Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Covid

Mumsnet doesn't verify the qualifications of users. If you have medical concerns, please consult a healthcare professional.

We were doing ok until we opened all the schools....

853 replies

Bbq1 · 22/09/2020 19:56

After lockdown was lifted pre September and pubs, restaurants etc were opened we seemed to have a handle on Covid with cases, hospital admissions and deaths all declining fairly steadily. Since we released millions of school aged children and thousands of teachers etc back into the classroom- boom, cases and consequently deaths, are now growing very rapidly again. It didn't take a rocket scientist to work out that this would happen. I work in a school and I have a 15 year old starting his gcse's so I 100% don't want the schools to close but surely there must be a more workable solution? Couldn't schools be one week, one week off for different bubbles or alternate days? Nobody wants schools to shut but surely in the long term if we don't get something safer in place and just continue sending kids and adults in day after day, then eventually they will close again?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
22
IloveJKRowling · 22/09/2020 22:09

Regardless of whether schools are contributing to current rises, they will cause spread.

You can only open schools without SD, without small class sizes, or masks or all of these things when community levels are very low, and they're not now. Not any more.

Virtually every other country in the world is opening schools in a safer way. e.g. Italy - 4,000 extra staff and using community spaces for SD;

To all those people who want schools open - unless schools are made safer, they will shut because there won't be enough teachers.

It was utter lunacy to open schools this way. Many schools did socially distanced school in June/July - some had all years back. If they gave schools a bit of money, allowed them to use community spaces, they could be so much safer.

The only stumbling block is this government's unwillingness to fund schools to be safe. Write to your MP. Tell them to follow the science - all scientists are saying this way of opening schools is unsafe.

cantkeepawayforever · 22/09/2020 22:10

@Itisasecret

People don’t want schools shut. I love having a full class and I will be devastated if schools close again. My children are in exam years. Boris fired the warning shots tonight, your children’s education is being put at risk by rule breakers.

No, it’s because the testing system has collapsed and teachers and their families are not a priority for testing. Yet despite schools being the 2nd biggest setting linked to outbreaks according to PHE. Second only to care homes who are prioritised for testing alongside the NHS.

Following the guidance, and the lack of testing schools will close because of staff shortages before you even talk about Covid closures. If it wasn’t so obvious it would be quite funny. The idea that adults and teachers don’t want children in school makes me so angry. They won’t have a choice of this shit show continues. NO CHOICE.

So instead of slating school staff who are being put at risk, get a grip, accept schools will be closed if this continues and write to your MP.

This is the point.

Schools are closing partly because of cases - 2nd year group closed at DD's school today and with a case in a further year group, it is likely that all GCSE and A-level years will be closed by the end of the week. In a county with one of the lowest case rates in the country.

However, the question is where these cases are coming from. they are not from child tio child transmission in school yet, but from the community / families into schoolss. What school opening has done has brought about a HUGE change both in terms of mobility and in terms of mindset: 'The children are at school, I can go back to work / meet friends for coffee/ go to my gym class' AND 'The children are mixing in school anyway, so we can do playdates, parties, after school clubs and activities, get together as families'. This change pre-dates school opening by a few weeks, because 'The kids will be in school soon anyway, so why would it be a problem if we meet friends / go out / go on holiday'.

It is those cases that are coming into school now - and yes, they are closing schools quite rapidly, though in a patchy way (some schools badly affected, others untouyched as yet).

But what will close schools earlier is absence of staff. Unless turnaround of tests for staff becomes VERY swift, a teacher with a cough closes a bubble for days, possibly weeks (at the end of last week, it was taking nearly the whole of the isolation period to get a test). So negative teachers can't return to the classroom. This rise in staff with symptoms will be driven further by parents, particularly in primary, dosing their children up or ignoring symptoms because they so desperately need to go into work that they send their children into school ill-but-disguised, rather than even try to isolate or test. A chld not tested is a child who isn't positive, so the illness continues to spread until someone, usually an adult, gets too ill for it to be ignored.....

2X4B523P · 22/09/2020 22:10

@Timeforanotherusername

2X why look somewhere with an agenda when there is official data available?
I always prefer official data where available, unfortunately with regards to the situation in schools this isn’t particularly forthcoming.
SillyUnMurphy · 22/09/2020 22:11

@letsghostdance

Are all the people who are insistent that schools need to stay open at all costs willing to go into schools and actually fulfil all of the jobs needed to be completed by adults in there? Because I feel like that should really be a requirement.

As a teacher in an area of Scotland that's already been locked down for weeks I'm not sorry to say that I don't feel safe to be at work and I would love to be able to work at home like the majority of my friends and family.

If I was a qualified teacher and that was my job then yes I fucking would. I’m going back to work in Central London - travelling on the train and tube - in a couple of weeks (coming in to incredibly close contact with hundreds of people a day) because my employer wants us back at work. If I don’t go back to work I lose my job. Stop the diatribe against schools opening and get on with what you’re paid for.
WalesAppearsToBeSlightlySaner · 22/09/2020 22:11

Anyone who thinks it’s acceptable to keep children 2m away from everyone for any length of time is beyond cruel. Children need to interact and play. Catch up in wales meant children had to stay in a taped box and weren’t even allowed to play outside. Anyone who thinks this is fine shouldn’t be allowed near my child. It’s damaging and wrong.

WalesAppearsToBeSlightlySaner · 22/09/2020 22:12

And I’d be happy to go into dd’s school but they’ve asked us to stay out!

neveradullmoment99 · 22/09/2020 22:13

@CallmeAngelina

No one, least of all teachers, want schools to close. Teaching remotely is a nightmare apart from anything else, and it's preferable for everyone to be back in class. But believe me, schools are (seriously) preparing (behind the scenes) for closures.
I'm ok if they close. I'd rather be safe tbh than have the potential for huge disruption and upset if members of my family were ill. It would be a no-brainer personally.
Gladysthesphinx · 22/09/2020 22:13

Yes, we were doing really well before those nasty schools re-opened. Destroying our children’s education and future prospects. Fantastic. Such a tragedy these selfish young people expect an education.

A society that sacrifices its children - which is what school closures do - doesn’t deserve to survive, and it won’t.

cantkeepawayforever · 22/09/2020 22:14

@WalesAppearsToBeSlightlySaner

Anyone who thinks it’s acceptable to keep children 2m away from everyone for any length of time is beyond cruel. Children need to interact and play. Catch up in wales meant children had to stay in a taped box and weren’t even allowed to play outside. Anyone who thinks this is fine shouldn’t be allowed near my child. It’s damaging and wrong.
So, if distancing is wrong and mask-wearing is wrong and small bubbles [meaning not full time in school, as there is simply not enough space] is wrong, BUT we have an infectious, pandemic virus that will make some adult school employees very ill indeed, what should we do?
IloveJKRowling · 22/09/2020 22:14

Some children would rather stay safe, follow the rules and not infect their parents who could die. Some children find non SD school in the middle of a deadly global pandemic quite stressful.

2m really isn't that far. 1m with masks.

I'm sure the children of ECV parents would rather have alive parents than be touching other children in their class.

Browneyesbigbum · 22/09/2020 22:14

@Bbq1

Rubbish! Many of the outbreaks are linked to adults having parties etc. The Bolton one is linked to a man returning from holiday who didn't isolate as he should have done.... NOT SCHOOLS!

Our area is doing well. One school sent a year group home last week because a PARENT had covid - the child tested from the household negative but child and all contacts of child sent home to isolate just in case - still a week later just the parent has it.

Other schools locally are doing brilliantly. The teachers are working hard to maintain one way systems/mask wearing (which is brilliantly upheld in the main), SD where possible, forward facing teaching, hand washing and segregation of the school into zones for year groups - again working really well. Well done teachers and school staff here

So back to OP it's not the schools locally. Or the local people. I went into Sainsburys with my 13 year old (both wearing masks) and all but one lady was wearing a mask - around 60 - 80 people there. Busy car park - queuing in still, sanitisers used, trolleys wiped down before use. People are observing because we have a large elderly population and we are all working together to do our best.

Sadly some areas of the country appear to be party central, gatherings etc but hey ho blame the kids!

Timeforanotherusername · 22/09/2020 22:15

2X here is the Scottish data.

Its only up to the 15th September.

I've not looked today but when I last looked it showed absence rates were better (so probably less requirement for tests) but cases in schools were increasing (to be expected)

neveradullmoment99 · 22/09/2020 22:16

@SillyUnMurphy with all due respect you can wear a mask. Really you going on the tube is not the same. You could also make other choices about how you travel.

Bluelinings · 22/09/2020 22:16

It’s not the only factor but it is obviously a large driving factor.
1700 schools closed or sent bubbles home already. Compared to about 100 through all of June and July.
Clearly social distancing helps, would mean less bubbles sent home and would slow transmission (as in summer) to lessen risks of a second lockdown.

RaspberrySkies · 22/09/2020 22:16

OMFG shut the bloody pubs!!

neveradullmoment99 · 22/09/2020 22:17

There is no way that you can socially distance in a primary. Ive had children so close to me i can feel them breathe on me. What am i suppose to do? Say step back you germ ridden child?

amitoooldforthisshit · 22/09/2020 22:17

the reason is people are not made to wear masks in open public spaces

2X4B523P · 22/09/2020 22:17

@Gladysthesphinx

Yes, we were doing really well before those nasty schools re-opened. Destroying our children’s education and future prospects. Fantastic. Such a tragedy these selfish young people expect an education.

A society that sacrifices its children - which is what school closures do - doesn’t deserve to survive, and it won’t.

No one is saying the children are to blame, the fault lies with the government in not doing more to make schools safer.
Browneyesbigbum · 22/09/2020 22:17

Exactly

''However, the question is where these cases are coming from. they are not from child tio child transmission in school yet, but from the community / families into schoolss''

Our ONE local case was from a parent that had worked away - returned with it! Not the school.

cantkeepawayforever · 22/09/2020 22:18

@Gladysthesphinx

Yes, we were doing really well before those nasty schools re-opened. Destroying our children’s education and future prospects. Fantastic. Such a tragedy these selfish young people expect an education.

A society that sacrifices its children - which is what school closures do - doesn’t deserve to survive, and it won’t.

Many schools have already re-shut, in whole or in part. Even the official, out of date, figures say that 4% of schools were not fully open up to last Thursday, and that had gone up 4x in a week.

I would anticipate, simply based on anecdotal evidence, that that figure is likely to be over 10% next week, and is likely to double along with the virus doubling into the future.

That's if test and trace is working well, if the problem isn't compounded by lacking enough school staff to stand in front of classes, because they are all isolating and waiting for tests due to symptoms or contact with positive cases.

neveradullmoment99 · 22/09/2020 22:19

@Browneyesbigbum

Exactly

''However, the question is where these cases are coming from. they are not from child tio child transmission in school yet, but from the community / families into schoolss''

Our ONE local case was from a parent that had worked away - returned with it! Not the school.

eh how do we know that? Children can be asymptomatic. We have NO idea who has it and who doesnt!
Bluelinings · 22/09/2020 22:20

SillyUnMurphy

Yeah sure easy for you to say.

This kind of stuff makes me feel really sorry for teachers

Browneyesbigbum · 22/09/2020 22:20

@ithinkiveseenthisfilmbefore

Exactly - why do people insist on blaming the schools? They seem to want to close them.

'I see that university students have been criss-crossing the country for the past few weeks heading off to their new housing, mixing with new people, bringing anything they have with them ... then they're out and about in their new locations, visiting pubs, restaurants, etc
That's more concerning than primary schools being back in. Or secondary schools. Where at least bubbles are in place.'

Timeforanotherusername · 22/09/2020 22:21

@neveradullmoment99

There is no way that you can socially distance in a primary. Ive had children so close to me i can feel them breathe on me. What am i suppose to do? Say step back you germ ridden child?
You are a primary school teacher?

You told me my child had behavioural issues when I said he couldn't be in another room from me completing school work whilst I was working. Occasionally popping my head round the door would be sufficient. He is 5 and has missed most of his 1st year at school.

I've got to say i am shocked!

Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.

This thread is closed and is no longer accepting replies. Click here to start a new thread.