We were doing ok until we opened all the schools....

[Bbq1]

After lockdown was lifted pre September and pubs, restaurants etc were opened we seemed to have a handle on Covid with cases, hospital admissions and deaths all declining fairly steadily. Since we released millions of school aged children and thousands of teachers etc back into the classroom- boom, cases and consequently deaths, are now growing very rapidly again. It didn't take a rocket scientist to work out that this would happen. I work in a school and I have a 15 year old starting his gcse's so I 100% don't want the schools to close but surely there must be a more workable solution? Couldn't schools be one week, one week off for different bubbles or alternate days? Nobody wants schools to shut but surely in the long term if we don't get something safer in place and just continue sending kids and adults in day after day, then eventually they will close again?

I want schools to stay open. When 1700 aren’t fully open because the methods are unattainable then that’s unfair on kids at home. Distanced learning would help that. Education comes first.

@neveradullmoment99

How do we know - because our ONE local infection was from a parent who had worked away and caught it.... that's how we know he said so! His child doesn't have it - they closed the year group to be on the safe side though.

But carry on blaming the schools.

The Bolton outbreak was a man returning from holiday abroad and spreading it - that's confirmed - but you carry on blaming the schools!

@Timeforanotherusername
I dont know you or your child.

I would also say that out of my class of 30+, the vast majority have a cold currently.

Obviously Covid symptoms can be cold-like in children, but there does not seem to be the will to send every one of these children home to be tested (believe me I have asked the question - and had the cold).

So if my experience is typical, there are a LOT of children in school who could well be carrying or even suffering from Covid, but not being tested.

[quote Browneyesbigbum]@neveradullmoment99

How do we know - because our ONE local infection was from a parent who had worked away and caught it.... that's how we know he said so! His child doesn't have it - they closed the year group to be on the safe side though.

But carry on blaming the schools.

The Bolton outbreak was a man returning from holiday abroad and spreading it - that's confirmed - but you carry on blaming the schools![/quote]
Im not blaming schools.
Im blaming the government for not providing education in a sustainable way.

[quote neveradullmoment99]@SillyUnMurphy with all due respect you can wear a mask. Really you going on the tube is not the same. You could also make other choices about how you travel.[/quote]
From 35 miles away, I really can’t make other choices about how I travel!
The teachers at my children’s school have face shields (most choose not to wear them) and any other PPE they request or deem necessary. They are no less safe than I am returning to work (FYI I work in a huge University)

@cantkeepawayforever

I would also say that out of my class of 30+, the vast majority have a cold currently.

Obviously Covid symptoms can be cold-like in children, but there does not seem to be the will to send every one of these children home to be tested (believe me I have asked the question - and had the cold).

So if my experience is typical, there are a LOT of children in school who could well be carrying or even suffering from Covid, but not being tested.

I'm on my 3rd cold!

A school local to us had one member of staff and one child positive. It’s now eight children positive. It does spread. Read just a few local news reports around the country and it’s happening elsewhere. Last week alone over 120 schools had outbreaks (more than one case)

some people @neveradullmoment99 appear to want the schools to close - your comments indicated to a poster before are shocking about their child.... if you are a teacher a vested interest in shutting the schools.

However, facts first. When infection can be tracked and I have illustrated 2 particular ones above - it is possible to see where infections have come from.

Our teachers locally are working brilliantly and keeping the schools running - so pleased that it isn't up to you since you would quite happily sacrifice education.

@SillyUnMurphy Yes, you are worse off. I have no idea how you are expected to be back at work at a uni. Its ridiculous.

However, the question is where these cases are coming from. they are not from child tio child transmission in school yet, but from the community / families into schoolss. What school opening has done has brought about a HUGE change both in terms of mobility and in terms of mindset: 'The children are at school, I can go back to work / meet friends for coffee/ go to my gym class' AND 'The children are mixing in school anyway, so we can do playdates, parties, after school clubs and activities, get together as families'. This change pre-dates school opening by a few weeks, because 'The kids will be in school soon anyway, so why would it be a problem if we meet friends / go out / go on holiday'.

It is those cases that are coming into school now - and yes, they are closing schools quite rapidly, though in a patchy way (some schools badly affected, others untouyched as yet).

@cantkeepawayforever is right.
The Government should have waited till the schools were open before they opened up everything else.
And before people say 'what about the economy', well the Government do have a magic money tree, it's called Quantitative Easing which the Government are using & have used before.

I'm on my 3rd cold!

Just out of my first, second is coming.... This one may see me out of the class for testing, sorry though I will be for the children and their parents, because it's a more 'chesty' one. Being an asthmatic doesn't help.

@Browneyesbigbum

some people *@neveradullmoment99* appear to want the schools to close - your comments indicated to a poster before are shocking about their child.... if you are a teacher a vested interest in shutting the schools.

However, facts first. When infection can be tracked and I have illustrated 2 particular ones above - it is possible to see where infections have come from.

Our teachers locally are working brilliantly and keeping the schools running - so pleased that it isn't up to you since you would quite happily sacrifice education.

You have no idea of my circumstances.

So track and trace is the answer - it's a shame our government haven't got our track and trace system organised - it's a shambles

The teachers are working hard to maintain one way systems/mask wearing (which is brilliantly upheld in the main), SD where possible, forward facing teaching, hand washing and segregation of the school into zones for year groups - again working really well. Well done teachers and school staff here

And yet they'll be in poorly ventilated classrooms shoulder to shoulder for the vast majority of the day with no mitigation measures.

How can you say it's working really well if there's low community transmission and there haven't been any cases in the school yet? If there was a case, do you think it would be stopped by the one-way system before the kids got to the packed classroom?

My school hasn't had to send any year groups home yet. That's because of the situation outside of school, not the situation in it. If covid gets in, kids will be sent home. If it isn't transmitted within the school, we'll be very, very lucky. And we're doing everything the school above is doing.

@Bluelinings but the other cases could have been infected elsewhere? Was school the only source? If only we had a good test and track system ...

@Bluelinings

SillyUnMurphy

Yeah sure easy for you to say.

This kind of stuff makes me feel really sorry for teachers

You know who I feel sorry for? The doctors, nurses and care workers who have, from the very beginning, had to deal with the real shit of all this.

This virus is not going anywhere any time soon. Kids need an education and some form of normality. We risk far far greater consequences down the line if the kids are not in school.

We need to stop being so bloody hysterical about this virus. Life has to go on. Essential services have to run and schools are an essential service. Yes there are risks. Yes there are lessons that will be learnt along the way but fundamentally the kids need to be kept in school. Isolating huge numbers of children is not sensible either. They need to make the bubbles smaller or have better understanding of who was in contact with who.

Schools are definitely not the sole source of the increased numbers being seen. Adult to adult spread is the most likely cause. Also is there a real chance that as the kids go back and coughs and colds go round that the tests are actually picking up other Coronaviruses?

@MrsTerryPratchett

And for the love of all that's holy, if you must wear gloves, learn how to put them on and take them off.

The amount of people doing it stupidly...

I know how to don and doff. I wear gloves to stop me touching my face, as a sensory reminder. I sanitizer whilst wearing them too.

So what happened was Gov said - everybody travel abroad on holiday over the summer and then send your kids to school. Bonkers. A lot of cases came from travel, flights, airports etc. In Liverpool the initial cases in schools were all people who had just come back from holiday.

But yes schools opening has almost certainly led to the big increase in cases and it is not nice thinking innocent kids can pass an illness to a parent and possibly end up losing a parent. It does need to be MUCH safer in schools. The precautions promised aren’t materialising. Our 12 year old was arm wrestling at lunch time - classes were mixing at lunch time. We were told there would be social distancing on the bus, in classrooms. But nope all just as it was before. Yes they are in teaching bubbles but 30 kids in one room. I find it quite frightening. Yes their education is important but something much more drastic and well organised needed to be in place first. They built new hospitals in weeks - they should have built new schools in weeks with a lot more space. OP I don’t envy any teacher right now. And yes if all the staff get sick I assume a school would have to close. If it didn’t and they relied on a lot of supply teachers it would be shambolic and education would still go down the tubes - just as some nursing homes became chaotic and full of temporary staff.

Gov isn’t prioritising kids education at all - they just want parents back at work. Now they could have set up brilliant and well structured online learning and paid one parent to stay at home. So it’s all economic.

But gov should be pressurised your make it safer in schools. Weekly testing. Like they do in hospitals and nursing homes. They won’t make thjhgs safer until there is a real tragedy.

Yes they ALL got infected elsewhere in a rural area. Definitely

I agree we need track and trace to work. Schools would be much safe

@neveradullmoment99

I can only go by the things the other poster said you commented on her special needs child and by things you post!

To the other poster - try to ignore what dull said - it's not reflective of what other's think

@HazelE123

So what happened was Gov said - everybody travel abroad on holiday over the summer and then send your kids to school. Bonkers. A lot of cases came from travel, flights, airports etc. In Liverpool the initial cases in schools were all people who had just come back from holiday.

But yes schools opening has almost certainly led to the big increase in cases and it is not nice thinking innocent kids can pass an illness to a parent and possibly end up losing a parent. It does need to be MUCH safer in schools. The precautions promised aren’t materialising. Our 12 year old was arm wrestling at lunch time - classes were mixing at lunch time. We were told there would be social distancing on the bus, in classrooms. But nope all just as it was before. Yes they are in teaching bubbles but 30 kids in one room. I find it quite frightening. Yes their education is important but something much more drastic and well organised needed to be in place first. They built new hospitals in weeks - they should have built new schools in weeks with a lot more space. OP I don’t envy any teacher right now. And yes if all the staff get sick I assume a school would have to close. If it didn’t and they relied on a lot of supply teachers it would be shambolic and education would still go down the tubes - just as some nursing homes became chaotic and full of temporary staff.

Gov isn’t prioritising kids education at all - they just want parents back at work. Now they could have set up brilliant and well structured online learning and paid one parent to stay at home. So it’s all economic.

But gov should be pressurised your make it safer in schools. Weekly testing. Like they do in hospitals and nursing homes. They won’t make thjhgs safer until there is a real tragedy.

Well said and absolutely this.

Most of what we are seeing deaths-wise is he result of interactions in August. Cases look high because we only tested people in hospital in the spring, so numbers now look comparable to then, but the reality is if everyone got a test who needed it in the spring, the number of cases then would have been far higher then than the number now.

I wish people who want schools to close just home school their kids and let everyone get on with it. People need to work and children need interaction and an education. That is why they are open still.

@HazelE123

My point entirely

In Liverpool the initial cases in schools were all people who had just come back from holiday.

It's madness to let people fly all over and then infect others on return!