance and it’s good that a human confirmed it wasn’t required because the T&T is nowhere near 100% effective. It could never ever hope to be. Formulas and spreadsheets don’t take into account context

Oops just seen your update.
I think that's a sensible decision.