Safe to reopen schools

[askmehowiknow]

Article from oxford professor summarising new data that it's safe for children to be in school. Great pre September reading!

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/aug/18/children-covid-19-english-schools-virus-safe-reopening

@ohthegoats yes the smaller groups allowed previous quieter children to excel and previously struggling pupils had so much confidence they came on leaps and bounds. The amount of work covered in the 7 weeks was amazing and their understanding was clear. Our education system is geared up to “babysit” pupils so parents go to work. It’s not geared up with the children as priority. If it was, smaller classes would be the norm, hours would be different and more suited to children’s attention spans and sleep patterns and the curriculum would allow children to be children. The government had and technically still have an opportunity to make a real difference to education-if they wanted to.

[quote Iamnotthe1]@Nellodee

www.gov.uk/government/publications/actions-for-schools-during-the-coronavirus-outbreak/guidance-for-full-opening-schools#section-5-contingency-planning-for-outbreaks[/quote]
The date of this, saying that we have to provide work for isolating children and in case of closure, was 8th of August? Was this here in earlier editions of the guidelines, or did they just put it in AFTER everyone had broke up for the summer?

@Nellodee

Whilst that would be quite like the DfE to pull something like that, it was definitely in before we broke up.

@Oldbagface

I just want to thank *@noblegiraffe* *@ohthegoats* *@Piggywaspushed* and others for consolidating my thoughts on this matter. I really feel for teachers.

It's going to be a nightmare. I think we will definitely deregister.

Good luck. I really feel for the parents and teachers with vulnerable families who are being let down here.

You’ve got another couple of weeks before deciding, who knows there might be another u-turn

Thanks and good luck oldbag with whatever you decide.

Schools went back full time in Scotland, no social distancing between pupils, 2m between staff and pupils. In practice that's impossible, 1000 kids in a small corridor and teachers supposed to greet the class at the door... kids needing help - you have to go over to help them (but apparently its OK if its less than 10 min...)

This is how its currently going in Scotland.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-53833823
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-53835542
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-53840123

Our risk assessment says we must stay at the front of our classroom and not go within 2m of students or other staff. Not really sure how this works in practise, guess I'll find out in September. Some of the things the government have said do sound a bit like they think we do uni style lectures to our classes...

[quote yetmorecomplaining]Schools went back full time in Scotland, no social distancing between pupils, 2m between staff and pupils. In practice that's impossible, 1000 kids in a small corridor and teachers supposed to greet the class at the door... kids needing help - you have to go over to help them (but apparently its OK if its less than 10 min...)

This is how its currently going in Scotland.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-53833823
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-53835542
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-53840123[/quote]
Thank you for sharing. They haven’t been back for long either.

@Flagsfiend
Some of the things the government have said do sound a bit like they think we do uni style lectures to our classes...

Gav - the main who has never been near a classroom other than his own studies decades ago - described it as a "return to traditional teaching."

It is pretty ridiculous. They removed all the chairs from the staffroom.
We have to take our cup home every night.

But we should meet all classes at the door (according to HT, not the LA)
You can't effectively teach if you're not supposed to leave your desk to go over and help pupils... they are not supposed to hand in jotters coz corona... they are all flooding the corridors every hour... they forget the 2m thing so walk right up to your desk... and while we 'can' wear face masks.. its certainly discouraged and often impractical if there are hearing impaired pupils in the class and all the PSAs have been removed from classrooms to supervise corridors and breaktime...

So suuuure they can't say it was transmitted in school, but they sure as hell can't prove it wasn't... and the 'children don't transmit it' has been proven utter bollocks by the reports all over Scotland, not even considering that the 'children' are virtually adults in secondary school anyway.

Schools in Scotland went back last week . School in Dundee closed today due to Covid outbreak.

@noblegiraffe

It’s the penny slowly dropping that the government doesn’t have a Plan B and if schools don’t open and stay open basically it’s going to be shit, isn’t it?

And yet the unions are being painted as militant and unreasonable by the media for asking for a plan B.

I was handed my arse U4T for saying that parents need a Plan B when this goes tits up!

There seem to be lots of cases / closures in Scottish schools now.

www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-53833823

[quote unrulytoenails]There seem to be lots of cases / closures in Scottish schools now.

www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-53833823[/quote]
Surely not? Have they not heard that children don't transmit it and schools have magical anti Covid powers?

Loving the misplaced advert encouraging teaching as a profession. I'm a TA with an autoimmune disorder and asthma and I am bricking myself about returning to school with a full class.
We worked with limited numbers in lockdown and it was nerve wracking

I do think school and bubble closures will lessen over the next few months. As everything settles down and we work out better systems, have better testing etc.

It was a big mistake imo to delay reopening schools until September when we know there will likely be a spike in cases in autumn/winter. Was crazy not to reopen fully in June and get some real experience/data.

It is reassuring the evidence is pointing to the fact this won't be due to schools reopening though. And as the professor says, closing them again should be a last resort.

The government will have to hold its nerve though as the unions will be shouting very loudly for closure as we see community cases rise I have no doubt.

2 things BoJo won't be able to ignore though are the economy (parents needing to work). And how difficult it appears to be to reopen schools! So I can't see it happening ever again. Plus the unions are in an incredibly weak position, press and public not on side, and large rise in unemployment.

I can't believe you are still giving credence to the report. Where is your critical thinking? It is flawed. Stop pretending it isn't, it makes you look a bit simple.

I'm a TA working with vulnerable children. If the teacher stays at the front of the class 2 metres from child where am I supposed to be to support my children? My children have melt downs regularly how can I stay even a metre away. They also need extensive help with their school work I can't do that from a distance.

how difficult it appears to be to reopen schools

1. They never closed

2. They opened to more students in June

3. The only thing stopping them opening primaries to more pupils before the summer as announced by Johnson was the government not realising that to follow their own rules (bubbles of 15, no rotas) they needed double the classrooms and double the teachers. The unions had nothing to do with that mess, it came from the DfE not having any sense, and not running their announcements past anyone who does (see also ‘valid mock result’).

4. The unions aren’t campaigning to keep school closed. There’s no talk of strike action and they haven’t balloted members.

But you know, don’t let the actual facts get in the way of your Daily Mail-fuelled fantasy.

askmehowiknow
I do think school and bubble closures will lessen over the next few months. As everything settles down and we work out better systems, have better testing etc.

Why wait? Can't this be done proactively?

It was a big mistake imo to delay reopening schools until September when we know there will likely be a spike in cases in autumn/winter.

There was no delay.

Was crazy not to reopen fully in June and get some real experience/data.

So stuff the safety of kids, lets get that data, your mask is finally slipping.

It is reassuring the evidence is pointing to the fact this won't be due to schools reopening though. And as the professor says, closing them again should be a last resort.

Blah blah blah. Same shit different day.

The government will have to hold its nerve though as the unions will be shouting very loudly for closure as we see community cases rise I have no doubt.

The unions have never called for schools to remain closed, more of the same shit, different day

2 things BoJo won't be able to ignore though are the economy (parents needing to work).

He isn't ignoring this now, he is ignoring anything that doesn't help the economy.

And how difficult it appears to be to reopen schools!

Why are you saying this? they are opening as (pretty much) normal.

So I can't see it happening ever again.

They may have no choice if teachers are SI or sick

Plus the unions are in an incredibly weak position, press and public not on side, and large rise in unemployment.

You really need to stop blaming the unions for something that isn't their fault.

@askmehowiknow

I do think school and bubble closures will lessen over the next few months. As everything settles down and we work out better systems, have better testing etc.

It was a big mistake imo to delay reopening schools until September when we know there will likely be a spike in cases in autumn/winter. Was crazy not to reopen fully in June and get some real experience/data.

It is reassuring the evidence is pointing to the fact this won't be due to schools reopening though. And as the professor says, closing them again should be a last resort.

The government will have to hold its nerve though as the unions will be shouting very loudly for closure as we see community cases rise I have no doubt.

2 things BoJo won't be able to ignore though are the economy (parents needing to work). And how difficult it appears to be to reopen schools! So I can't see it happening ever again. Plus the unions are in an incredibly weak position, press and public not on side, and large rise in unemployment.

You sound deluded if you believe any of this.

@askmehowiknow

Do you not find things like this very worrying? A school for children with additional needs, including medical needs...6 staff testing positive, within a week of opening?

Dundee (BBC link)

@WhyNotMe40

The year 10 small groups were amazing. In 3 lessons they understood a whole half term of the harder physics topics and that's no exaggeration. It was brilliant.

I remember saying to one member of SLT that we could really transform education in this country if we took this opportunity. A lot of other countries just do secondary school until lunchtime - we could do split shifts, prove how well small groups and independent learning works. We could really have run with it!
Instead we are going to have a chaotic mess which the government will blame on us (despite it being their decision) , and they will somehow get them and their mates to profit from it....

This is my thinking too!

I wonder if the "open as normal at all costs" posters will acknowledge that it would be easier to do this safer if schools had been given extra funding, like in EVERY other country that we are comparable too.
Instead the government had prioritised giving dodgy multi million pound untendered-for contracts to their mates companies.
In every area where there had been "scandal", there have been companies connected to ministers given contracts without tender.
Here's just the latest one:
www.theguardian.com/education/2020/aug/20/firm-linked-to-gove-and-cummings-hired-to-work-with-ofqual-on-a-levels
www.thecanary.co/opinion/2020/08/16/dominic-cummings-blog-reveals-hes-behind-the-a-level-class-war/

@askmehowiknow

I do think school and bubble closures will lessen over the next few months. As everything settles down and we work out better systems, have better testing etc.

It was a big mistake imo to delay reopening schools until September when we know there will likely be a spike in cases in autumn/winter. Was crazy not to reopen fully in June and get some real experience/data.

It is reassuring the evidence is pointing to the fact this won't be due to schools reopening though. And as the professor says, closing them again should be a last resort.

The government will have to hold its nerve though as the unions will be shouting very loudly for closure as we see community cases rise I have no doubt.

2 things BoJo won't be able to ignore though are the economy (parents needing to work). And how difficult it appears to be to reopen schools! So I can't see it happening ever again. Plus the unions are in an incredibly weak position, press and public not on side, and large rise in unemployment.

I think you're deluded.