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I genuinely don’t get it?!

437 replies

Rapphue · 27/09/2020 13:01

Hopeful for balanced and sincere posts here rather than the assumption that I’m ‘playing ignorance’ or some other accusation because my question undermines the government narrative.

FWIW I’m educated and well read, albeit I don’t have huge in depth knowledge politics, nor do I claim to!

But I don’t understand why we are having restrictions imposed for a virus that is no worse than other illnesses. Even if I accept that it is harmless to the NHS should it escalate fast and make many ill at the same time (so far no hospitals have been maxed out with corona - my SIL works as a hospital doctor in intense care and has said there hasn’t been even 50% corona patients in any ward at one time. She works in a busy London hospital)...even if I accept it could escalate and we don’t want that, then:

  1. Why is there suddenly a lack of concern about public health in general? People are dying because they are having treatment postponed due to Coronavirus. Hospitals are not busy and certainly not full of corona patients. It seems crazy to me that anyone who may fall ill non corona related is now at the back of the queue. Tough shit if that ends in your death.
  1. Pubs open until 10pm. I use this as one example of many arbitrary rules. Why does the virus suddenly operate after 10pm? Is it a vampire? Surely you can infect just as many people at 9:59pm as you can at 10pm. Is it just to reduce risk overall? If so then I think someone needs to read a gcse science textbook... the risk has already been taken if the pub is open full stop.
  1. Cashless society...erm. Why?

I’m not trying to incite some sort of dramatic post. I hope there are honest reasons for operating as we have the last few months. I hope I am wrong to feel cynical. I hope - and suspect - I’m not knowledgeable enough to understand why this is happening how it is.

As far as I can tell this is very much about controlling people’s lives to their detriment. If it was about health why on Earth are we letting people get sick and delaying treatment because of a virus?

Is there something in the London protests yesterday? Am I missing something medical, political or scientific here?

OP posts:
newtb · 28/09/2020 01:40

Point 3. Money is not called filthy lucre for nothing.

Ever done a cash count? Apart from the notes that look as if someone has quite literally wiped their arse on them, loads of people don't wash their hands after using the toilet.

Once, on a audit in a brewery, I had the joy of counting between £10,000 and £15,000 in the safe due to the made owners not wanting to use cheques for payment to avoid bank charges.

So got the cash ledger out and rolled up my sleeves and used the empty desk. £10,000 or even £15,000 isn't really that much. Is it? Didn't even take that long. Thankfully.

My. Hands. Were. Black.

If only they'd had cashless payments then. But they probably wouldn't have accepted them.

2 Closure time. The later they close the more drinking time. The more drinking time the more alcohol consumed. The more alcohol consumed the less inhibited human behaviour becomes. The less inhibited behaviour becomes, the more risks are ignorred
It's only 5 mins in the car - vigilance at the wheel is less pronounced the nearer to home.
Impossible to get pregnant standing up/if he pulls out in time
Even if he just runs it against me, I won't get pregnant. About 40 years ago a daring woman's magazine asked for examples of immaculate conception/women who were still virgins on their due date. Think it was about the time a controversial CofE Bishop said he didn't believe in the Virgin Birth.

Also, given the variables
Unkown viral load when infected - greater load seems to imply more serious cases, note seems, could be spurious correlation, no idea
Known elevated risk factors
So far
Male
Blood group A
Copd type illness and other lung function deficiencies
Obesity
Shortage of Vit D
Habitual smoker, even though smoking itself has maybe stopped it taking hold.

Fit extremely healthy 19 or 20 year olds, with 'long covid' problems a nasty form of post-viral fatigue that leaves people struggling to breathe, in wheelchairs etc Thank goodness I'm not young, fit and healthy, stops me being too blasée.

That btw is not a rant. I go to the local supermarket, where masks are compulsory, I live in France, so no choice. I observe, just about, social distance 1m but not 2m, when talking to neighbours, with whom I'm normally on kissing terms.
I'm in a commune of less than 200 other people 3 miles from the nearest baker not even a mairie where I live. At 400m above sea level on a sloping site rather than in a dip where fog, heat, etc can't get out, and above the cloud in winter. Blazing sun at home, wood front door hot to touch, dank and wet and cold 10 miles away and 300m lower down.

With winter approaching I'm trying to remember to use the spray at supermarket entry for my hands/trolley. As it's not a habit, I sometimes forget.

I'm not panicking, I'm not brushing it off, either. Just being sensible and, I hope, thinking of others possibly with unknown vulnerabilities.

Bluelinings · 28/09/2020 01:50

Op. This is not about disregard for other illnesses. This virus has had a devastating effect DESPITE restrictions.

Unchecked it’d have had a huge effect plus it would have stopped the NHS treating far more other illnesses than lockdown did.

No lockdown would have overwhelmed the nhs for a very long time, this stopping treatment for other illnesses.

And allowed many more to die of this virus and suffer long Covid.

No restrictions doesn’t mean no Covid or no cases or hospitals affecting other illnesses.

MyShinyWhiteTeeth · 28/09/2020 06:28

I've got the general impression that scientists believe the virus hasn't become less virulent but medical staff are now better able to treat the symptoms so less people are dying; more are surviving with damage as a consequence of the virus itself or complications from the treatments. In hospitals there is now more resources needed for care of the survivors.

The death rate figures initially came from a closed community in Europe AFAIK where everyone was tested for infection. Figures coming from only the symptomatic will give highly inflated death rates.

MyShinyWhiteTeeth · 28/09/2020 06:38

www.kingsfund.org.uk/publications/deaths-covid-19

I think this is a fairly good resource with good explanations.

MummyPop00 · 28/09/2020 06:43

@SheepandCow

Yes I understand that if we had dealt with it like NZ etc.......but as you acknowledge yourself, that’s not where we’re at. So, I’m assessing ‘let it run’ against what we actually have going on in the UK at the moment.

MyShinyWhiteTeeth · 28/09/2020 06:47

ourworldindata.org/mortality-risk-covid

This is quite a good resource too when comparing different countries.

Theworldisfullofgs · 28/09/2020 06:51

Covid is four times more infectious than seasonal flu with four times the death rate.

We have no natural immunity because it's a novel virus.
It has more complications than flu and now evidence in Singapore of reinvention.

Theworldisfullofgs · 28/09/2020 06:51

Re infection

Shooglywheel · 28/09/2020 06:55

This may help.

I genuinely don’t get it?!
Namenic · 28/09/2020 07:01

I think the hospitals and postponing treatment does not HAVE to happen unless hospitalizations rates are high or lots of staff are off sick.

Why things didn’t get going over summer - I don’t know. Things do seem to be patchy - as I have read that some people’s cancer clinics, operations etc did occur. Perhaps poor central co-ordination - a bit like why some schools gave lots of online teaching and others didn’t. Not schools’ fault - govt had no clear policy and each school had to interpret it for themselves.

The difference between corona and other illnesses is the time course in which it spreads. Once you see lots of deaths, you have missed the boat and it’s very difficult to stop. The govt CAN increase funding and deal with many of the other issues over a longer course (I doubt they will but they do have the choice).

Beautiful3 · 28/09/2020 07:21

Yes I agree with you.

Northernsoulgirl45 · 28/09/2020 07:24

Lots of great explanations on here to explain op. I hope you are now better informed.

3rdNamechange · 28/09/2020 07:34

I can assure you the hospitals are not empty.

Ecosse · 28/09/2020 08:01

@3rdNamechange

The vast majority of hospitals have very few COVID patients in them. We also have numerous Nightingale hospitals on hand if need be.

DameFanny · 28/09/2020 08:18

@Ophelia2020 if that WEF link were being introduced as policy don't you think we'd have noticed by now? We're not in lockdown - apart from specific places temporarily - why do you insist on carrying on as if the Chinese state's on your doorstep?

Yes, there are some serious and genuine concerns about the government's appropriation of powers right now - the focus on anti mask, anti pub curfew, what some policy think tank was musing about etc etc just detracts from the important questions people are asking about that

DameFanny · 28/09/2020 08:25

twitter.com/GoodLawProject?s=09
twitter.com/AdamWagner1?s=09

These are people looking at the government's use of law in this emergency - worth your support?

randomer · 28/09/2020 08:27

@Shooglywheel, thats very interesting. ( great name btw)

randomer · 28/09/2020 08:29

If your graph is correct, why are we being scared into submission and MH meltdown?

CrunchyNutNC · 28/09/2020 08:39

@randomer

If your graph is correct, why are we being scared into submission and MH meltdown?
Well first off it might be correct for Sweden, whose research it is.

Secondly, if an over 60 with any underlying health condition has a 'only' 2% chance of dying, in a population then size if ours this represents alot of people in hospital, even if the majority recover.

AlecTrevelyan006 · 28/09/2020 08:58

Sadly, society is beginning to fragment and the previous willingness to adhere to government measures is no longer as widespread.

The protest at the weekend was met robustly as the govt know they desperately need to keep us in check. It isn't sustainable as once the population realise there isn't enough law enforcement to go round the rules lose their bite.

We're going to see plenty of localised confrontation along the way as the snitchers do their bit and the believers/ non believers square up on social media (oh what fun).

We're in for a rotten few months but the inevitable outcome will prevail and the virus left to run its course. There is no other outcome.

SallySeven · 28/09/2020 09:04

Society was certainly fractious during the second world war in the uk. There are some interesting first hand reports of trouble amongst the populace, it was never all in it together.

But having said that I do think the majority of people want to do the right thing. It may not be what you think is the right thing however!

SallySeven · 28/09/2020 09:05

If I go out today I'll see people abiding by rules, mostly.
Social media shines a light on every opinion.

LuluBellaBlue · 28/09/2020 09:09

It’s to ensure mass population is as compliant as possible, making life so hard for us we all have to get injections.
They want mandatory vaccines - that are not safe or fully tested.

SallySeven · 28/09/2020 09:30

Oh give over.

You'll be lucky to get yourself vaccinated.

randomer · 28/09/2020 09:34

@SallySeven, I'm not big on conspiracy theories, prefering to plod along and do as I am told. However, there is something very rotten in the sate of the UK.

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