Boris announcement- November. Does he know something?

[Yetiyoga]

Not sure if this has been suggested. We are supposed to find out next week about how successful the Oxford vaccine has gone aren't we? Do you think Boris Johnson knows the result and that is why he thinks we could be back to normal by November / Christmas? Or am I being naive/ too optimistic?
I just can't see 'normal' by Christmas as things are currently. And I'm fairly relaxed about it all.
I have a first niece / nephew due late October so it would mean the world to be able to meet them this year.

Johnson and the government made massive mistakes. The main one being locking down too late and only when Macron told him to. If they had locked down earlier then many of the other mistakes would not have been so startling.

Essentially the key factors or issues are possibly distilled to:

personal health versus economic health

science versus politics

human rights versus privacy entitlements

Covid smart versus Covidiots

Petrified versus fearless

Any other factors to throw into the political leadership mix?

Just been announced that there will be more deaths from the lockdown
Suicides due to loss of jobs etc depression
Delayed treatments

So he is damned if he does damned if he doesn't I personally like Boris and understand why people don't but let people have their own opinions and don't argue

ResIpsaLoquiturInterAlia
Boris Johnson is the most dangerous Prime Minister the UK has had, journalist claims | LBC

The edited clip appears to be all about Brexit.
Just to point out that the journalist, Yasmin Alibhai-Brown, describes herself as a "lefty liberal" elsewhere.

Equally I worry about posters who think;
Johnson makes this country a laughing stock

Are you suggesting Johnson is a statesman of international repute?

Why does this thread exist? because Bojo said he hopes that CV will be over and done by Xmas... there is not a scientist on the planet that thinks this, he is an idiot.

YetiYoga
The education secretary, Gavin Williamson, told BBC Breakfast that vaccine development was "an incredibly long process and we are doing it at breakneck speed" but that we should expect a Covid 19 vaccine "after winter".
I read that to refer to any Covid vaccine. I would be overjoyed if they do manage it earlier but it would be nothing short of miraculous as they can’t radically shorten the period of testing to see if a vaccine works (& the effect over time). After all we still haven’t eradicated things like head lice! Flu is a yearly killer despite vaccination programs, there isn’t going to be an immediate fix to this. Great to hear progress on effective treatments too - medics and scientists globally are working so hard to combat this disease.

Clavinova you really are a one trick pony! To show your support of Johnson why don’t you point out this Government’s successes in the pandemic? We understand other countries will also experience difficulties responding to a pandemic. Criticising Labour statements is not the same as saying what you feel this Government is doing well.

During the Labour govt, I got irritated when Labour supporters would sometimes fend off criticism by talking about what Thatcher did.

However, at least she & Major were in power for 18 years

• dimwit Corbyn never even got into power !

Tories must be desperate to deflect criticism by continually bringing up the Corbyn squirrel

@Clavinova

Thanks for pointing that out now noted!

Well at least we have lovely Covid and hard WTO Brexit to "enjoy"!

I don't know much about Boris as only met him very few times in recent years. Seems superficially a nice bloke charming sort. PR suavy and intelligent as well as playing the likeable clown character when it suits him. Went to all the "right" places, Eaton, PPE and Bullingham supper club Oxon etc etc and obviously from the Johnson clan dynasty although dad and siblings take opposing Brexit views, Overall as a person he is a somewhat cheeky chappie (a change from old head mistress May who listens to no one and resolutely stubborn) while love him or hate him Bojo managed to get the Red Wall bums on parliamentary seats as well as getting Covid and evidently dependent not so much as the smart scientific community but a certain Cummings and Goings. He is basically damn if he does and damn if he doesn't and as well all see - Brits (minority) don't take instructions despite the free bail out and furlough monies which our children will pay for instead of our pensions! The new labour leader looks like potential though as finally an opposition leader that is credible even from a neutral political viewpoint.

Still a Covid mess but I guess it's all globally relative and no leader can claim the top of class honours but we should try harder and aim for a better Covid and economic outcome if not mission possible.

Are you suggesting Johnson is a statesman of international repute?

Oct 2019 -
"A smiling Boris Johnson was being feted by nearly all the European leaders today"

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7585601/Body-language-expert-JUDI-JAMES-signals-given-Boris-Johnson-EU-friends.html

“He may be colourful sometimes but we all are at times,” said Macron.“ He’s a character, but he’s a leader with a real strategic vision.Those who didn’t take him seriously were wrong.”

uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-johnson-insight/if-anyone-can-do-it-its-him-how-boris-won-a-brexit-deal-idUKKBN1X019D

Why does this thread exist? because Bojo said he hopes that CV will be over and done by Xmas

What he actually said;

"It is my strong and sincere hope that we will be able to review the outstanding restrictions and allow a more significant return to normality from November at the earliest - possibly in time for Christmas,"

"At a news conference at Downing Street, the prime minister said the plan "remains conditional" on continued progress in controlling the virus and preventing a second wave of infections that could overwhelm the NHS."

"Mr Johnson added he was "hoping for the best and planning for the worst"."

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-53441912

@DebLou47

Just been announced that there will be more deaths from the lockdown Suicides due to loss of jobs etc depression Delayed treatments

So he is damned if he does damned if he doesn't I personally like Boris and understand why people don't but let people have their own opinions and don't argue

Absolutely this. I've come close to attempting suicide on several occasions because of this lockdown, I'm desperate for normality back.

DebLou47 So he is damned if he does damned if he doesn't I personally like Boris and understand why people don't but let people have their own opinions and don't argue

I completely agree that he has a job no one in their right mind would want! However it is his responsibility now.

The issue for me is not about likeability but about trust. How can we trust him after he backed Covidiot Cummings and we now find out the Government didn’t enact SAGE’s advice to lockdown on 16th March until 23rd when they told us they were following the science.

That with his backstory of lies that have caused him to be sacked (more than once) and his lies to his family (multiple affairs).

Do you like him AND trust him?

They've now edited the BBC news story I linked before to say:

Boris Johnson said: "Obviously I'm hopeful, I've got my fingers crossed, but to say I'm 100% confident we'll get a vaccine this year, or indeed next year, is alas just an exaggeration. "We're not there yet."

Glad to hear straight talking from Johnson on vaccines. I'm sorry it dashes peoples hopes but will allow people to focus on practical changes we can make to reduce the disease this Autumn (and not import lots of cases again).

Can't I just say I like him without someone posting their opinion jeez I LIKE BORIS ok

@DebLou47

Just been announced that there will be more deaths from the lockdown Suicides due to loss of jobs etc depression Delayed treatments

So he is damned if he does damned if he doesn't I personally like Boris and understand why people don't but let people have their own opinions and don't argue

I suggested you and I would have to agree to disagree about Johnson but I think a general request of don't argue is going to fall on deaf ears! People have always and will always argue about politics. It is too important not to.

Plus, there would have been fewer covid deaths AND fewer non covid deaths if the government had handled it well and listened to their advisors.

we now find out the Government didn’t enact SAGE’s advice to lockdown on 16th March until 23rd when they told us they were following the science.

"Sir Patrick insisted the experts realised "we were further ahead in the epidemic than had been thought" in mid-March as soon as the data was available."

"He said SAGE's modelling sub-group saw at that point that the number of days over which COVID-19 cases were doubling had gone down to three."

"That's when the advice that SAGE issued was the remainder of the [lockdown] measures should be introduced as soon as possible," he said."

"That advice, I think, was given on the 18th of March or the 16th of March."

"Full lockdown measures were not imposed in the UK until 23 March."

It's all a bit hazy on the dates from the scientists;

"the remainder of the [lockdown] measures should be introduced as soon as possible" - advised on the 18th March, or perhaps it was the 16th March, is not the same as SAGE advising the government to lockdown on the 16th March - presumably the government would need at least a few days' notice;

news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-sage-urged-govt-to-lockdown-a-week-earlier-uks-chief-scientific-adviser-says-12029956

DebLou47 - Can't I just say I like him without someone posting their opinion jeez I LIKE BORIS ok

You are not alone there must be plenty of other people who like Boris too. I am genuinely curious what it is you like about him - do you mean personality or as a politician or both? The separate issue was do you trust him as PM?

You'd have thought that by March, lockdown was thought a very serious possibility/planned for and would need no notice, certainly not a week.
Other scientists on SAGE wanted an earlier lockdown but were ignored, this was reported on File on Four - R4

As to Johnson making the UK a laughing stock, it happened even earlier than i thought.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-36790977

Washington Post It reminds its readers that just two months ago, "a poem he concocted about Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan having sexual congress with a goat won the first-place prize in a contest sponsored by Spectator magazine."

jasjas1973
You'd have thought that by March, lockdown was thought a very serious possibility/planned for and would need no notice

I expect business/employers, head teachers etc. would disagree with you on the lack of notice - no doubt you already had 6 months worth of baked beans and toilet rolls under your bed because of Brexit.

Agree they should have locked down earlier, but even better would have been if from much earlier Boris and co had anticipated and planned for virus elimination, which might have avoided lockdown completely. We might at this stage have had very few covid deaths and no upcoming recession.

But they watched what was happening in Italy and Spain and closed no borders, allowed massive events to take place, and stopped track and trace. Weird kind of exceptionalism. Or laziness, or fear of disrupting business, but look how much worse it has been .

And bragged about shaking hands with coronavirus patients. Cartoon relates to what is going on now but is pretty apt.

Clavinova - still deflecting away come on I'm sure you can muster up a comment about this Government's successes in the pandemic.

The Government had more than a week to know lockdown was on the cards! This is what Helen Ward professor of public health at Imperial College London had to say about the timeframe in Government response in March:

But while scientists carry out observations and experiments, testing, iterating and discovering new knowledge, it is the role of policymakers to act on the best available evidence. In the context of a rapidly growing threat, that means listening to experts with experience of responding to previous epidemics.

When I say that politicians “refused to listen”, I am referring to the advice and recommendations coming from the World Health Organization, from China and from Italy. The WHO advice, based on decades of experience and widely accepted by public health leaders and scientists around the world was clear – use every possible tool to suppress transmission. That meant testing and isolating cases, tracing and quarantining contacts, and ramping up hygiene efforts....

...That day, 12 March, after hearing with disbelief the government announcement that didn’t include widespread social distancing, I recommended to my team at Imperial that they should work from home for the foreseeable future...Neither the advice nor the science were followed that week.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/apr/15/uk-government-coronavirus-science-who-advice

So the Government delayed on social distancing even before dallying further over lockdown. Anyone watching the news in Europe could see what was heading our way!

Clavinova

General Lockdown didn't come with advance notice, Johnson announced it on the 23rd and it took effect that evening.

Don't like baked beans.

Carrie Symonds had her baby shower at Chequers (and hosted by Boris) 2 days before the lockdown announcement 🤔

General Lockdown didn't come with advance notice, Johnson announced it on the 23rd and it took effect that evening.

We knew lockdown was imminent by the 23rd - schools were given 2 days notice of closure I think on the 18th March.

Carrie Symonds had her baby shower at Chequers (and hosted by Boris) 2 days before the lockdown announcement

"The [baby shower] party is understood to have been held on 14th March - around a month before the baby's birth"

The WHO advice, based on decades of experience and widely accepted by public health leaders and scientists around the world

7th April;
"WHO says there is no need for healthy people to wear face masks, days after the CDC told all Americans to cover their faces."

Clavinova - still deflecting away come on I'm sure you can muster up a comment about this Government's successes in the pandemic.

I thought the daily briefings were good, I was very impressed by Rishi Sunak...

Abitannoying
even better would have been if from much earlier Boris and co had anticipated and planned for virus elimination, which might have avoided lockdown completely. We might at this stage have had very few covid deaths and no upcoming recession.

Seems unrealistic for such a densely populated country with high immigration, some of the busiest airports in the world and a few sticking points on privacy and human rights.

My employer advised on 17th March that we were welcome to work from home with immediate effect. A week before official lockdown. Don't know what Johnson was thinking.