Is it really worth all this?

[Dustballs]

What are we shutting down for? What are we trying to save?

I don't understand what the purpose of this is anymore.

What are we trying to save?!
Seriously you need to ask that?!

southernsoftie that's great that you're doing OK but many people have lost their jobs, businesses, are suffering from anxiety and depression, can't get NHS treatment that they need.

@Hearwego not enough staff to man the Nightingales, covid will get into hospitals whatever is done just like Noro does every winter. No easy solution. Your greater good theory is callous.

@HelloMissus

Entire industries are still shut down!!! Who is so insular they don’t know this?

The industries which are shut down are those which are no longer viable because of the risk of covid transmission

What does viable mean?

Maybe not viable now - but forever not viable ...

They're disappearing into thin air.

@Dustballs

Schools are sending whole year groups home all the time round here (my kids' schools included). Teachers are off. It's mostly supply at the moment.

The economy's going to shit.

What's shut down?? Are you kidding me?

stuff being shut is old news, I assumed you meant new things had closed. Schools were always going to close or have groups isolating. It seems we're damned if we do and damned if we don't - wipe out a percentage of the population, completely break the NHS or shut some businesses and people live but don't have a job.....it's about risk assessment and mitigation and your level of acceptable risk is clearly different to the government's right now. Likewise, some people will have a lower risk threshold and still won't leave home.

The industries which are shut down are those which are no longer viable because of the risk of covid transmission

Well, that will make it so much easier for the families staring down the barrel of a financial gun then

@MakeOfThatWhatYouWill

The industries which are shut down are those which are no longer viable because of the risk of covid transmission

Well, that will make it so much easier for the families staring down the barrel of a financial gun then

Don't you know that they don't count @MakeOfThatWhatYouWill? If you die because of covid, you're tragic and it's terrible and everyone cares. If you die because of lockdown or restrictions, no one gives a shit.

@Heffalooomia yeah, fuck all the people working in those industries who will lose their livelihoods.

@Dustballs

I actually want my family to get it now - so we can build immunity/T cells to fight Covid now, next year or whenever. It's endemic now. They'll need immunity. And surely it's better to get sick, now, when they're young - rather than later on.

I don't believe a vaccine will be as effective as actually having had the virus itself.

But it's not know how long immunity lasts for, could only be 6 months or a year or it could be longer.

It's still not clear exactly what role T cells play.

A vaccine should provide more effective immunity than natural infection, even if does not provide complete immunity from infection it should reduce severity.

@Hearwego there is not enough nurses let alone doctors to staff the nightingale. Don’t forgot some nurses mainly the older ones will have left the NHS because they are vulnerable and at the time people would not have rushed to pick up extra agency shifts like in normal times.

"you won't get much sympathy for holding this particular opinion on mumsnet, in fact it will be hinted you are somewhat of a monster"

Pahaha what a load of shite. It's exactly the opposite. I think they've lost count of how many threads they're on now

@emmathedilemma

What's shut down??

The live entertainment industry, for a start. Been to a concert recently? Or the theatre? Or a comedy club? Or a business conference?

"Or a comedy club?"

Yes, and seen several singers. You?

When people eg governments do not really know much about something they just go on fear. This may happen so we should
try to do xyz.
The NHS did not collapse last year though it was tough.
Now the second wave may be worse because it will be in the winter.
Fear.
Yet we are better informed and equipped than last March so why
should it be worse?
The government feels it has to do something to protect its citizens

We can't go back to the way things were. If we let the virus rampage unchecked, the economy will still be shit because huge numbers of people will be ill, dead, disabled or carers.

@BogRollBOGOF

Are we back to saving the NHS? I'm guessing so?

While I couldn't name one personal contact who's had a positive Covid test, I could name plenty suffering from delayed NHS treatments and extensive waiting lists.

I'm not underestimating the risk to life across different demographics or the hazards of long Covid, just it needs to be balanced that these measures also have an effect on health, quality of life and longevity and other causes of death.

Because if every hospital bed and ICU bed in the country is filled with a COVID patient none of that treatment is happening anyway. Nor will any of the urgent/emergency treatment be happening.

All the people that might die in the future due to delayed diagnosis/treatment will still die (a lot of them quicker cos covid + underlying conditions) if we just carry on along with a fuckload more people.

And that's just the physical bed space. It doesn't even account for how we are supposed to run a health service with large numbers of staff off sick.

Agree with you OP. Madness that people think we can get rid of the virus which is endemic worldwide by being socially distant indefinitely. Or if not get rid of, then live like this forever keeping it at bay but existing in this miserable state. Lockdown never worked before when most people were compliant and saw the point, so it most definitley work now. Look at Spain.

The only thing getting me through is knowing that humans simply WONT accept living like this forever. I've seen more and more people in my life cracking and realising the absolute madness were living in now.

@VirginiaWolverine

We can't go back to the way things were. If we let the virus rampage unchecked, the economy will still be shit because huge numbers of people will be ill, dead, disabled or carers.

Will they though? Serious question there’s no logic in this testing if the government are not keeping a track of how many people are admitted to hospital with Covid. Is everyone getting covid hospitalised? Or only in MN land..

This is what Borris should be telling us how many people have the Covid but bounced back!

@myhobbyisouting

"Or a comedy club?"

Yes, and seen several singers. You?

Not around here, no. Still, you have, so the entertainment industry is obviously fine!

Boris locked down later than may have been ideal earlier this year and many people paid the price of his delay.

We are now in the exact situation, but properly worse because we are approaching the winter months and nothing is being done.

Whilst pubs, schools, restaurants etc are still open which provide opportunities for many people to mix then things are not going to get better regardless of how many metres we stay away from each other and how many family members we don’t see.

There is no answer because we can’t shut everything down again. Part of me thinks that we just have to carry on with life and manage the consequences as they arise.

No.

I don't want another lockdown, but equally even if we just opened everything and went back to pre-covid times the economy would still be adversely affected. So I don't know what's best. I kind of feel that we just need to keep as much open as possible

We are back to saving the NHS.

It struggles with normal levels of winter illness.