Do people realise that covid patients don't wear masks?

[Arundelclassrom]

Just interested to hear if people know this. I see a lot on these threads that people think it's "ok for doctors and nurses because they have effective ppe". Do you realise that masks do not protect you, they protect others from you? Do you realise covid patients who are struggling to breathe do not wear masks? Do you realise they are coughing all over us as we provide care?

I'm not saying this to complain - this is my job and I do it willingly because I care. I'm just getting really frustrated seeing people who apparently think there is no risk involved in my job, and that theirs is somehow more risky than a job where we are in an enclosed space with actual confirmed covid patients...

@Lifeisabeach09 thanks for the recommendation I’ll look into buying that stuff. Because where we are nursing home residents and staff are not tested anywhere near that regularly, and the homes are furiously understaffed so not possible to limit contact with residents to the 15 mins max you mentioned. It’s a bit of a shitshow tbh, God help us all.

@bumblingbovine49

If you are working with known Covid patients you should have full PPE with proper ff3 level masks with breathing valves that protect the wearer not the person infected and ideally a visor as well . If this is not the case and you are just wearing a surgical type mask then that is truly outrageous and I agree more people should.know above this

OP is right. There’s no full PPE. It’s just a basic thin apron (sleeveless), gloves, and a pair of Googles along with your basic blue mask (that can be found in B&M) that’s for your general positive Covid patient. Patients travelling around the hospital are asked to wear a mask. When the patient is in a bay they can remove their mask if they like.

@Lucymumofson

Sorry where do you work? I work in a large acute hospital with wards full of confirmed covid patients. No member of staff is allowed near a covid positive patient without full head to toe PPE, not a surgical mask on its own. Any patients on the covid step down ward (ten days plus asymptomatic) - then the staff are wearing amber PPE (ffp surgical mask, glasses/visor, aprons and gloves). For the rest of the hospital is gloves aprons and surgical mask...

Where I work it’s the exact same thing as OP is saying. It’s true.

Where you work is it classed as a hot ward? Just wondered if that’s why you have the correct PPE.

Oh yes, way back in March when we had limited amounts of FFP3 masks, we were told not to use them as they were only for the doctors

In your Trust maybe, in ours anyone (covid or not) who can wear a mask does - even in side rooms.

@SandMason, no prob! Hope things work out. Stay safe.

@Ffsnosexallowed

Ffp3 is only aerosol generating procedures. Staff wear surgical mask and visor. So far in our trust we have had covid patients but no staff member has caught covid from a patient when wearing the required PPE. Stop scaremongering and being outraged. No patient, once admitted to a hospital bed has to wear a mask. You can’t make someone with a breathing condition wear a mask.

And this

You will never know where you have caught Covid from in the first place. How do you know no medical staff have caught Covid in the whole of your trust have you had antibody tests? Because that sounds very unusual!

@Lucymumofson

Sorry where do you work? I work in a large acute hospital with wards full of confirmed covid patients. No member of staff is allowed near a covid positive patient without full head to toe PPE, not a surgical mask on its own. Any patients on the covid step down ward (ten days plus asymptomatic) - then the staff are wearing amber PPE (ffp surgical mask, glasses/visor, aprons and gloves). For the rest of the hospital is gloves aprons and surgical mask...

I work for a large University Health Board and can confirm that during my period of redeployment to wards where patients were frequently being diagnosed with covid, we did not have fitted FFP3 masks or full gowns. Our visors had been donated by local companies too.

Not one member of staff had (or still has) been mask fitted - not sure how we were supposed to perform CPR without putting ourselves at risk......

We had to argue our case to have showers fixed so that we could thoroughly wash ourselves and have a complete change of clothes before we left work after each shift.

I kid you not.

@bumblingbovine49

If you are working with known Covid patients you should have full PPE with proper ff3 level masks with breathing valves that protect the wearer not the person infected and ideally a visor as well . If this is not the case and you are just wearing a surgical type mask then that is truly outrageous and I agree more people should.know above this

Full PPE is only provided for ‘aerosol generating procedures’. Anything else, we wear a normal surgical mask, plastic pinny and gloves.

We get a basic surgical mask which does not protect us from the covid being breathed out by our actual covid patients. We are not protected in any way.

I had no idea. That sounds tough. Thanks for explaining this.

@Nellodee I feel angry for you too, I agree this is not fair on any of us.

But you have had eight hours of exposure to one confirmed case. I presume this confirmed case was not coughing?

We have 12 hours of exposure to multiple confirmed, usually symptomatic cases, every shift.

I don't want this to be a race to the bottom. We are all at risk. But please don't imply your risks are like ours. I feel like we are being completely devalued by this.

@stairway

On the teaching threads they seem to think nhs staff are better protected but it isn’t true. We usually only have the paper masks which a teacher could wear if they insisted/ wanted to. Yes they might be in a room with 30 people and there is the off chance one might be an asymptomatic carrier but its hardly as bad as giving personal care to a patient covid positive and symptomatic.

I absolutely agree. I think teachers must think the grass is greener. I know what job I would rather be doing right now!

@Piggywaspushed really? Details please. I haven't heard about that.

@Hmmph

I’m a not in healthcare and this has come as a surprise. What do you mean by masks you wear? The flimsy blue and white ones??

Yes that’s correct!!

This must vary greatly but it is absolutely not the case in any of the four hospitals I've been in in the past four months.

The one I currently visit has for staff entering the room of any covid positive (or even suspected but awaiting test results) patients full length and long sleeved gowns, fitted masks, hairnets, disposible visors, gloves. They are worn for any contact - even just taking a meal in.

@Umbridge34 God I didn’t even think of that (people taking advantage by selling fake PPE or wearing LESS than what’s required) but you’re right of course. What an awful situation.

No, it was actually 2 cases for 4 hours solid each. I had another 3 cases who were between 2-3m away. Then probably a bunch more asymptomatic. I had another case that I strongly suspect was positive who was coughing everywhere but said he had had a test. When I asked him where he got one so quickly, he said "Um... in a carpark?"

18% of all cases are transmitted within a healthcare setting. I wonder if many people realise this? I think the answer is probably not, otherwise surely there would be a call for staff to be provided with the better PPE.

Why don’t you buy yourself
One of the “proper” masks? Surely it would
Be a good investment in your own health?

[quote Nellodee]@natsel84 Sorry to hear of your loss. This whole situation is so shit.[/quote]
Thank you

Sort of the point really staples. A Welsh secondary teacher died this week in hospital.

This is not to diminish what is being written on this thread about nurses.

@Barryisland is that what you are suggesting to teachers too?

@Barryisland

Why don’t you buy yourself One of the “proper” masks? Surely it would Be a good investment in your own health?

They are not allowed to be worn. Trust employees have to follow trust policy including type of masks. Some HCPs have tried and been told to remove them.

@Barryisland

Why don’t you buy yourself One of the “proper” masks? Surely it would Be a good investment in your own health?

Can you give us a few quick links to these ‘proper’ masks?

And also details on who facilitates the fitting, checking and testing of them?

The term PPE has been thrown around so loosely it seems some people don’t actually know what it is and have assumed instead.

@DivGirl I’m shocked to read that’s how your setting operates. I want to work there too!