Is the U.K. in danger of becoming a police state?

[Chocolategirl1]

We have now been living with restrictions to our civil liberties for 6 months. The state now has the power to force us to dress in a certain way (face coverings), to restrict our right to family life (no more than 6 in social gatherings), to give up our personal details to retail establishments (contact details to restaurants/pubs), to give up our children’s right to a fair education (continued closures of schools following coronavirus cases), in some cases to give up our right to run a business or work (for example those businesses that can’t run properly due to social distancing etc), and now we have more police powers for enforcement of these rules and apparently “Covid Marshalls” to spy on people and control their behaviour. And there is no definite end point to any of this. None at all. There are vague “hopes” that the state will “try” to return to some kind of normal by a Christmas, but now that’s apparently dependent on regular mass testing - which in itself is a restriction on liberty. My worry is this: now that the state has realised it can control people in this way, will it give up those powers at all? Even if we get a vaccine, will the state actually give us back our freedom like it was before? And what if we never get a vaccine? People may say that all of this is justified by a virus (though a virus that has overall an extremely low fatality rate) but many governments throughout history have taken their citizens’ rights away permanently. How do we know our government won’t do the same?

@Nikori
Victoria state , Australia.

Yes because people are disappearing all the time, free speech is non existent and people are living in fear of their life at the hands of the Government.

This whole Carona nonsense is a lie, pulled off with the cooperation of every country and news source in existence and it's all designed to control our behaviour because .....????

Add in the Hate Crime bill being proposed in Scotland. (Unless today changed things, haven't caught up with news on that tonight).

@ShanghaiDiva

Yes, I did choose to live there and restrictions are much more severe than here and restrictions were also much stricter in handling the pandemic and resulted in lower numbers of infections and deaths. I only moved back to the uk this year and was living in China when the virus started to spread outside Wuhan. As I said, uk has nowhere near the level of control to be classed as a police state.

I'm not sure we can believe the figures that come from China somehow.

And we won't have Brussels to save us, or blame🙃

No. You were already prohibited from murdering someone, but that didn’t make it a “police state”.

Totally agree OP. Since day 1 of lockdown I’ve been appalled and bewildered by people’s bovine acceptance of so many of these illogical and arbitrary rules - and the frightening number of people who are chomping at the bit to enforce them. Every day feels a bit more like I’ve stumbled into a Kafka novel, and I’m increasingly fearful that the ‘new normal’, especially under this corrupt shitshow of a government, effectively means the end of liberal democracy.

Yanbu. I went cold when I heard about covid Marshall's. .feels like this is truly the start of the end & no one is bothered

@TheLastStarfighter

No. You were already prohibited from murdering someone, but that didn’t make it a “police state”.

I don't think not murdering people is what anyone is complaining about tbh

allthings trust me the fist time a Covid marshal tries to school someone in Wakefield it will be their last!

@TrustTheGeneGenie
You are are of course free to believe whatever you wish. I base my view on living there. In my province:
Schools are back and have been for a while.
People went back to work after one month
Testing was very strict
Quarantine measures were strict
The Chinese took a very different approach to the uk: testing and hospital treatment was the initial response rather than the uk response of stay at home. We also wore masks from January and had temp checks everywhere from January. My dh arrived back in China and spent two weeks in a quarantine facility. When he arrived back in the uk he was supposed to self isolate for 2 weeks (which he did) but nobody checked, not even a phone call.

Having lived in an actual police state before, this is very far from one!

I was just saying to DP that where we used to live the Covid 'guidance' would instead have been actual law/ rules that everyone would be expected to adhere to, strictly monitored by the authorities and failure to follow the rules would result in a pretty hefty sanction eg arrest. Absolutely none of that happening here!

No.

@trusttheGenegenie its your right not to vote but to paraphrase someone 'democracy is a rubbish system apart from all the others". I didn't vote this lot in but it is what happened, police state more likely imo by the erosion of democracy by private interests and right-wing media fanning flames of hate = polarisaton disrespect and ignorance. not the virus.

[quote ShanghaiDiva]@TrustTheGeneGenie
You are are of course free to believe whatever you wish. I base my view on living there. In my province:
Schools are back and have been for a while.
People went back to work after one month
Testing was very strict
Quarantine measures were strict
The Chinese took a very different approach to the uk: testing and hospital treatment was the initial response rather than the uk response of stay at home. We also wore masks from January and had temp checks everywhere from January. My dh arrived back in China and spent two weeks in a quarantine facility. When he arrived back in the uk he was supposed to self isolate for 2 weeks (which he did) but nobody checked, not even a phone call.[/quote]
Oh I'm not saying their strategy wasn't a good one, I'm saying I wouldn't trust their data as far as I could throw it.

Do I think their strategy was necessarily humane? No.

[quote stovetopespresso]@trusttheGenegenie its your right not to vote but to paraphrase someone 'democracy is a rubbish system apart from all the others". I didn't vote this lot in but it is what happened, police state more likely imo by the erosion of democracy by private interests and right-wing media fanning flames of hate = polarisaton disrespect and ignorance. not the virus.[/quote]
Oh I agree, the virus is just the opportunity isn't it?

Lol. MN was begging for lockdown, closure of pubs and shops, enforced masks and social restrictions back in March. Now you've decided you're bored if it and it's a "police state"

I dont think they'll get voted in next time @TrustTheGeneGenie and the next lot might do better?

No don't be daft.

yes

@stovetopespresso

I dont think they'll get voted in next time *@TrustTheGeneGenie* and the next lot might do better?

I hope they don't but I'm not sure we can count on anyone doing better! Saying that can't be any worse

grey not me.
All along I’ve been concerned about the erosion of the rule of law.
Ex lawyer so I’ve always got one eye on what the state do supposedly to protect us.

@MintChocAddict

I have mixed feelings about this having had Covid impact on our family, although I'm concerned by the introduction of Covid Marshalls.

I do think there has to be an element of control during a world pandemic and our lockdowns and rules haven't been severe in comparison to other countries
However..... if you've recently watched the Handmaid's tale and remember Serena this photo of Ivanka Trump might give you the shivers

I'm sure that Hollywood is aghast that they portrayed face masks as a tool of oppression in Handmaid's Tale.

They are so on board with masks etc- they have one of the most ridiculous lockdowns in the nation, have to wear masks OUTSIDE, and while the majority of Hollywood flagrantly disregards these measures under cover of privilege (see Nancy Pelosi), they are publicly enthusiastic about them.

The Police state is other people, not government. People reporting each other to the authorities, filming people with disagreeable viewpoints and shaming them on social media. Car drivers have dash cams, cyclists have helmet cams. And don't get me started on smartphones. IMHO, government is the least of our worries.

Well people had a taster of what this government would be like with the proroguing of Parliament last year. And yet people still voted them back in!

Covid is bad enough. But this is a forewarning of how a no deal brexit will go. Totally self inflicted devastating damage.

People don't like to be told though. 🤷🏻‍♀️