Will the new law on social gatherings make you reconsider your activities?

[Redolent]

Yes or no?

Daughters wedding in two weeks
Evening was here ...outside ...simple food....family only
Family travelling from other county ....we can even have them over for a cup of coffee now..never mind dinner ....

There is a difference between ‘guidance’ rules and ‘law’ rules. The guidance was previously stricter than the law. They are changing the law so police can enforce.

If you’ve been sticking to the guidance all along, there’s no need to change your behaviour.

What if all the teachers, health professionals, social care staff and others downed tools and said that they're not going to risk themselves any further when others are not willing to try to minimise the risk to them? It's fucking tempting but of course they won't because they give a shit about other people which is why they're in the job.

This, with bells on. People might think the 'risk budget' concept is a bit management-speak, but it's the fact that people don't understand the basic concept that is causing lots of the problems. Ie 'my kids are back at school anyway, so it doesn't matter what the fuck else I do.'

Problem of "risk budget" is that it assumes the risks are definite, known and best estimate of risks won't change constantly. Lots of people lack the numeracy (or personal self-organisation) skills to manage a 'risk budget'. They will conform better with simple rules instead.

Yes it’s just meant as a way to explain why “But I spent all day with 30 kids and 5 adults, why can’t I go out partying after work” is wrong.

If people behave selfishly & stupidly - people will die. How can you not care about that?

Easy. Because actually over the last few weeks when I've been trying to go about my business, I.e. shopping, I've had nothing but abuse, so no, I really don't care about others outside my family.

People can't have it both ways, where you must care what happens to them, but they can be abusive arseholes. Fuck them.

One thing that is making me really cross is the situation with buses in London.

My DD's school has introduced all sorts of safety measures but then the bus to get home is rammed. My DD says worse that usual, seats roped off so everyone rammed together, windows shut. She said she nearly passed out it was so bad.

What's the point of all these rules when we can't add the resources to get really basic things right?

This, with bells on. People might think the 'risk budget' concept is a bit management-speak, but it's the fact that people don't understand the basic concept that is causing lots of the problems. Ie 'my kids are back at school anyway, so it doesn't matter what the fuck else I do.'

Your example is better than mine.

If it extends to cinemas yes, otherwise no. London Film Festival is next month.

And forget risk budgets. The risk of unventilated buses with kids crammed together like sardines seems to blow everything else out of the water.

There seems to be to be zero point in strictly enforcing a rule that children in two different year groups can't say hello as they aren't in bubbles if ten minutes later one of them will literally end up with their head stuck up another's armpit.

I have a lot to do today but I am starting by drafting an email I can send to my MP, TfL and the headteacher.

For example, in my son's (small) primary school there are two teachers who were previously shielding, one who is pregnant and one who has lost both parents to Covid. They are all still coming in every day to teach, because they care about their work and their pupils. I imagine it's quite a kick in the teeth when half the families in the school spend their weekends completely ignoring the guidance and saying they don't give a toss about Boris's bollocks rules.

Absolutely ridiculous. We are a family of 4 and will continue to meet up with family's of 4 (or even with some families who are 5s - how daring!). It seems especially ridiculous when your kids are at school together anyway?!

The up side is with this number of people planning on flouting it, maybe they can use the fines to support the industries that will be effected by this, like the theatres.

Grapefruits that may be true, but it doesn't change the fact that if those same kids also spend the weekend with their friends from different schools, or their cousins, or their neighbours, then it increases the risk of transmission even further.

@Notfeelinggreattoday

I still thought was inly 6 allowed or 2 households and the thirty was just for weddings etc I think the media kept mentioning the 30 and people thought it was allowed for anything when i don't think that was actually the case

I believe that was the guidance, but not the actual law. They are now adjusting the law to be more in line with the guidance (with more specific exemptions), which many people thought was law anyway.

@primabloodydonna

No one is going to pay the blindest bit of attention and frankly why should they, when we are ordered back to work and school?

I'm carrying on with my life.

As this is going to be backed up by law rather than simply guidance, I suspect we will find the police being told to do much more to enforce it than has been the case in the past. They can't risk following the paths of France and Spain and having numbers continuing to rise with nothing being done to check that process.

@FiddlefigOnTheRoof

There is a difference between ‘guidance’ rules and ‘law’ rules. The guidance was previously stricter than the law. They are changing the law so police can enforce.

If you’ve been sticking to the guidance all along, there’s no need to change your behaviour.

No, the guidance was previously 6 people from multiple households or two households of any size. Which meant my family of 6 could see my mum and dad in our garden. Not any more.

@GrapefruitsAreNotTheOnlyFruit

And forget risk budgets. The risk of unventilated buses with kids crammed together like sardines seems to blow everything else out of the water.

There seems to be to be zero point in strictly enforcing a rule that children in two different year groups can't say hello as they aren't in bubbles if ten minutes later one of them will literally end up with their head stuck up another's armpit.

I have a lot to do today but I am starting by drafting an email I can send to my MP, TfL and the headteacher.

If that is what is happening in your area, the schools have been ignoring the guidance to them. They are supposed to be looking at staggered starting times and indeed talking to bus companies to plan things so that overcrowding on public transport doesn't happen.

Does anyone know if gym classes are affected? Or does it count as a business or a team sport and is ok? I’m hoping the latter as the gym are strict on social distancing.

Yeah, have a big birthday coming up shortly and had arranged a get together for 20 people outside, plus one or two other things that are probably over 6 people. Guess there'll need to be some changes of plan.

Where will the resources come from for the policing of this? Maybe all those police who were ruthlessly and relentlessly checking travellers quarantine in the summer and fining them will now be redeployed to check this instead?

@fifteenisthemagicnumber

We will need to cancel a family event that I personally wasn't comfortable with attending anyway. But, before the change I know I would have been shouted down (it's DH's family, not mine). Now I'll just keep repeating that it's illegal so it definitely can't go ahead.

Same here. I had a panic with DH the other day due to the circumstances of it, woke up to this news today so said I won't be going which will decrease the number by 1

Absolutely ridiculous. We are a family of 4 and will continue to meet up with family's of 4 (or even with some families who are 5s - how daring!). It seems especially ridiculous when your kids are at school together anyway?!

If the children are in the same class at school and play with each other at break time then I agree. But this only works if the parents live in one house while their children live together in another. I assume this is not your domestic setup. If you are visiting another family and all the children are in the same class at school then the adults are the main problem.

@roarfeckingroarr

I'm having a small party in a couple of weeks. Absolutely won't be changing plans for it in light of the most recent random bollocks guidance.

Aren’t you worried that if too many people did this then we’ll get another full lock down?

I’m not trying to be argumentative but it genuinely makes me cross that a small minority think they’re too important for the law to apply to them and putting others at risk.

Hopefully most of your guests will decide not to come.

@Juststopswimming

Where will the resources come from for the policing of this? Maybe all those police who were ruthlessly and relentlessly checking travellers quarantine in the summer and fining them will now be redeployed to check this instead?

What the police were reporting was inappropriate gatherings were reported, they would attend, it'd be 28 people, nothing could be done.

The police were already deployed, but unable to act.

All schools buses have been cancelled at my local secondary school. Pupils have been told to either walk or get a lift! The volume of traffic waiting outside the school will be horrific. I can't wait for all this to end. The financial cost alone on my family has been immense.
If people don't stick to the rules then what is the point?