How/when did the tide turn on schools?

[LaceCurtains]

In the beginning the mood here was almost desperate calling for schools to be closed.

In the last week or so there's been a marked shift to getting them open (from peope here).

Is it the same people who wanted the closed, now calling for them to get back to normal or have the original campaigners gone quiet/new people got louder?

FWIW I always thought schools closed as early as they did because of public pressure and it seems to me that "other" things are getting back to normal more quickly than originally planned/expected (because of DC and the need to distract?) but schools don't seem to be included in that.

I'm at a loss as to why schools are being treated so differently. I'm SLT in school, if that makes a difference and the government guidance is a shambles. Changes daily but doesn't seem to have any clear aim.

What I'm sick of is people posting on mumsnet with their complaints about specific teachers and schools when it doesn't apply to the majority of teachers or schools. It does nothing but create ill will towards school staff who are doing their best during this crisis (often while caring for families of their own)

The sheer amount of parents posting on MN shows that it's not a tiny minority. It seems to be quite the widespread issue.

I'm sure that a lot of schools and teachers are doing an excellent job. A lot quite clearly arent.

Just because one schools doing great doesn't negate other people's experience. The default response to struggling parents is oh speak to your school. Like you think they're so thick they haven't thought about that.

Even the best online or part time learning isn't enough. It isn't a proper education and we cannot pretend that it is.

I really despair that these threads turn in to parents vs teachers when collaboration achieves so much more.

I know school are following guidance, but it is just guidance.
Some are really working to rule not even supervising key workers kids when they do their work that others would do at home.

My kids have had that level of support from their schools as they know it's in the kids interest to do so.

My very close teacher friend refused to agree with her head teacher who was trying to insist she shouldn't help kids in for key workers sessions as it was just childcare.
She told him that was ridiculous and not in the best interest of the pupils.

@mintandcoral I don't have childcare of my own so I don't know how it would be manageable for me but I can't speak for other teachers.

Well your children would be in school themselves?

I don't see how it's feasible to expect teachers (and children) to work over the summer.

Me neither.

All efforts now must be on making sure there is a full return to education for all children in September.

@TrustTheGeneGenie I agree, the best online learning or part time learning isn't enough. Of course it isn't, but its also the reality of the situation we are in. That the world is in. Teachers and schools aren't to blame for it! We haven't closed and stayed shut voluntarity. Why are we being attacked and criticised for schools not yet being fully open? It's not our decision to make. People are talking about marching. Marching against what exactly? The virus preventing schools from opening?

I'm genuinely sorry some people have had such differing and bad experiences with online learning from their schools but, like I said earlier, going on about it online only creates ill will towards all school staff. We can't solve your issues, only your school can. It's not productive.

I agree. I think childcare needs to be available over summer, clubs that would ordinarily run. And then school ft in September.

@Nighttimefreedom they are 1 and our nursery has not reopened, I don't even know if its going to survive.

Yes and some of the 2m unemployed and students could be paid to run a school holiday 8 - 6pm club Monday to Friday at every state school all summer for example so working parents have no childcare issues and those carry on in September until every child is back in full time school and before and after schoolclubs too.

To the poster who said if we cared about the kids we would go against government policy - that's a ridiculous suggestion to make.

If I work on a building site and decide to ignore the policies surrounding safe working and health and safety and died or injured myself as a result - do you think they would pay out for that? Or support me?

Or would they instead fall back and say they put the policy in place for a reason and it's my own fault I chose not to follow it so oh well, your problem.

Teachers and schools aren't to blame for it! We haven't closed and stayed shut voluntarity. Why are we being attacked and criticised for schools not yet being fully open? It's not our decision to make. People are talking about marching. Marching against what exactly? The virus preventing schools from opening?

Against the government's decision presumably. They have a choice to open schools fully and they're not.

Teachers aren't to blame. I've never said they are.

What doesn't help is a very small minority of teachers and ex teachers on MN spouting horrible shite about children and parents. Do I think you're all like that? Course not. Does it still make me angry? Yes very much so. It gives other, good teachers a bad name that they don't deserve.

Saying "take it up with school" is seriously unhelpful because 99% will have done that.

Xenia that's actually a sensible suggestion. If the government got themselves together NOW, they could run DBS checks, employ managers to run hubs of some sort and arrange it with schools.

My school would allow the use of the building over the summer but wouldn't staff it with usual members of staff as we are all off during this time.

What would need to be clear though is that this would be childcare and only that - if the complaints about schools sending home substandard work are anything to go by, I'm not sure putting people who are not qualified to teach would have any better outcome.

@TrustTheGeneGenie I haven't seen any threads of teachers spouting 'horrible shite' about children or parents actually! I'm sorry that you have. We say 'take it up with the school' because there is nothing else we can say or do. I don't know what you want or expect. Like I have said, repeatedly, it's very unproductive.

@TrustTheGeneGenie what else can we say though?

Parents are complaining and I really can't do anything to help them with their particular school other than say take it up with the head, chair of governors or pull your child out and see if you can move schools.

What else do these posters want us to say or do?

I'm sorry this is happening in some schools and I wish it wasn't, but I'm generally working all the time at the moment (currently on a 30 min break) and am fed up of people lumping us all in the same boat.

Boris clearly stated yesterday that its government policy so why people are still complaining about teachers is beyond me. People are now suggesting we ignore the policy.

Really?! Is that what it's come to?!

There have been loads. Some on this thread I think.

I think people just want to moan about it to other people in the same situation. I don't think any of us are expecting another mner to solve our problems but being able to talk about it (without being shot down!) Helps.

Why do you think anyone is expecting you to do anything about it? Were not!

@TrustTheGeneGenie I fully agree.

Therefore posters need to clearly state their particular school is shit and say they are unhappy with THAT school or staff there.

What tends to happen is they lump us all in the same boat with sweeping generalisations such as "what are the bloody teachers doing? Why are they getting paid? Why are they all sat at home on their arses doing nothing? Why are some shielding - get them back to work or fire them?!"

Of course those of us who are NOT doing the above or those who are shielding as that's what they have been told to do will be pissed off.

*At the very least, schools should remain open for keyworker kids and start actually teaching them.

Not all teachers would need to be in - presumably the same as now and work on a similar rota , 2 days a week or whatever.

I really hope the unions/labour support this , this is almost exactly the best cause they could get behind , who could argue against it?- it will be interesting to watch and see what I hear the Unions say on this and will tell me exactly whose side they are on.*

In my school we are teaching keyworker kids, they're getting a better deal than those at home because it's full on teaching of the material that the other kids are doing at home.

The point of the opposition party is to point out things they disagree with. It has zero effect on government policy.

The point of unions is to protect their members. It has zero effect on government policy.

As for the summer, I'm only in one day a week on a rota. I volunteered to do this over Easter and was not paid for it, or given time in lieu.I will not volunteer to do it over the summer. If I'm forced to do it I would expect to be paid. We're paid to teach for 190 days + inset days. So if you expect extra days teaching you need to pay me for them. I'm not on holiday now, I'm still teaching, it's just remotely.

If childcare is needed over the summer then the government needs to fund it and non-teaching staff need to be paid to do it.

So why come on and complain then and then in the complaint make sweeping generalisations?

There's no point to those threads then.

Xenia - that's a great idea for the summer and is hopefully what will happen. Surely it can't happen in September though because the buildings will be in use by the kids being taught?

I'd be more than happy to offer some home learning support to those posters if that's what they were asking for but that's not the case.

There are never any posts asking for support from those of us who are continuing to fulfil our role and are going above and beyond.

If there were I'd guarantee the poster would have a lot of people offering support.

@BertNErnie

So why come on and complain then and then in the complaint make sweeping generalisations?

There's no point to those threads then.

Ffs. Who are you the thread police?

People are allowed to complain whether you like it or think it's pointless or not.

What would need to be clear though is that this would be childcare and only that.

Well hopefully they would be a great deal more than that - they should offer proper opportunities to socialise with peer group, a chance to learn new skills, be involved in physical activity.

Children need a summer to be children and not disease vectors shunned by society.

It shouldn't be school over the summer, the teachers need their holidays if they are going to come back ready to take on the enormous work of catching pupils up next year.

But it should still be fun and not "just childcare".

@TrustTheGeneGenie

You earlier posted:

"What doesn't help is a very small minority of teachers and ex teachers on MN spouting horrible shite about children and parents. Do I think you're all like that? Course not. Does it still make me angry? Yes very much so. It gives other, good teachers a bad name that they don't deserve."

So then don't complain about the attitudes of teachers when they quite rightly get pissed off with those posters who are moaning and making the sweeping generalisations over over and over again!

Anyway, I have a CIC review meeting so my break is up!

So then don't complain about the attitudes of teachers when they quite rightly get pissed off with those posters who are moaning and making the sweeping generalisations over over and over again!

The vile remarks weren't in response to anyone making sweeping generalisations.