When kids go back in September, should schools stay open till 4pm

[Lardlizard]

To allow kids to catch up and allow workers to catch up on work

@Greenandcabbagelooking

If I finish teaching at 4pm, then I might be leaving school at 5pm on a good day. It takes me 45 minutes to get my my child’s primary school, where wrap around care finishes at 5:30pm. I would need that to stay open until 6pm, or even 6:30pm to give me safety net in case of traffic, meetings, or other issues.

Which would,mean paying for 2.5 more hours of care a day, 12.5 hours a week, which means it’s even less worth me working, so I’d leave and you child would have no teacher.

Not to mention the fact I really don’t think my just turned 4 year old would cope in school/care from 7:30 - 6:30 every day.

In the nicest possible way this is what most working parents contend with each day in terms of hours.

@twinkletoesimnot is it so difficult for you to understand that some parents work full time? Not that we "don't want to look after our own children".

Also there’s lots of talk of the teacher shortage but certainly in our area we’ve had lots of applications from teachers lately. Maybe they are all leaving the schools you refer to !

No. Many children have to travel more than an hour to one of my children's secondary schools.

The school is not in a great area and travelling in the dark, waiting for buses etc would not be as safe. This would be especially tricky in the winter. The school.already finishes pre 3pm to accommodate this.

My view on this is that it depends on what needs to be achieved to be honest. And that needs to be established through a consistent assessment and honest reflection on the part of every school as to who needs what help and why. But it shouldn’t be framed as some kids being kept back as a way of making up like a punishment, the work that’s needed should be incorporated earlier into the school day and some of the non-academic activities pushed back later into the day.

and allow workers to catch up on work

Can you explain why you think teachers should work an extra 5 hours each week in order to provide you with free childcare?

No. I want DS to catch up with after school activities - cubs, swimming, football, playing in the park - he's missed out on these more over lockdown than he has missed out on some aspects of the curriculum.

Life is already full enough without extra time in school.

Nope.

Secondary yes.
Primary no.

No.
I work 3 days a week and get a couple of hours out of class weekly. I have a meeting until 4:30 every Monday and another every other Wednesday.
I have to leave work at 5:15 at the very latest to collect my own child from nursery.
In the time left I need to-
Mark on average 120 books (30 children x4 subjects per day) to a high standard and giving feedback that children can respond to.
Ensure that planning and resources are ready for the next days teaching.
Make sure that the continuous provision in my classroom is appropriate and high quality, well resourced and ready to go.
Display children's work nicely.
Feedback to parents.
Mark and set homework.
Complete tasks for my own subject leadership area. E.g writing reports
Action anything additional set in meetings.
Assess children's learning.
Brief my TA.
Untold other bits and pieces.

I already take home work. When would you like me to fit an extra hour every day in?

The extra hour would be Directed Time, so you’d have to have shorter terms. Or more PPA time (who would cover that?) Or make contract changes on a massive scale (unlikely to happen soon, if at all).

If the teachers are willing, able and paid to work longer then yes.

My kids will need a massive amount of support going forward, one has been in tears and stressed every day, the other has done no work at all. I'd like to think the government will throw money at it but I'm not holding my breath.

I am old and my secondary school used to finish at 3.50 anyway (with a very long lunch-break).

What would people prefer? Short lunchbreak and finish earlier or longer lunchbreak and finish later?

I doubt there will be extra-curricular activities until at least January so it could be feasible to extend the school day by one lesson, at least temporarily and even if only for Y10 and 12. Makes for a long day though - for students and school staff.

No. We finish at 3.35 pm anyway. But it then takes 25 minutes for buses to take them away and after that meetings start. So in reality you'd be extending the day in other ways also. I'm sure we will continue offering lunchtime interventions and holiday catch ups like normal. ( which all seem pointless this year with regards to year 11 ). Plus who pays for this ?

DC’s primary school already do similar 8:45-3:45pm, so an extra 15 mins wouldn’t be much of a push for them. But they do get an extra 15 mins playtime in the afternoon and that final 45 mins is easy in them (usually some type of reading time, carpet time, show and tell).

No. Children have been through such an upheaval and deserve for things to return to normal as soon as is possible. Yes there are lots of children who have missed out and it needs addressing, but some children have worked bloody hard. Mine have done all school work, plus the bbc bitesize stuff, plus some extra. They will really benefit from a summer break and then normal (or as normal as is possible) school hours. What about the teachers? They're on their knees.

Ds is autistic, he struggles to make it to the end of the school day as it is due to exhaustion from his medical conditions. Having longer days would inevitably make his attendance even worse.

Has has full time 1-1 to get through the school day so any changes to hours would also require changing to the EHC and subsequent funding for thousands of children to ensure that support was in place

If the teachers are willing, able and paid to work longer then yes.

Right, well that's that idea stymied then.

If parents want this extra time, would you be willing to pay for it either through taxes, paying for it like an after school club or voluntary contribution?

A HT I know is convinced more schools will soon have to ask for regular contributions from parents just to have the basics in schools as budgets are so dire.

Here’s a suggestion - hear me out.

Unemployment is going to spike significantly once furlough ends. There’s a real opportunity for some innovative ideas for people who lose their jobs.

What if the govt was to create eg 10 extra TA posts in schools on temporary contracts for the year ahead, meaning that children can be split better into ability suited breakout groups and given more focus. It might save a few people from long term unemployment and also mean that some TAs choose to stay in teaching for the longer term.

You’d ideally put newer TAs with younger groups and direct the more experienced teaching assistance towards higher age groups where teaching is more complex

And where has the OP gone?
Surely she might wait around to see the responses to her pressing question?

She only posted an hour and 15 mins ago! Maybe she’s getting ready for work, or travelling to work, or preparing her materials to homeschool her children for the day...

Yes. And primary teachers are not working 60 hours a week, don’t be ridiculous

Antihop not at all, as I do myself.....