Why on earth do you think home ed would work second time around?

[Whatchasayin]

We know that a huge percentage of DC didn't even log onto home learning earlier in the year. We know thousands of DC don't have devices, WiFi, space to work, parental support. We know thousands of DC can't be bothered to do it and who's going to make them when parents are at work/don't care. This all happened a few months ago so why are so many people advocating going back there? For a virus that many people don't even realise they have and most don't get more than mildly unwell. Average age of death is 82.

@Triangularbubble

“Or at least it is not good enough for just those kids to have substandard education. If there’s a move to part time everyone should suffer equally. The education of senior high school kids is not less important than younger kids’“

“my objection is that it’s just older secondary kids who are expected to put up with it. They are not stupid and it sends the message to them that their schooling is not important which I don’t think is good.“

How unpleasant. So to give a better message to far more contagious “children” in bubbles of many hundreds, who are developed enough to not need childcare, are able to learn far more of their curriculum from home and who could actually benefit from more independent learning you want to, for example, shut/rota a small preschool of 25 3-4 year olds, who spend half the day outside anyway, are all far too young to engage with online teaching and who need peers to learn half the kind of skills they are meant to be learning? Or a year 1 primary bubble with 30 children and 2 adults, most of whom cannot engage with online learning for more than a fraction of their day or curriculum and need constant supervision? Why? Of course all children’s schooling is important but I’d have thought it was obvious that different solutions will be needed for different education stages and different stages of child maturity.

But it’s been repeatedly parroted on here over the years that “school is not childcare”. Is that not the case then?

Exam years are the most important. And yet it’s OK for them to get part time school while younger kids with longer to catch up get full time? I don’t agree.

All kids in school really need to be there full time. If they can’t be they should all be part time. We all pay taxes for our kids to get educated not be treated as if theirs is less important because they are older. And no matter how “mature”’older kids are some subjects just cannot be taught remotely.

“But it’s been repeatedly parroted on here over the years that “school is not childcare”. Is that not the case then?

Exam years are the most important. And yet it’s OK for them to get part time school while younger kids with longer to catch up get full time? I don’t agree.

All kids in school really need to be there full time. If they can’t be they should all be part time. We all pay taxes for our kids to get educated not be treated as if theirs is less important because they are older. And no matter how “mature”’older kids are some subjects just cannot be taught remotely.“

Do you apply that race to the bottom to adults? Well, theatres can’t open or work from home and are laying people off, better start making some accountants or IT consultants redundant....

And no exam years are not most important, except to people who have children at that stage. How does my preschooler being part time help your teenager pass their GCSEs anyway.

Knew this would end up being a bun fight between parents about who needs their kids in education the most.

It's a shit situation for all, we should all be fighting the government for better provision for all kids.

Our schools closed at the end of February and are still closed. They have not opened for one single day in that time period. What they did do was move the Easter holidays to the first two weeks of the closure. That meant two weeks for the teachers to prepare and set up remote learning, laptops to be distributed to children, people to upgrade internet data limits in their homes, etc, etc. I found it strange that the UK kept to the same holidays - no one was able to travel anywhere or do anything outside the home so what did it matter when the school holidays were? After that two-week period the remote classroom program was up and running and still is today. Parts of our state are still on full lockdown and have been since March 6, despite our case levels being less than a third of the national average here but that’s another argument for another day.... Whilst some people are fortunate that their children all have a laptop, a space to work, parental support and so on, the reality for many is something else. A good friend of mine is a single parent and world on a military base (she’s a civilian). Her children are supposed to be logged on for remote classroom between 8 and 4. She works until 6 pm. The children have to stay with their grandma during the day when she works. Grandma doesn’t even speak English, let alone have a high-speed Internet connection. So my friend is logging on when they get home at 6.30 pm after picking them up from grandma and finding that the children have been marked AWOL for the day. Even if she does the work with them in the evening, it’s not good enough in the eyes of the school.

I live in a very remote area on the edge of a National Park and Native American reservation. Nearest town is 75 miles away. There are a few hundred people who live in this school district all spread over a very large area. Snow has already started to fall in the mountains here. I heard about a couple of children who live further into the park where they have no internet connection so they are sitting at desks in the library car park (the nearest library is 20 miles away) in all weathers using the library WiFi which has been left running even though the libraries have been closed since February. It’s not that the parents can’t afford or don’t want internet, it’s just not available where they live. There is a small school but it’s closed. What risks are there really in a school of fewer than 20 pupils?

Late to the thread, but for my kids it actually worked ok the first time around and so I don't have concerns about it happening again.

I think the school has been planning for it, because they launched a programme that will provide insured iPads for every student to ensure continuity of learning. (With most parents contributing £10/month for as long as the kids attend the school, so I'll have paid the equivalent of many iPads by the time all the kids have finished school and handed the things back.

I disagree about the spoon feeding

Then your kids better not attend school then because this is what lecturers are faced with, school kids are spoon fed, it's the system.
You can encourage them to learn these skills at home if you can get them to do the extra study.

Flumposie.

We were told if all sent home, not a few. So no reason why teacher can't be available for whole lesson if they were meant to be teaching that class when the whole class have been sent home.

All the people who don't want their kids at home for another period, what are you doing about the situation in schools? Are you lobbying for kids to wear masks in school? Teachers? School transport to be increased so only bubbles travel together? Government funding for increased handwashing and cleaning? Have you checked that the teachers are spaced far enough away from the kids? Bet you aren't interested in any of this, but you will stamp your feet when schools inevitably have to close as they are such a massive source of transmission.

@Whatchasayin

We know that a huge percentage of DC didn't even log onto home learning earlier in the year. We know thousands of DC don't have devices, WiFi, space to work, parental support. We know thousands of DC can't be bothered to do it and who's going to make them when parents are at work/don't care. This all happened a few months ago so why are so many people advocating going back there? For a virus that many people don't even realise they have and most don't get more than mildly unwell. Average age of death is 82.

Please don't link together working parents and those who can't be bothered as they far from in the same category!!!

@Summerfreeze - thanks, my kids are briefed on corona safety. They have their own masks to wear which get changed dayly. They have their own hand sanitiser. They are told to keep to the guidelines as have been handed out by the school. We as parents lead by example when out and about. Not much more I can do at this point in time.
And according to secondary DC teachers are not always sticking to what is breached on MN, like wearing masks in corridors. Which is interesting, because DC was actually furious... as in why one rule for pupils and one for teachers? totally beside the point

Summer freeze

I made a complaint about a teacher who stood so close to the front row that his spit sprayed on my sons book so yes I am interested.

It didn't - it won't and we should try and shut up the idiots calling for school to close.

This time the expectation would be that work is done. We know which children have devices, we know how to produce the videos and resources that work the best, the children have been taught how to use the platforms etc.

Covid is understood more, mentally we're either in a better place or a more resigned place.

Also, the DfE haven't suspended the curriculum like they did last time - this time schools are expected to provide learning, last time we were pretty much told not to.

Remote learning isnt much use for primary kids, but those are the reasons it would work better.

All the people who don't want their kids at home for another period, what are you doing about the situation in schools? Are you lobbying for kids to wear masks in school? Teachers? School transport to be increased so only bubbles travel together? Government funding for increased handwashing and cleaning? Have you checked that the teachers are spaced far enough away from the kids? Bet you aren't interested in any of this, but you will stamp your feet when schools inevitably have to close as they are such a massive source of transmission.

Er, "people who don't want their kids at home for another period" comprises 90% of parents and most teachers. I am guessing that lots of those people would prefer all kids to wear masks in school.

In Japan we have been back to full school since late June-ish, with virtually no closures and very few isolations. Full classes full time. And we never had a full lockdown. What we DO do is that everyone over age 6 wears a bloody mask when they are indoors including in lessons.

@Londonmummy66

It didn't - it won't and we should try and shut up the idiots calling for school to close.

Aren’t you a delight

Maybe we should shut up the idiots who can’t see that schools will inevitably close when hospitals get overwhelmed with uncontrolled Covid.

Go and join Us4Them (or rather Us4Ourselves) if you’re not already a member as they’re selfish morons also

@Starlight101 are you calling people selfish for wanting to keep schools open?

But the NHS didn't collapse. It wasn't even put under any pressure. The nightingale hospitals weren't even used.

Yet my ds's did a couple of spreadsheets daily. That weren't marked. No feedback given. Shit teaching.
Schools have now had 8 months to plan, they could at least manage some sort of zoom, Microsoft teams, doing some actual teaching, from now on. An actual lesson. What's the bet that this won't happen?

The trouble is that not all parents want that @Oblomov20 - I don’t and many other families don’t either. The main feedback I’ve had from parents is they need flexibility. Lessons need to work around parents’ work commitments and siblings’ needs. In the last lockdown I had a family who gave their (young) DCs afternoon naps in order to get their own work calls done and did schoolwork in the morning and evening. I know families who would get lessons done from 6am with one child and then move on to supporting the other one. I used to do my work (preparing recorded lessons and worksheets as well as phoning every child once a week) in the breaks between supporting my own children’s learning and in the evening when DH got home from work. Live lessons wouldn’t allow me to supervise my own DC and would have a fairly low take-up from my class. I know my community and I know what works best for them, and I hope I’m given the flexibility to teach in the way that works best for all of us if it comes to it. (FWIW I hope it doesn’t, my class are really struggling right now and I need them in school as much as possible).

(That said, assessment wasn’t great last time round. It’s the one thing I’d like to improve on if it happens again.)

@Starlight101 it is not selfish to want your DC to get a proper education and be able to work and pay your bills. Only in the days of Covid are we expected to put absolutely everyone else ahead of our own families or we're "selfish." Such a stupid comment.

The NHS ‘being protected’ last time led to 25,000 excess deaths from conditions like heart disease due to people being denied treatment or too scared to access it because of the media and NHSscaremongering
@Ecosse meanwhile in the report

There are a team of fantastic supply teachers and retired teachers who would be more than happy to help children who have to isolate or work from home, many more than happy to do this for free. But the government can’t even be bothered to utilise them.
I have a friend who is an amazingly committed teacher. The students and parents all love her as she genuinely cares for the kids but she wants to work part time and that is a big no no at the moment and many schools aren't/can't use supply teachers. She has also worked for free too.

The answer is for this government to pull its finger out and fund a proper, locally led, track and trace function with decent testing.

The billions wasted on a ineffective inefficient centralised approach has failed.

They could have spent a fraction by using local authorities and GPS instead. We all are more like to have have regular contact with our council and doctors than a faceless government department.

*GPs

@Iggly

The answer is for this government to pull its finger out and fund a proper, locally led, track and trace function with decent testing.

The billions wasted on a ineffective inefficient centralised approach has failed.

They could have spent a fraction by using local authorities and GPS instead. We all are more like to have have regular contact with our council and doctors than a faceless government department.

I agree. But the point of the centralised system was to funnel loads of money to friends and cronies of Dominic Cummings et al. Ditto with PPE and ventilators. The companies who have been manufacturing, and supplying, for the NHS for decades didn't get a look in. It is corruption on a massive scale.