Schools will shut, and who will be complaining then?

[StartingGrid]

The sheer amount of people stating "my kids still have to go to school, so why should I do x,y,z..." are so short-sighted... when this fake lockdown doesn't work because of the above, watch an early Xmas closure be rolled out.
A lot of them will be stuffed for childcare but aren't thinking of the consequences of their current actions. I'd eat my hat if the government hadn't initiated this knowing they could blame non-compliance for needing the additional measures down the line but didn't want to look like the bad guys denying education initially. What's the saying about "jam today"?

Would be bonkers to close schools in areas of low incidence.

Then would be totally unfair to close schools in some areas and not others.

Government will only consider blanket approach to schools. They won’t close them, for above reasons.

@BaronessEllaSaturday

I'm in the NorthWest in an area that had local restrictions from August, our rates have plummeted despite schools still being open. I am hopeful that we are over the worst of it here and that nationwide the restrictions now in place will help the rates without the schools having to close. My child would be devastated if schools closed again, she's finding it hard enough that her extra curricular activities have gone back to being via zoom, she needs that social contact with her peers.

I'm also in the Northwest in an area under local restrictions since July and our rates are going up and up. Covid is rampant in the schools and colleges here.

@Qasd I think comparing schools closing temporarily and moving to online teaching to having no education in place is a bit over dramatic.
I hope this lockdown works and all schools can stay open but there is a tiered approach planned for the case where some level of school closure is needed in certain areas. It isn’t a case of all schools open or all schools closed.

Qasd Anyway I honestly believe “following what Europe does” seems out main strategy and therefore no nothing I do will impact on the decision...president Macron however has more power over my kids education than I think even he would realise!!

Ironic isn't it!

I agree, OP. I am so frustrated by the people who really need schools to stay open but who are carrying as normal and ignoring the current lockdown rules. I don't understand why they can't see the connection between socialising with everyone and anyone, and schools closing for outbreaks.

The headteacher at my DD's school sent an email out to all parents on Friday saying that a number of pupils had mentioned they were having sleepovers that weekend at friend's house and that this wasn't permitted under the current lockdown rules. He says he's spoken to staff about their conduct out of school and making sure they stick within the rules, and he expects parents to also adhere to the rules. Some may think he's over stepped the mark (although I've not heard anyone complain about this email yet) but I think fair play to him. He wants the school up and running at full capacity so that means everyone needs to do their part to minimise the chance of the virus spreading throughout the school.

@Qasd

Oh and I want schools open because I think educating the population is really important it provides our future doctors and scientists for example, any covid vaccine developed here will come down directly to our investment in education institutions notable at the moment two of our leading universities, Oxford and imperial.

It is actually pretty rare for a modern country to decide to work towards having a high skilled economy and not have a state education system (actually not having a state education system is a pretty unusual thing for most countries and state education actually pre dates the nhs as a state run service that was worth investing in). Shutting it down temporarily could be justified but longer term to me it’s the equivalent getting rid off the nhs and most people saying “cannot people just do their own medical care they are sooo lazy”

Ultimately of course the right to education didn’t make it into the un convention on the rights of the child due to them wanting to protect parents right to “have a bit if a break from their kids”. But the one thing this pandemic has really shown me is education for education sake is very under valued in this country..I honestly hadn’t realised!

We definitely undervalue education. The government treats it as a political football with a curriculum and assessment system designed for data for point proving, not lifeskills and knowledge for 21st century life. Too many people see education as a means to an end, and not value the process and the enrichment it adds to people.

Suspending education is damaging a generation and damaging the most vulnerable the most. It's not just formal learning, it's contact with peers, soft social skills. There is a huge amount of learning that can not be met in the home or by parents and screens. Especially when it is basically illegal for a primary age child to have social conact with a peer beyond the school gates.

My 7 yo is already spiralling off into foul moods like those he had in June/ July because his extra curriculars are cancelled again and he needs more social and physical stimulation than can be fulfilled in the home.

Lockdown will damage education, health and other public services through loss of tax revenue and more demand on the welfare state. There are more hazards out there than just Covid.

At the very least there should be more flexibility. Children should not be forced to go in during the pandemic. There should be no fines and the child should be allowed to keep their place at the school even if they're temporarily off.

This teenage girl wrote to Rishi Sunak. She's clinically vulnerable to Covid - as is her mum, who she cares for. It's cruel to make her go to school.

www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/high-risk-teen-pens-letter-19218044

Not locking down - and certainly failing to contain, is far more damaging and costly.

Another school local to me has had to partially close. So many teachers and other staff are currently off sick.

Failure to contain will close, or at least heavily disrupt, schools.

Many schools aren’t doing ‘online teaching’ though. I think the evidence is there that it just doesn’t work for many schools for many reasons. Although there are now guidelines that online teaching should be available they don’t say for how many hours a day, and there’s still no extra equipment to lend out. A lot of areas were showing reduced levels in school aged children prior to lock down so the evidence just doesn’t support a national closing of schools.
I think relying totally on people to self police is a problem. We don’t expect it to happen in other areas. Plenty of people speed despite knowing the dangers, that’s why we have speed traps! It’s difficult in peoples’ homes but it doesn’t even appear to be happening much in public places

@Trumpetpants

Does anyone know if teaching assistant who works full time in one class tests positive will class have to isolate please?

At my children's school reception class TA has positive test & whole class have to isolate.

Thank you conveseandjeans, school haven't contacted us as yet but TA has told us that she is positive.
So many rules and ifs and buts....

Schools are giving out the minimum info. Ours isn’t even telling us about new cases. I know that a child in my dd’s bubble tested positive, school didn’t tell us or close the bubble. Eight teachers positive, school not closed. School is dangerous. I wish ours would close.

My Dad's friends have all been having sleepovers during lockdown. No wonder cases are still high.
Sorry this just cheered me up that those oldies are having sleepovers

There is fuck all of anything to do with the virus down here, so it's guaranteed the schools will shut.

What does that mean @PhilCornwall1 - I've woken stupidly early but can't make head nor tail of that.

"You won't necessarily know about cases unless your child is a direct contact.

Really? At our school we have been told the school will inform us of any positive cases and I'm pretty sure it's the Council policy for all state schools here."

My child's class had to isolate over half term. The first 3 parents from other classes, including the other class in his year, had no idea

Dd’s secondary school has just activated the first level of closure protocol. One whole year group off due to staff levels. Must be pretty rife in the school. A whole class is off in another year.

myhobby
Must vary from school to school. Dd’s school has full transparency and have informed us each time there is a case and what steps have been taken.

@Mummyoflittledragon yes, certainly seems that way.

I don't know which is the best way to go to be honest, DCs school is excellent and we have no issues but I was surprised that other class groups weren't aware.

That said, my friends DC had to isolate but certain parents chose to still take their isolating child out and about as they claim to have had no choice. It has caused chaos at their school because some of the non-isolating parents were just waiting to catch the others out!

Why do people find it so difficult to follow the rules? I’d understand if they were on their own but nearly everyone on here has children and/ or a partner. Enjoy the time with them and use it to do things your wouldn’t normally do.

Also that some people find it so hard to understand that lockdown will never be perfect. There can’t be a different rule for every situation. The rules need to be simple and in place to get cases down. This allows schools to stay open and the nhs to cope. The rules are not in place to completely get rid of the virus just make it manageable.

Does anyone know if teaching assistant who works full time in one class tests positive will class have to isolate please?

This happened in a school near us and yes the class had to isolate.

*Many schools aren’t doing ‘online teaching’ though. I think the evidence is there that it just doesn’t work for many schools for many reasons•

Absolutely not true. There is no evidence to suggest it doesn’t work for many schools. There is plenty of evidence to say that schools didn’t do it properly. Online does not have to mean live classes. It means online delivery of resources (eg videos, tasks and activities) supported by close teacher - student contact. The evidence is that only 9% of people who reported difficulties with home schooling (not 9% of all families) cited technology as a key reason. Over 77% cited lack of motivation among students which Is very different and can in many cases be mitigated through good teaching.

Of course it’s not as effective as in person education. But there is no evidence that it didn’t work. Only evidence that a lot of schools didn’t do it effectively. That’s where the support needs to come from govt.

My DC’s schools have full transparency as well. My eldest DC’s s currently under quarantine as her friend has tested positive, Ive booked DC in for a test as now her high temperature and fatigue looks more sinister than my initial assumption of just exhaustion. The poor teacher is having to quarantine for a second time she’s only returned back from the first isolation period last week.

It’s a rock and hard place situation. We’ve been following guidelines and not going out unnecessarily but the children need their education. God knows what the repercussions of lockdown will be on education.

My DH’s sisters go to boarding school, and the schools have been under lockdown since beginning of the year. Nobody is allowed in or out even half term the girls were kept in school and no visitors allowed. Pupils aren’t allowed to leave unless under exceptional circumstances.

I’m betting other boarding schools are doing similar.

This semi-lockdown isn’t working.

Online schooling only works if pupils participate and have the facilities to attend online lessons.

Many students don’t. And there’s not much not much an online teacher can do about it.

During the full lockdown my DC’s school would notify us if dc failed to attend lessons/dropped out of lessons/didn’t respond etc. I had a panicked dc begging me to let school know her speaker wasn’t working when she was unable to respond to a discussion during one lesson.

Currently my dc’s schools are poised to go back to online teaching fully. Eldest dc will be studying online during her isolation period. Both are very stressed about exams this year.

@myhobbyisouting
Dd has told me a girl, who is isolating as there is a case in her class, saw her cousins yesterday. She and a friend had sleepovers all throughout lockdown so it doesn’t surprise me.

@frazzledasarock
I hope your dd will be ok. That is awful about the boarding school. Poor children. Terribly damaging for them.

Three primary schools (out of 4) here had a two week half term due to so many isolating. The secondary had 3 year groups off. We are told in our school when someone is waiting for results/tests positive (no names, just a year group ). Hoping this has helped as no cases in our primary this week (first time since they went back in September).

The thought over here in Germany is that schools are not major drivers of transmission, and that fits with what I've observed anecdotally.

We've had a week of the same sort of shutdown as the UK, and it looks as if the rise in cases may be slowing.