Am I OTT or do other people just not care?!

[Lou0808]

Tonight on social media, I've seen several posts from "friends" (and by friends I mean Facebook friends, people from school who I've not actually seen or spoken to in a long time) who are having parties with absolutely zero social distancing.

One particular person has posted videos of people in her house, easily 20 people.
All doing karaoke, drinking shots, dancing.

Another post from a separate person is a picture being in a pub hugging three girls captioned "missed my besties"

A work colleague posted a picture of her young niece saying she's staying over at her house, again hugging her.

I don't mean to sound like the "fun" police. I know we've all desperately missed our friends and families, but the situation is never going to improve unless we follow the guidelines.

I have a 4 month old DD and I've love nothing more than for her to have a cuddle with my mum and her other grandparents, but I just wouldn't allow it.

I desperately miss my friends, I'd love to have them over and hug them, but I wouldn't do it.

Am I being over the top? Am I right for feeling pissed off at people just not following the rules?

I just feel like it's going to drag things out even longer if people just do as they please 😔

@EnlightenedOwl

I'm sorry I don't get why we have to lose our jobs, freedoms for something restricted to elderly people and certain groups

If the virus spreads widely it will affect you. It will affect everyone. It's not just about being ill with covid itself (or not). If infection rates go up all sorts of things are affected. Local businesses will suffer because people won't want to go out (this happened before lockdown too); non-covid nhs treatment will be affected because hospitals will fill up with covid patients; school classes will be sent home regularly to self-isolate. Many many things that have tentatively reopened recently will have to shut again.

The most vulnerable people health wise are more at risk of dying, but thinking that people who aren't at risk of dying won't still suffer badly if covid rates go up again is a serious mistake.

I’m with you OP, we are still effectively in lockdown - walks or bi-weekly shopping only. The gov stats are misleading and there is a lot more cases than people realise. We think we have both had it - something nasty in March and lungs still aren’t right now - but we are being sensible. Haven’t seen anyone socially since March, hoping to meet with two friends SD in a park but only if can do so without public transport.
I think a lot of people are naive or don’t follow the news, or they have a higher risk appetite. I’m seeing it as a personal choice and maybe a little bit of Darwinism at work

^there are

People losing their homes, jobs, businesses. Hospitals canceling appointments, cancer treatment etc. The economy ruined. Kids not going to school. Suicides. Domestic abuse. Kids living in shit holes with shitty parents who don't feed them properly etc

Did you care about kids living in shit holes with shitting parents pre-lockdown? What did you do to help that then and what are you doing now? Ditto suicides and domestic abuse. You realise that had we not locked down, thousands more would have ended up in hospital with covid and all appointments, cancer treatments etc would have been cancelled anyway? There was no winning with that one.

Kids will catch up at school. But I agree, the economy is ruined, I'll give you that. Although of course, Brexit would have given us a run for our money anyway so even the economy argument doesn't totally hold water.

I agree, OP. The localised lockdowns happening the world over show us that this is far from over. I am socialising with friends individually but at a distance and we are still staying home as much as possible. We will continue to do so although once schools open, it'll be a free for all.

@ResumetonormalASAP

People like you would have the country lockdowned until there is not one single case of the virus in 67 million people - seriously do your own thing and stop looking at facebook and moaning about others*

And people like you will have the country right back to square one as you'd clearly rather do your own thing than that which is being advised!!

I'm not suggesting a permanent lockdown.
I want normality as much as anyone else, but there's a difference between having drinks whilst social distancing and just having large gatherings in your house with as many people as you can cram in!!

If you break the rules in any way then you don't care about people dying...

3 months of total lockdown. No playgrounds open until yesterday, kids off school, people going out of their mind with boredom, anxiety, mental health issues and poverty.

I've got 2 disabled children. Before lockdown I was going to an emotional first aid course due to PTSD after both my children almost lost their lives in 2 separate incidences in the same week last year. How I've coped through lockdown is something of a miracle tbh.

It's my youngest child's birthday next weekend and she has 7 children coming for a garden party. My numbers are over although it's only 5 families total. It will be as normal as possible. I can't wait!

The virus isn’t as serious as first believed anyway. We should get back to normal now. The quality of life during lockdown is far worse for most than the virus itself. I think some people just love to look down on others. Probably the same people who were the brown noses at school and snitched on everybody else

@Lou0808

You are judging her OP. Several times you have said that in your opinion your MIL was 'pretty irresponsible'. As you do again just above.
...just because she isn't overrun with virus fear as you are and making her own choices for her life.

Just stay inside and do what you think is right for you, your husband and child and stop moaning about others who are returning to some form of life. Stay inside forever if you want to and lucky if you can afford to but others NEED to work to live. The pubs/restaurants/libraries/zoos/hairdressers etc need to get going again - they have lots of measures in place to reduce the chance of transmission.

We have had months of this now and more and more is known, and more and more we realise that the fear generated was ridiculous and that the vat majority of people are not going to die. We are also aware that lots of people who were dying anyway have died WITH covid and not from it but are included in the figures anyway.

The fit and fearful are still shrieking about anybody that appears to need to work or go out and like you judge constantly. Just sit and home and judge and perhaps either hide your 'friends' on social media or unfriend them - dreadful people they are, doing things that they are allowed to do!

I’m with Bustergonad and do think you are being rather OTT.

I’ve just been made redundant myself, although the reasons for the redundancy were not related to the Coronavirus pandemic.

I have supported lockdown and have largely played by the rules, but trying to find more work in a tanked economy where nothing is certain anymore and you are worried about ending up with no income is extremely challenging.

That plus having very frail elderly parents who live three hours drive away, have ended up having paramedics out and going to hospital several times. It challenges your perspective on “the guidelines” I do assure you. Mine have just about made it through lockdown, and I will visit them and stay in a local hotel in about three weeks, if it remains reliably open and I can get a booking (they can’t cope with additional people staying in their house).

At one point I wondered whether I would ever see them alive again and seriously considered just abandoning any pretence at lockdown. After all, Dominic Cummings did, and Bozo defended him by saying people should follow their instincts. I didn’t though, and hope I am not going to live to regret that.

We have to learn to live with this thing. We can’t count on a vaccine being available anytime soon, if at all. However, we can’t continue as we are for very much longer as it is just unsustainable. Economies and people’s lives are in tatters.

I’m a fairly natural social distanced as I am not particularly tactile except with very close family. I do want to see my parents though.

If other people are having parties I really couldn’t give a shit. I have many other things to worry about.

I'm sorry I don't get why we have to lose our jobs, freedoms for something restricted to elderly people and certain groups

Because elderly people are a part of our society and have a right to enjoy their twilight years just as much as anyone else has? And where covid is concerned, we seem to be defining elderly as anything other 50. That is no age to be saying 'well, fuck it, they've led a good life they can die now'. I am 50 this year. I have an 11 year old. He doesn't deserve to be worrying about whether his mother is going to die and he sure as hell doesn't deserve to lose me.

As for 'certain other groups'....you mean people with asthma, type 1 diabetes and other autoimmune conditions that people get through no fault of their own and which, on the whole, the majority of people who have them are able to live full, useful lives and die around the same age as anyone else? Or people with type A blood? Or people from BME communities?

How many people do you know in this situation? Are you OK to take no extra precautions and therefore accept that their deaths are nothing other than collateral damage so you can have all your freedoms?

This

If the virus spreads widely it will affect you. It will affect everyone. It's not just about being ill with covid itself (or not). If infection rates go up all sorts of things are affected. Local businesses will suffer because people won't want to go out (this happened before lockdown too); non-covid nhs treatment will be affected because hospitals will fill up with covid patients; school classes will be sent home regularly to self-isolate. Many many things that have tentatively reopened recently will have to shut again.

The virus hasn't changed although we are hopefully learning how to treat it more successfully. What is worse than we first thought are the long-term effects on people (in their 40s, 50s) who end up being hospitalised.

Don't judge. Make your own risk assessment and act accordingly.

I think people are forgetting just how many people haven't yet had this virus, and how bad the effects are of lots of people having it at once. We can't just assess it on an individual level for that reason.

A car crash at 20mph has a low risk of death or serious injury but that doesn't mean as a society we could cope with lots happening at once, if there was a pandemic of them. Mechanics and garages and tow trucks would be constantly overwhelmed. All sorts of roads would be temporarily blocked. People would be late for work. Minor injuries would need treatment. Luckily car crashes at 20mph aren't infectious!

The fact that catching covid 19 is not very dangerous for most people doesn't stop it being dangerous to our economy, health service, education and so on, if people are careless and don't bother to follow the guidelines, and infection rates go up again.

Calling people entitled because they are putting money back into the economy and going out as they are 'allowed' to do so

The guidelines don't say you can have 20 people round your house and squash them all into your living room, though, do they? You can put plenty of money back into the economy without doing that.

@Mistymonday you know we are waaaay past the point if walks only and locking ourselves in our houses and not seeing anyone? There is very little, if any, risk seeing people SD outside. Some areas of the uk have bare any cases, so the chances of catching it in some places are literally 1 in a million. You are more likely to die in an accident in the car on the way to morrisons than to catch covid in many places. Staying inside while everyone else starts to see their family isnt darwinism, its unnecessary fear.

Nicely put eeeyoresmiles. I like that analogy.

@Lou0808

Oh dear calm down and stop making things up!

And people like you will have the country right back to square one as you'd clearly rather do your own thing than that which is being advised!! - I am following the rules and not shrieking at others.

I want normality as much as anyone else, but there's a difference between having drinks whilst social distancing and just having large gatherings in your house with as many people as you can cram in!!

I am not having large gatherings and cramming people into my house where on earth did you get that ridiculous idea! Unlike you I'm not a dram queen and have had family over as per the bubble rules, and guess what my mum hugged my child - shock horror - we are all being careful.

Now stop making things up and assuming other things and calm down and perhaps stop looking at what your friends are doing on social media and judging them.

The whole reason we locked down in the first place was to protect the health service. I work in the NHS and in our Trust services are back up and running and the ICU is full of non covid and trauma as it was before.

If we have a second wave now it would be disastrous as the beds that were emptied before are not empty now. So you will see scenes like we saw in Italy. It would mean cancer ops are cancelled, people over 65 would not get ICU treatment etc. So it’s great for the economy but the NHS is in a very precarious situation if we get a huge upsurge in numbers

I think a fine balance is needed. I’m quite happy for shops to open and hairdressers etc. Even restaurants and cafe’s as they can socialy distance but socially distancing in pubs isn’t going to happen. I don’t agree with pubs opening

I think people who want to go back to some sort of normal and for the vulnerable to lock themselves away, haven't really thought it through.

If people ignore the advice now, it just means more of them will catch cv19. They risk their loved ones’ lives and health if not their own.
If there is no vaccine soon, I guess we will achieve herd immunity sooner, so maybe that is positive.
If there is a vaccine soon, it means they are risking people’s lives for nothing.

Each of us has to judge what we will risk. if someone is under 20 with no older or vulnerable relatives or friends, they can afford to party.

@ResumetonormalASAP

The fit and fearful are still shrieking about anybody that appears to need to work or go out and like you judge constantly. Just sit and home and judge and perhaps either hide your 'friends' on social media or unfriend them - dreadful people they are, doing things that they are allowed to do!

You have clearly missed the point of my post.
It isn't about what people are allowed to do.

My point is there are people who are doing things they aren't allowed to do and that has the potential to affect us all.

If the virus were to spread rapidly, more people would need hospital care, local lockdowns could happen, business would have to close, that affects us ALL.
NOT just the people who are having large gatherings!!

@Orangeblossom78

Why don't people try and support the vulnerable rather than judge and criticise others if they want to do something useful?

Maybe that would be a better use of time, perhaps. I'm helping an 80 something lady get her shopping in. We need to support people who are vulnerable rather than preaching on at the healthy people going out.

You know how you can support the vulnerable? By following the rules so that we avoid going back into lockdown.

Those of us shielding are just being allowed to have a tiny bit of freedom - a walk once a day and now limited contact in an outside space as of 6th July. The shielded in Leicester though have got full shielding back in place because some idiots decided the rules didn't apply to them and caused a second outbreak.

People on MN keep demanding where the second wave is as a result of the protests and beach goers - yet Leicester is back in full lockdown, s few other cities are causing concern and the R rate has now gone above 1 in London. It's precarious now. A second peak was never going to happen just a couple of weeks after these events. It will take a couple of "generations" for a noticeable increase to be observed, meanwhile the virus is quietly spreading.

It's just utter selfishness frankly. You are all starting to get much more freedom. Why not treat it with respect - social distance, wear masks, keep to the guidelines, then you can have much more freedom and the rest of us can enjoy the tiny freedoms that we're gradually getting.

All I'm seeing is " you don't know how hard it is for us mentally" - yeah, and you have been able to go out throughout, have been able to go to shops, have been to meet up outside for a while now and can now go to pubs and restaurants. How hard do you think it's been for those of us shielding? We still can't go to even one shop or into a friend's house, let alone all that the rest of you can do. How hard do you think that is? Yet, many are determined now to push the limits which no doubt will mean some of us will be pushed back into shielding. Obviously we don't matter though do we?

People who want the vulnerable to shield, so they can do the fuck they like, should talk to my neighbours.

Both late 40s, both got CV (tested not assumed) one off work for 5 weeks but has CFS, the other still off 3 months later, coughing, severe fatigue, neither hospitalised, so classed as a mild version of CV.

This is a horrible disease, capable of flooring anyone and an economy will not function so long as CV is widespread.

I'm sorry I don't get why we have to lose our jobs, freedoms for something restricted to elderly people and certain groups

Schools and hospital wards were closing in March due to staff shortages arising from huge numbers of staff (not necessarily elderly/vulnerable) who were off sick with suspected Covid or isolating.

That DOES effect everyone else!

@Lou0808

I have not missed your point though have I.... you posted this to me:

And people like you will have the country right back to square one as you'd clearly rather do your own thing than that which is being advised!!

People like me! Well funny that because I haven't had people crammed into my home or any of the other things that you are shrieking about. So stop saying people like me .... YOur post above was in reply to me and directed at me... stop JUDGING it is rather annoying when people like you judge - it really doesn't help anyone.

I won't bother replying again, just urge you to calm down a bit don't judge your MIL for having her daughter over and pointing the finger at others and making stupid comments to ME about what you think I am doing. I will put down your judgemental comments to having a young child and fear for her. Just stay off social media and leave your MIL alone - one hopes you don't direct your comments about her to her family!

Each of us has to judge what we will risk. if someone is under 20 with no older or vulnerable relatives or friends, they can afford to party.

What about how they'll spread it to others, in shops, in the workplace, in pubs, etc? If they don't follow rules, then that's no fair on everyone they'll come into contact with. Especially with the way people are lying and saying they're following the rules when they're not.