Oh bollocks, I'm really nervous about my holiday now!

[stopitkenneth]

We're due to head to a French campsite in four weeks (driving all the way). We've cancelled two holidays due to COVID, Malta at Easter and Mellorca now. We decided a couple of weeks ago that we'd try for France as quarantine had lifted and I was able to get comprehensive insurance.
But now I'm really worried about needing to quarantine when we get back!

I know, I know, booking anything now was optimistic and a bit stupid. But we really REALLY want to get away (I'm frontline NHS,I need a bloody holiday). And it's hard to see how rates in France could be worse than what we've got here.

At no point have my workplace says that we shouldn't be booking holidays abroad. So if I do have to quarantine on my return, then I'm hoping they'll either support me to work from home, or I'm happy to take the two weeks unpaid. I'm hoping that because I booked it during the time that there was no quarantine, they can't come down hard on me. But I'm now really worried.
Argh!

The UK officially is testing 200K+ daily compared to Spain's 40K+ daily. Daily Update

Even if we want to nit pick over the differences in how countries count that number, as a country, we are undisputably testing more more than any other European county at present. Once we get the processes/systems in gear, we are extremely efficient (relative to other countries) in gathering data. (Shame that didn't happen at the start but we seem to making up for that at present).

Arguably, since we ate testing at least twice more than any other European country at present and producing daily stats, I would say that our figures are likely to more be accurate than many other countries who are testing in far less numbers officially.

Our R Rate is close enough to 1 in many areas that it's a narrow margin balancing the risk between our health and our economy and to err on the side of caution makes sense.

The more people move around and intermingle, the more the likelihood of increasing the rate of transmission which is what is currently happening with people travelling abroad for their holidays.
Individual responsibility is key - we don't live in a police state. We can't enforce quarantine.

Holidays abroad imo is a luxury, not an essential and we're in the midst of a global pandemic. Yes, it's incovenient/depressing to cancel (which we have done) but it's not hard to connect the dots. Rocket science it isn't.

Anyone who is brave stupid enough to want to go abroad during a pandemic needs to be prepared to get coronavirus, let alone 2 weeks of isolating

But if you apply that logic across the board we can't do anything vaguely normal really can we?

So basically anyone who does anything bar stay at home should be prepared to get Covid according to your logic.

Going to a low risk area abroad is not really much different to going to a low risk area in England, and likely to be better than going to a high risk area in England.

Going to a bar, a restaurant, a supermarket, a shop, a U.K. beach, a national park, a tourist attraction, the gym, etc - all similar (some higher) levels of risk, visiting a low risk place abroad. So far in France I'm seeing way more compliance with masks and anti bac gel is everywhere. I've managed social distancing of 2m (it's only 1m in France) right from the start of our trip to now, the weather is dry and warm to so we've spent way more time outdoors including at restaurants in the evening, and hardly any time in indoor attractions. I've felt safer Covid-wise than I did visiting my first big supermarket in England post lockdown, that's for sure.

We can pretend all we like that it's safer to be in an English town, but unless you're staying home and seeing no one that's not really true in many areas.

My consultant has way more concerns about me returning to school with no SD or protection than he did for me to go on a social distanced holiday with precautions.

Aragog - I agree with you, it feels very safe here in France - unlike my job where I will be expected to mingle with hundreds of other people indoors with little social distancing or PPE....

I agree that is isn't always clear where the most risk is, but anyone who goes abroad does know surely that they may come up against the introduction of a quarantine? Whether it is one they think is needed or not, they know it might happen? I put a question mark there because there was a man on the news who was arriving back at the airport from Spain and he said 'we wouldn't have gone if we'd known'. There was also a woman who said she was very cross with the govt about the quarantine and they needed to 'hurry up and get this vaccination out'. Then the woman who complained there was no 'consistency' re the quarantine....I mean the whole point is to respond to changing stats.

DP siad Sky probably had to interview 100 normal people to find three responses like that....I would like to believe him...

The Spanish are leaving the cities in droves for the islands and the coast for their domestic holidays. (Brits are doing it too domestically). Watch the numbers in the forthcoming days - they are going in one direction. Locals in the most affected areas are asked to stay at home. Just like the last time, they are escaping the cities!

The UK won’t escape the rise in numbers. After all, it’s a quarantine not a lockdown. No border closures and people are still free to travel albeit with restrictions in place. A quarantine will mitigate/slow the rise/flatten the curve. Hopefully, enough people are acting socially responsibly that our April peak won’t be repeated.....until the autumn.

Let’s face it, if the R rate goes above 1 before Sept, it rather kaboshes the start of the school year returning to a socially distanced “normal.”

France counts the number of people tested not the number of tests.
The uk is not offically testing 200,000 a day.

The UK did for example yesterday the uk did 99,000
Of those 43,000 were pillar one and 31,000 were pillar 2 which compares with France so 74,000. France tested 85,000 people. It is possible that somone could have testing two nasal tests .France probably tested more. The UK has certainly vastly improved and its is doing lots of testing and its testing capacity is impressive but you cannot compare accurately the two unless the uk give people tested figures. It could overall be testing more than France but not by much and it is debatable.

@sansou I agree, and then I feel that by allowing foreign travel the government is risking the chance they had to get young people back into education.

But if you apply that logic across the board we can't do anything vaguely normal really can we?

No, we can't really do anything vaguely normal, it is taking some people a very long time to digest this fact. We are in the middle of a pandemic. Normal is not a priority at the moment, keeping people alive is the priority.

aragog and it will go down extremely badly at your school if you have managed to holiday overseas but somehow can't work
Paris is all of places, a bustling packed world city of all places.

squid We are waiting for two weeks to see anyone that has been overseas (so far only the decorator who has been to see his parents). All of our friends are staying at home this summer, so it hasn't been an issue to now. We don't want to take on their risks given we have made hard decisions to minimise our own. It is not judgement but taking care of your own family. By travelling you become high risk.

Can I say we have had the most wonderful week in Cornwall, we saw seals at close range, had beautiful weather, stunning beaches and great restaurants by the sea. We have rebooked for next year, over and above our usual trip to Provence! No one could be more shocked than me that we preferred it - but it was so relaxing and so easy, and I had no idea we had such luxurious options just a few hours drive away.

Can I also add if you are thinking of holidaying in the UK next year, it is almost fully booked in some places.

The UK does not count nose snd throat swabs separately. They are done with the same swab and placed in a single container. However the same person may have recurrent tests and may also have an antibody test at some stage. Do France only count a person if they've been tested 3 times over a few weeks ( or months) ?

Thats good to know @ cathy i understood this was sometimes the case. I cant see the problem with a person having more than one test and being counted either in the Uk or in France. I presume you may have a test going into hosptial or before and then on discharge, and also some healthcare workers having multiple tests ( both in the uk and france) . The problem I have is when people say the uk is doing much, much more testing than other countries when they are not comparing the same thing. Number of tests versus number of people.

I do think the uk has a lot of testing now for sure. But i still dont know how many people are tested daily.

I think particularly In the earlier days they were doing swabs/ saliva tests/ another swab - presumably trying to confirm a diagnosis when there are lots of false negatives. I'm sure that does still happen but as there are fewer admissions it's less of an issue.

I don't understand the need to travel abroad (for holiday) in the middle of a global pandemic.

We cancelled our holiday to England and even one within my own country and are waiting it out until the world is a little more safe. We have family in the UK but still aren't going even though they are missed deeply.

Honestly travelling right now is incredibly selfish.

@madbirdlady22

squid We are waiting for two weeks to see anyone that has been overseas (so far only the decorator who has been to see his parents). All of our friends are staying at home this summer, so it hasn't been an issue to now. We don't want to take on their risks given we have made hard decisions to minimise our own. It is not judgement but taking care of your own family. By travelling you become high risk.

Can I say we have had the most wonderful week in Cornwall, we saw seals at close range, had beautiful weather, stunning beaches and great restaurants by the sea. We have rebooked for next year, over and above our usual trip to Provence! No one could be more shocked than me that we preferred it - but it was so relaxing and so easy, and I had no idea we had such luxurious options just a few hours drive away.

Can I also add if you are thinking of holidaying in the UK next year, it is almost fully booked in some places.

Yes I know how lovely Cornwall is, I have visited many times and was there last year. I also know it’s a PIA to drive to from where we live - lots of A roads which aren’t great for travel sickness. The roads in France to where we are staying are straighter, quieter and faster, no traffic jams and no travel sickness makes for a much more pleasant journey. If people don’t want to see us for two weeks after we get back that’s fine. Although as Cornwall has one of the highest r rates in the UK now I guess you may find the same thing?

I guess for avoidance of risk i probably should also not see my friend who is a nurse, or my other friend who works in a shop....

People holidaying to Cornwall are being incredibly selfish, we did have very low rates of infection but because of people like Madlady that is changing.
We are in a Pandemic (no need to add global) stay at home ffs.

KingFredsTache
Why not? The tunnel remained opened during the last lockdown didn't it? Or didn't it, I don't know!

Sorry, I wasn’t clear. Didn’t mean the tunnel would be closed (though I think it was only open to essential vehicles such as freight for a period at the height, others were turned back) but rather that you may not be able to get to it, if you got caught up in a local lockdown. Not a risk we could take.

People holidaying to Cornwall are being incredibly selfish, we did have very low rates of infection but because of people like Madlady that is changing.
We are in a Pandemic (no need to add global) stay at home ffs.

We're not going away at all this year. The more people travel (within the UK or abroad), the more the virus can be transmitted and spread.

But I'm also avoiding crowded places near home and generally try to social distance in day to day life.

Yes it's not ideal but I feel it's a sacrifice worth making to keep as many people as possible safe from catching the virus.

Sorry, I wasn’t clear. Didn’t mean the tunnel would be closed (though I think it was only open to essential vehicles such as freight for a period at the height, others were turned back) but rather that you may not be able to get to it, if you got caught up in a local lockdown. Not a risk we could take.

I don't think British people in France weren't allowed to leave the country were they? The problem with the ski resorts in March was because the resorts shut overnight and people who had just arrived for a weeks skiing had nowhere to stay and were having to rearrange flights to get home etc, it wasn't that they weren't allowed to leave the country, or not allowed to travel to the airport? And obviously in places like Tenerife, it was that individual AI hotels had locked down because so they couldn't leave the actual hotel.

I think even at the height of lockdown Brits who were in France would have been able to leave via the tunnel, they weren't turning away people trying to leave with a British passport were they?

I guess it depends what kind of accommodation etc you are staying in too. Big hotel as opposed to self catering house etc. But probably the worst that would happen with France at least is that you would have to pack up quickly and head for Calais, with a reservation for the tunnel! You could get caught up in a local lockdown anywhere in this country as easily couldn't you if they weren't actually letting you drive home?

Governments may well ban hotels, campsites and the likes of Airbnb from having guests, like in the previous lockdown.

But if they did that they'd have to let people go home - they couldn't make them leave their accommodation and then ban them from leaving the area.

How does a “frontline nhs worker” “work from home”.

As for travellling, I think people must do what makes them and their family feel safe ...both mentally and physically.

*People holidaying to Cornwall are being incredibly selfish, we did have very low rates of infection but because of people like Madlady that is changing.
We are in a Pandemic (no need to add global) stay at home ffs
*
Oh sod off, your precious Cornwall and it's businesses need tourists to survive the summer, hope you realise that.

Can't stand these territorial parochial posts.

Oh and the "stay at home" message has very much been replaced with "go out and spend money". Maybe you haven't been keeping up to date.