UK doing ok | Mumsnet

Nellodee · 01/09/2020 07:50

I thought it was the doom mongers who were accused of being gleeful. This could have been a very positive message, but it is incredibly spitefully written.

MarieG10 · 01/09/2020 08:04

There is still time for this to happen here, although now that the gov has better local data, local restrictions may work.

I think the problem is that our young people are getting fed up and it is showing in places, initially with the holidays abroad and now at home.

We have to learn to live with this for the time being. Whilst deaths are low and will probably remain so comparatively as the treatments are now better and a lot of deaths were simply "brought forward" and would have happened from other causes anyway, what we will have is a huge legacy of people who had Covid, some not even knowing and suffering substantial lung damage.

A friend of mine is a doctor and they are seeing people for initially non Covid reasons, X-raying their lungs and seeing awful damage. Most of this is still unseen

On top of this, the NHS is many areas of practice are operating at 50% capacity. The time to deep clean an MRI scanner has now doubled and reduced capacity by 50%. This means rationing scans

housemdwaswrong · 01/09/2020 10:05

R rate in wales currently 1.3 and rising. I don't care much about the politics of the situation between us and other countries.

What I don't understand why you are using people standing at gravesides and having their lives turned upside down as some political point scoring exercise.

Presumably you'll be just as pleased if people here start dying because it proves the lockdown and masks weren't necessary?

What a vile bloody post.

cologne4711 · 01/09/2020 10:46

I don't think it's vile. There's a narrative that you have to buy into that the UK is crap at everything and woe betide you if you don't toe the party line.

We had the care home debacle (although remember, those residents were being discharged to their own homes, and normally we're complaining about bed-blocking). Maybe we locked down too late but we didn't need a stricter lockdown. What is really embarrassing is the fact that we have such an unhealthy population that many have conditions that are preventable and then cause problems if the person catches covid. Why is our population so unhealthy? THAT is the point here.

Pinkmakeupbag · 01/09/2020 11:00

I don't think op intended to be vile.

I agree with the pp there's almost this expectation that we should all say the UK is crap. Even though the truth is it's a wonderful place to live.

Our government made errors, possibly catastrophic ones, but so did other countries governments.

Earlier in the pandemic and even now it's none stop on here about how stupid the UK population is and how we should be more like the rest of Europe, Asia basically anywhere else.

Op is simply pointing out that even with stricter lockdowns and measures other countries are now having rising infections now.

There are people on here who would be overjoyed if we had a second wave so that they could be proved right.

housemdwaswrong · 01/09/2020 11:06

Whatever you think of the handling of the thing is not the point here, some of your points are certainly valid.

The point is the OP comes across as pleased that cases and deaths in Spain are rising, because it proves her opinion. Whatever your view of the handling of the epidemic, I think that's a bad look. You obviously don't each to their own.

'The rise of cases and subsequent deaths in Spain is worrying, it doesn't look like the lockdown and compulsory mask-wearing was as effective as they thought' or similar, is very different from a gloaty
'A lot of people seemed to love the fact our infection rates were so much higher than the rest of Europe.

Not so now! So much for Spain's strict lockdown and mask wearing policy.....it didn't work'.

That's what I was commenting on. FFS people's lives are being destroyed by this spike over there, but that's fine because it proves her right. That's vile.

housemdwaswrong · 01/09/2020 11:08

@pinkmakeupbag Perhaps not. And internet forums are notorious for not being to deliver tone, but that's certainly how it came across to me.

Kaktus · 01/09/2020 11:11

My family are in Spain, they have followed the rules throughout and are now gutted that they’re in lockdown again in their area. A friend’s daughter suffered severe mental health issues after being confined to their one bed flat for months and they’re petrified it’s going to happen again. I feel a lot of empathy for them.
However I do get your point about people in the U.K. for some strange reason liking to think they’re worse than everyone else. All this about ‘no one in other countries complains about masks’ (they do) and ‘everyone in Europe got on with lockdown without complaining (they didn’t).
I’m glad we are currently managing ok. Equally sad that cases have risen in other countries, leading to more heartache and disruption for them. Anxious that ours will follow the same trajectory, but hopeful that they won’t.

Lweji · 01/09/2020 11:15

So much for Spain's strict lockdown and mask wearing policy.....it didn't work!

It did work.
Then they reopened...
And people thought they were safe.

MarshaBradyo · 01/09/2020 11:17

Hard lockdown and then release with all that entails (nightclubs / holidays) appear to be more problematic given what’s happening in Spain.

We are ok atm, fingers crossed the next stage is ok too.

housemdwaswrong · 01/09/2020 11:19

@Kaktus That's tough to go out of lockdown then back in. Thought that here too. I agree with your post 100%. There is a perception that no-one abroad has whinged, when I think the reality is that the leadership was stronger and they had no choice, whereas people here instead of moaning and getting on with it, which is perfectly normal moaned and campaigned and refused.

I was shielding, and the fact that it has only been paused causes me concern. I've only finished a fortnight ago (Wales) and I suspect that we will be put back into shielding if cases continue to rise. 1.3 is high, and schools going back in rural areas, means lots of people from different far spread communities all travelling together and being together all day. Hopefully it will just hit a level then stop there.

Lweji · 01/09/2020 11:21

Also:

A lot of people seemed to love the fact our infection rates were so much higher than the rest of Europe

Unless you were a bit distracted, the UK had some of the worst numbers, alongside, erm, Spain, Italy, Belgium, Sweden...

There's very little of your initial post that's in any way accurate.

Pinkmakeupbag · 01/09/2020 11:21

@Lweji what do you mean by that exactly?

Because it sounds as though you're saying that they shouldn't have reopened. Which I'm sure you don't mean.

Pinkmakeupbag · 01/09/2020 11:24

@Kaktus awful for your family in Spain going back into lockdown. I personally don't think it was right in any way the way they didn't even allow children out for exercise. It was cruel and wouldn't have made any difference.

I'm pretty sure stats have shown that the UK population have been one of the most compliant.

Kaktus · 01/09/2020 11:29

[quote Pinkmakeupbag]@Kaktus awful for your family in Spain going back into lockdown. I personally don't think it was right in any way the way they didn't even allow children out for exercise. It was cruel and wouldn't have made any difference.

I'm pretty sure stats have shown that the UK population have been one of the most compliant.

[/quote]
We were more compliant than the government ever expected (or indeed, desired).

Lweji · 01/09/2020 11:30

I'm disputing the claim by the OP that strict lockdown in Spain didn't work. It did. The problem was when they reopened.

And as I stated, when they reopened, because numbers were low, people thought the danger was over and behaved as it the virus couldn't spread again. As someone else posted, night life resumed, etc.

Reopening without being careful can only lead to an increase in cases.

However, their death rates seem to be low, for now, and assuming they are being reported properly. They weren't a while ago.

housemdwaswrong · 01/09/2020 11:31

@ pinkmakeupbag I wonder where they get these stats from, any ideas? I guess people complying are more likely to self select. I haven't noticed huge amounts of compliance outside of my local area, which makes me wonder where the stats are compiled from. I'll have a google.

Lweji · 01/09/2020 11:32

For people who don't know very well what happened and is happening in Europe, this is a very useful site.
covid19-country-overviews.ecdc.europa.eu/

For the highest risk areas:
www.ecdc.europa.eu/en/cases-2019-ncov-eueea
Scroll down for the map

Kaktus · 01/09/2020 11:33

@housemdwaswrong

@ pinkmakeupbag I wonder where they get these stats from, any ideas? I guess people complying are more likely to self select. I haven't noticed huge amounts of compliance outside of my local area, which makes me wonder where the stats are compiled from. I'll have a google.

In the daily press conferences the level of compliance was discussed a few times (when we were in actual lockdown). Complicate is far harder to gauge now due to many more things being permitted, but when we had stricter measures compliance was extremely high.

Lweji · 01/09/2020 11:35

Larger groups tend to be noticeable for example, even if 90% of the people are complying with safety recommendations.

housemdwaswrong · 01/09/2020 11:39

@Kaktus. Ah okay. Ta. I didn't watch those as watched Welsh government ones now and again - I was shielding so general restrictions weren't hugely relevant.

@lweji. Links look handy. Thanks.

Timeforanotherusername · 01/09/2020 11:40

There was a lot of posts on here from people from other countries saying how much better they were doing and how the UK was so awful.

They were right, the UK was doing awful bit it was said in a gleeful way.

Much like the OP's here.

It's not a competition.

I don't want to hear the term 'proper lockdown' again.

In my opinion, the lockdown is Spain especially was cruel, especially for children. I really really worry about the damage they have done to the mental health of tbe poor kiddies.

I also think the extreme nature of the lockdown may have played a factor in the rise in cases now.

The UK may not have got a lot right but the actual lockdown I think they did. It should have been done a week earlier, but still allowing people time outside was critical.

Pinkmakeupbag · 01/09/2020 11:47

@Timeforanotherusername yep, I agree with that you've said it really well.

But, I can't help thinking about all the people who were calling for us to be more like Spain with the lockdown. That it hasn't meant Spain have overcome the virus. I'm certainly not happy or gleeful about it. It's worrying.

It's more the people calling for us to be completely locked away terrify me and it just confirms that they're as extreme as I believed them to be.

itsgettingweird · 01/09/2020 11:53

I have been critical of handling. There's no denying we could do some things better and no denting other countries are the same.

We aren't the only country who had illegal raves and protests etc despite what MSM would have us believe.

I think some things we really are behind other countries with (education being 1) but I agree that with all the comparisons to Spain and France lockdown and how their cases and deaths were much lower than ours when we started returning to opening up - we have kept better control over our infection rates and despite a rise as we've opened it - so far it's remained under some control.

Sadly France and Spain have had exponential growth again.

annabel85 · 01/09/2020 12:24

@Lweji

So much for Spain's strict lockdown and mask wearing policy.....it didn't work!

It did work.
Then they reopened...
And people thought they were safe.

Spain opened up properly for tourism with the clubs open etc and half of Europe turned up and then they panicked.